Editor’s Notes: In this episode of Judging Freedom, Judge Andrew Napolitano is joined by former CIA analyst Larry Johnson to discuss the escalating tensions between the United States and Iran. Johnson provides a critical analysis of President Trump’s recent military maneuvers, characterizing the potential deployment of “boots on the ground” as a high-risk mission with devastating economic and geopolitical consequences. The conversation delves into the complexities of the Strait of Hormuz, the role of intermediaries like Pakistan, and the historical context of U.S. involvement in the Middle East. Together, they examine the rhetoric coming from the White House and Capitol Hill, questioning the strategic objectives and the human cost of a potential conflict. (March 30, 2026)
TRANSCRIPT:
“Undeclared wars are commonplace. Tragically, our government engages in preemptive war, otherwise known as aggression, with no complaints from the American people. Sadly, we have become accustomed to living with the illegitimate use of force by government. To develop a truly free society, the issue of initiating force must be understood and rejected.”
Introduction
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: What if sometimes to love your country, you had to alter or abolish the government? What if Jefferson was right? What if that government is best which governs least? What if it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong? What if it is better to perish fighting for freedom than to live as a slave? What if freedom’s greatest hour of danger is now?
Hi, everyone. Judge Andrew Napolitano here for Judging Freedom. Today is Monday, March 30, 2026. Larry Johnson will be with us in just a moment on President Trump’s suicide mission of boots on the ground.
Witkoff and Kushner: Credibility as Negotiators
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Larry Johnson. Welcome here, my dear friend. I know you’ve been traveling. Thank you for accommodating our schedule. Before we get to boots on the ground — Witkoff and Kushner, are they regarded as respected and credible negotiators for the US by international diplomats?
LARRY JOHNSON: No, no. They’ve distinguished themselves as a couple of real estate shills. They’re not to be trusted. They destroyed their credibility, particularly with this last round in Geneva.
We go back to February 26th. The Iranians were basically pretty upbeat. They thought, “Hey, we made some progress.” The Omani intermediator, who was playing telephone tag with each of these guys — he’d listen to Witkoff and Kushner, and then he’d go talk to the Iranians. So he was ferrying messages back and forth. He was very upbeat. He said, “We’ve made progress. There’s an agreement at hand.”
And then Witkoff and Kushner just sort of led him on — “All right, we’ll see you Monday. We’ll be there Monday to talk.” And instead, the United States showed up on Saturday with Tomahawk missiles. And then, besides killing the Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, murdered 175 young girls. That right there is unforgivable. It is the unforgivable sin.
Iran’s Position: No Interest in Compromise
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Does Iran have any interest in compromising with the United States? They seem to be in the catbird seat now. Why would they? Even as Trump claims—
LARRY JOHNSON: Yeah, he’s got to stop imagining that this is like a real estate deal — “Hey, I want to pay a million and you want to pay 500,000. Let’s split the difference and make it 750,000.” No, it’s not one of those negotiations.
This is now fundamentally about the continued existence of Iran. The recognition that no matter what Iran has tried to do over the course of 47 years, it’s never been enough. Because the United States was not going to accept the fact that Iran, along with Cuba, represented probably the only two countries in the world that have overthrown color revolutions or overthrown CIA efforts to replace or control governments. Never forgiven them for that.
And instead, we keep this continued pack of lies about Iran being this unrelenting, radical aggressor, intent on destroying and killing others. They haven’t invaded one damn country in 47 years. The US can’t say that. The US has a long list of invading and overthrowing other countries. So it’s just one lie upon another.
So, no. At this point, Iran made it very clear — the US out of the Persian Gulf, all sanctions lifted, and reparations paid. Those are the basic minimums. That’s their starting position, and there’s no flexibility there. There’s not like saying, “Oh, okay, well, we’ll let the United States have one base.” Why does the United States need a base in the Persian Gulf? There’s only one reason — to attack Iran.
Congressman Jim Himes: “He’s Flat Out Lying”
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Here’s Congressman Jim Himes, Democrat of Connecticut. He’s not just a Democrat that doesn’t like the President. He is the ranking Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee and, under federal law, is one of the Gang of Eight. And under the same law, is supposed to be briefed by the White House — or it could be the Pentagon, the executive branch — on all significant undertakings with respect to war, intelligence, and negotiations. Watch this.
VIDEO CLIP BEGINS:
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: You said that the President’s not really negotiating with Iran. Is that because you haven’t been briefed as a member of Congress on the diplomacy, or you think he’s flat out lying?
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Oh, I think he’s flat out lying. Last Sunday, when he was told — and by the way, we’re in exactly the same position today. Oil prices now $112 a barrel, and futures, with the stock market down 2%, last Sunday he realized, “Oh my God, I’ve got a financial cataclysm on Monday.” So he just made it up that they’re in negotiations with the Iranians.
Look underneath that statement. The Iranians have now realized that they have the reins. They are controlling the Strait of Hormuz. Gasoline prices are up more than a dollar a gallon.
And so the Iranians realize, “Holy smokes, we’ve got a lot of leverage here.”
VIDEO CLIP ENDS:
LARRY JOHNSON: Yeah. Hey, it’s good to see one politician speaking some truth.
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: So the answer to the question — are the United States and Iran negotiating? The answer is no.
Iran’s Resilience and the Pattern of US Aggression
LARRY JOHNSON: Yeah, I mean, it’s just as Alistair said. I saw Alistair earlier today, and he had it exactly right. Pakistan’s trying to play an intermediary, and the Saudis are going to talk to the Pakistanis. The Egyptians are there talking to the Pakistanis. And I guess earlier today, Al-Sisi made a plea to Trump — “Please, please, stop this war in the Middle East.”
But the United States tries to pass messages to Iran, and Iran picks and chooses what it’s going to listen to or respond to. It will give its messages to Pakistan. But Iran’s not in a position of saying, “Oh, the pain. We can’t stand the pain.”
US policymakers — if you want to call them that — forget that for 10 years, Iran fought a vicious war against Iraq. And I call it vicious because the US backed Iraqis, the US supplied Iraqis with chemical weapons that were used against Iran. They endured that. They endured hundreds of thousands of deaths and a million injuries — people wounded in combat and because of the chemical weapon excess.
So they’ve got a history. They look back on this. This has been a pattern of the United States. It’s not Iran that’s sponsoring terrorists in the United States that are going around assassinating our leading financial figures, political figures, and scientists. No, that’s the United States. That’s what the United States is doing. And I wish to God my fellow American citizens would understand this. We need to look in the mirror and recognize we’re the ones with the blood on our hands.
How Many Combat Troops Has Trump Deployed?
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: How many combat troops has Trump introduced into the Middle East in the past two weeks? Do we know?
LARRY JOHNSON: No, we don’t. We know that they’ve confirmed that the 82nd Airborne was ordered deployed. I don’t know where they were deployed to, where they’re currently based. There is one Marine Expeditionary Unit with about 2,500 Marines somewhere on station. I heard that they were at Diego Garcia. So they’re in the general neighborhood, but they’re really not in a position to do anything yet.
The 11th MEU out of California is still en route. There was a large contingent — I don’t know the precise number — but there were 46 flights from the United States from bases that cater to special operations forces. Those flew to three bases: one in Israel, two in Jordan.
So, they already claim there are like 50,000 US military personnel in the area, but those are not necessarily combat troops. But they are moving forces. Trump is moving forces forward, and the intent appears to be to carry out some sort of insane ground operation.
Trump’s Latest Threat: Obliterating Iran’s Infrastructure
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Here’s Trump’s latest threat, as of 7:30 this morning, Monday, March 30th:
“The United States of America is in serious discussions with A NEW AND MORE REASONABLE REGIME to end our military operations in Iran. Great progress has been made. But if for any reason a deal is not shortly reached — which it probably will be — and if the Hormuz Strait is not immediately open for business, we will conclude our lovely stay in Iran by blowing up and completely obliterating all of their electric generating plants, oil wells and Karg Island, and possibly all desalination plants, which we have purposely not ‘yet.’ This will be in retribution for our many soldiers and others that Iran has butchered and killed — the old regime’s 47-year reign of terror. Thank you for your attention to this matter. President Donald Trump.”
What is he talking about? Retribution for Americans killed in the past 47 years by Iran?
“He Needs to Be 25th Amendmented”
LARRY JOHNSON: We need an intervention. Look, he’s attributing the bombing of the Marine barracks in October of 1983 to Iran — blaming them on that — ignoring the United States’ own responsibility for the previous month, having shelled, using destroyers and cruisers to shell into the Bekaa Valley to kill Shia Muslims. That attack on the Marines was a retaliation for us killing Muslims.
Iran never started off saying, “Let’s just go kill Americans because we hate them for their freedom or their religion.” No, it’s always been a reaction to what we’ve been doing. We invade Iraq illegally in 2003. Then Shia militia began using roadside bombs to kill US troops. They blame Iran for that. Except the fact of the matter is Iran learned how to build those bombs courtesy of US Green Beret Special Forces back in the 1960s and early 1970s.
But here’s where somebody really needs to grab Trump. He needs to be 25th Amendmented, if that’s the correct phrase. Because listen to what he’s saying. Two weeks ago, they lift all sanctions on Iranian oil. Why? Because he’s trying to stabilize the price of Iranian oil — trying to increase the supply of oil in the world. And now his prescription is, “We’re going to blow up all of the Iranian oil wells and cut off all their supply.” Oh, okay, yeah, that makes sense.
So now you’re going to exacerbate the economic problems the world’s facing — apart from the fact that Iran has vowed, and they’ve been very clear, that if you attack our power centers, we’re going to attack and destroy all of those in the Persian Gulf.
And in fact, the United States and Israel, within the last 36 hours, did launch an attack on one of the power centers, power grids in and around Tehran. Then, lo and behold, within an hour or two, Iran was responding by blowing up similar systems in the Persian Gulf. Iran’s not messing around.
And so this drama queen that Donald Trump has become — it’s just completely disorienting, because he takes both sides of an issue.
What Would Boots on the Ground Look Like?
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Yeah. What would boots on the ground look like, Larry? What would their goal be? Would a goal be militarily achievable? Or is this just some sort of a negotiating ploy — “We’ve got all our troops ready to invade, so you better cave”?
The Military Impossibility of Taking Kharg Island
LARRY JOHNSON: Well, for some in the Trump administration, I’m sure it’s a negotiating ploy. Let’s try to intimidate, put pressure on Iran and maybe they’ll cave. They won’t. But that’s the thinking.
But the other thought is that they’ve really convinced themselves that, boy, if we take Kharg Island and turn off and we take control of the oil, that’s what Trump has said himself, that that will fix the problem. Well, no, it won’t.
Number one, putting troops on Kharg Island — we may, and I’ll emphasize may, be able to insert troops there. It’d be very difficult. It’s not going to be done through an amphibious landing because the ships carrying the Marines would have to sail up through the Strait of Hormuz and they’ll be blown out of the water before they get there.
So that means they’d have to be inserted via a parachute drop. Well, that’s not the Marines. The Marine Corps, some are parachute qualified, but they as a force are not equipped to do that. So that means the 82nd Airborne or the 75th Ranger Battalions — there are two of them that have been deployed — that they might do that.
But then, okay, you’ve got control of Kharg for a day, a two — you’ve got thousands of Iranians on that island. They’re going to fight back. Then the United States, as they start fighting back, will be killing a lot of civilians, which is, unfortunately, become a disgusting habit of ours.
How do we resupply? They’re going to rely upon some C-130 or C-141 aircraft to come in to drop supplies, but those are relatively slow flying, and they will be easy targets for air defense that Iran still has, despite Trump’s claims to the contrary.
So it’s not really a clear military objective. And even if you take Kharg Island, all that’s going to do is affect part of Iran’s ability to pump and deliver oil. It doesn’t do a single thing to open the Strait of Hormuz. And opening the Strait of Hormuz right now is the critical issue this week.
We’re in the fifth week of the war. Some people in Asia particularly have begun to feel the pain. But the real pain — the economic pain, the international chaos that’s resulting from it — that’s going to really start surfacing this week. People will begin to understand just how serious and how dangerous this is in terms of the global economy. Whether economists have not officially defined it yet, but we are in a recession, and the danger is that recession can become a depression, which means a 10% drop in economic growth.
The Bitter Irony of the Strait of Hormuz
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Oh, boy. Such bitter irony. Regime change is no longer their goal. Destruction of Iran’s ballistic missiles — no longer their goal. Their goal is opening up the Strait of Hormuz, which was totally open before the war before he started all this.
LARRY JOHNSON: Yeah.
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: For the war before he started all this.
LARRY JOHNSON: Well, and in fact, I don’t know if Iran had ever sat down and calculated, “Hey, if we want to break this cycle of Israel in particular attacking us and assassinating our leaders, what we should do is take the Strait of Hormuz, close it down, and then we can operate it like a toll booth. You have to pay a toll to come in and out.” I don’t know if they’d ever really thought that through thoroughly, but they now understand.
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Right. And they understand how lucrative that is for them.
LARRY JOHNSON: Correct. It is one way to compensate for the international economic sanctions that the West — particularly the United States and Europe — have imposed on them.
Would Israel Join a Ground Invasion?
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Would a ground invasion involve Israeli troops, IDF troops, or just American?
LARRY JOHNSON: Oh, man, no. Israel’s got its hands full. Good Lord. Again, despite this mythology about how great the Israeli military is, they haven’t defeated Hamas in two and a half years. They’ve had an enclosed area five miles wide, 25 miles long. They’ve got 300,000 troops around it. Hamas doesn’t have lines of supply flowing in. They fought with what they’ve had, and Israel can’t beat them.
And now Israel, once again, with their arrogance, their hubris, they’ve launched into southern Lebanon. “Oh, yeah, we’re going to push up to the Litani River and we’re going to wipe out Hezbollah.” Nope. The ones getting wiped out are the Israeli troops. They don’t have troops to deploy.
American Troops on the Ground: Morale and Casualties
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Wow. I wonder how American troops — I know these guys are well trained and gung ho, and they’re decent human beings — feel about fighting a war for a foreign country.
LARRY JOHNSON: The scuttlebutt — because soldiers, Marines, sailors, they talk — there’s actually an interesting piece on TikTok. A stripper from one of the clubs near one of the military bases was talking about what the troops are telling her, and they’re not a happy group. They feel that they’re fighting a war that’s so unnecessary. And they were like, “Let’s eat, drink, and be merry, for tomorrow we die.”
Trump and his team have been effective up to this point in covering up the casualties. The casualties are significant, but they’re not getting talked about. They’re being hidden from the public as best they can.
But if Trump goes ahead and authorizes the deployment of U.S. troops — whether it’s to Bandar Abbas or Qeshm or the Hormuz Island that’s right there in the Strait of Hormuz, or on Kharg Island, or all of the above — there are going to be significant KIA, dead Americans, as well as severely wounded.
And unlike in Afghanistan and Iraq, the United States had what they call the “golden hour.” You could be wounded severely with a life-threatening wound, but they were able to get you out into a hospital within an hour. That won’t happen there, because just trying to get helicopters into those places — they’re going to be under fire. Iran’s got drones, they’ve got missiles. They still have enormous capability to retaliate. And so then you’ll get air crews that have been downed and killed.
Secretary Rubio on Good Morning America
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Wow. And not to ruin your breakfast, Larry, but here’s Senator — no, it’s not Senator Graham.
LARRY JOHNSON: Oh, thank God. Oh my God.
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: I wouldn’t do that this early in the day. Secretary Rubio on Good Morning America this morning, really, really over the top with an apocalyptic vision of all this. Watch this.
VIDEO CLIP BEGINS:
MARCO RUBIO: I think the first point the president makes is he prefers diplomacy, as I said. There are messages being raised back and forth, some conversations going on, including through intermediaries. And he always prefers that.
Look, if the Iranian regime had come forward at any point in the past and said, “We’re going to walk away from our nuclear ambitions, we’re going to do nuclear energy the way every other country in the world — primarily almost every other country in the world — does it, and that is through a peaceful means in which you bring in the fuel and it’s supervised and so forth. We’re not going to stop supporting terrorist groups across the region.”
Look at this region. Every single terrorist group in this region has a link to the Iranian regime. Every single one — the Houthis, Hezbollah, Hamas, the Shia militias that are attacking everyone out of Iraq. Every single one of these groups and all the destabilization in this region tracks directly back to the Iranian regime.
Those things have to be addressed. And if Iran had been willing to address those in the past, we wouldn’t be having this interview on this topic right now. Their refusal to do so and their continuing move towards one day acquiring a nuclear capability — these people are lunatics. They are insane. They are religious zealots who can never be allowed to possess a nuclear weapon because they have an apocalyptic vision of the future. And all of their neighbors know that, by the way, which is why all of their neighbors have been supportive of the efforts we’re conducting.
VIDEO CLIP ENDS:
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: This doesn’t apply to Smotrich and Ben-Gvir and Netanyahu.
Rubio’s Claims: A Rebuttal
LARRY JOHNSON: The lies that Marco — “Narco” — Rubio just told are off the charts. The only crazed operators that have been engaged in supporting terrorism in the Middle East is us. Al-Julani — anybody remember that? Hayat Tahrir al-Sham, one of the top 10 terrorist groups. And the majority of terrorism — 90% of the terrorism, according to the State Department, which Rubio ought to read the damn reports — is carried out by Sunni terrorists.
In fact, Iran has been fighting ISIS, fighting Al-Qaeda, fighting Al-Nusra, because those radical Sunnis were attacking and killing Shia. That’s number one.
Number two, Iran has been a signatory to the Non-Proliferation Treaty. Iran was allowing nuclear inspectors into its nuclear facilities. Israel does not. Israel is not a signatory to the NPT. Israel doesn’t allow outside inspections, and Israel’s got the bomb.
So this kind of projection and attempt to demonize Iran for the very things that Israel and the United States are doing is sick.
Closing Remarks
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Wow. Thank you, Larry. Your analysis is so valuable, particularly in all the military aspects of this. You have a good week. We’ll see you on Good Friday. We’ll see you for the roundtable.
LARRY JOHNSON: I hope we survive till then. Yes.
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO: Thank you, Larry. All the best.
LARRY JOHNSON: Thank you. Thank you.
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