Meeting The Enemy: A Feminist Comes to Terms with the Men’s Rights Movement by Cassie Jaye (Transcript)

Cassie Jay

Here is the full transcript of Cassie Jaye’s Talk on The Enemy: A Feminist Comes to Terms with the Men’s Rights Movement at TEDxMarin conference. 

Cassie Jaye – American film director

In 2013, I decided to meet my enemies. I was a 27-year-old, award-winning documentary filmmaker and a proud feminist.

And I was determined to expose the dark underbelly of the men’s rights movement. At that point, all I knew of the men’s rights movement was from what I’d read online, that it’s a misogynistic hate group actively working against women’s equality.

Well, the vast majority of my previous work was about women’s issues. I directed documentaries about reproductive rights, single motherhood, and the need for more girls to get into STEM education. So when I learned that no one had ever documented the men’s rights movement in a film before, I saw it as an opportunity to continue fighting for women’s equality by exposing those preventing it.

So for one year, I traveled North America meeting the leaders and followers of the men’s rights movement. I spent anywhere from two hours up to eight hours, interviewing each individual men’s rights activist, also known as MRA, and I filmed 44 people total. And there is an important rule in documentary filmmaking. As an interviewer, you do not interrupt. So I’m asking questions, and I’m getting their full life story.

And in the moment, I didn’t realize it, but now looking back I can see, that while I was conducting my interviews, I wasn’t actually listening. I was hearing them speak, and I knew the cameras were recording, but in those moments of sitting across from my enemy, I wasn’t listening. What was I doing? I was anticipating. I was waiting to hear a sentence, or even just a couple of words in succession that proved what I wanted to believe: that I had found the misogynist. The ground zero of the war on women.

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A couple of times, I thought I had it. There was one men’s rights activist that said to me, “Just walk outside and look around, everything you see was built by a man.” Oh! That statement felt anti-women. I felt my jaw clench, but I sat quietly, as a documentarian should, while removing all the space between my upper and lower molars.

After my year of filming, I was reviewing the 100 hours of footage I had gathered, replaying and transcribing it, which believe me when I say no one will ever listen to you more than someone who transcribes your words. You should write that down.

So, I was typing out every word meticulously, and through that process, I began to realize that my initial knee-jerk reactions to certain statements weren’t really warranted, and my feeling offended did not hold up to intense scrutiny. Was that statement about men having built the skyscrapers and the bridges anti-women? I thought, well, what would be the gender-reverse scenario? Maybe a feminist saying: Just look around, everyone you see was birthed by a woman. Wow! That’s a powerful statement. And it’s true.

Is it anti-male? I don’t think so. I think it’s acknowledging our unique and valued contributions to our society. Well, luckily, while I was making The Red Pill movie, I kept a video diary which ended up tracking my evolving views, and in looking back on the 37 diaries I recorded that year, there was a common theme. I would often hear an innocent, valid point that a men’s rights activist would make, but in my head, I would add on to their statements, a sexist or anti-woman spin, assuming that’s what they wanted to say but didn’t.

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