Transcript: Epstein’s Niece Exposes ALL From Bill Clinton to Cult of Baal Exclusive with Anya Wick

My family masqueraded themselves as Jewish publicly, but behind closed doors, you know, at Passover dinners when I was drugged, would admit we are Satanists.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: So I am here with Anya Wick, Epstein’s niece, and I’ve been watching Anya on TikTok. The link for her TikTok is in the description box. So please support Anya’s work. And you know, my partner Jen has been really, just amazed by your story as well. Harrowing. A lot of it.

You know, there’s components in there. For example, Bohemian Grove and other extreme things that I’m sure will fascinate the viewers. But before we get to all that stuff, you know, viewers disclaimer, harrowing content warning. And because of restrictions on my channel and you, I’ve got to make sure you give us permission to publish this video on your way of your anonymity.

ANYA WICK: Of course. Of course.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Okay. So before we get then to what you’ve been through, do you want to just set the table a bit and let the viewers know what it was like for you growing up?

Growing Up as Anya Beth Epstein

ANYA WICK: Yes, of course. So my name is Anya Wick, but at birth I was Anya Beth Epstein. I was born in a house in Boulder. In 2015, I changed my name to Owen Theodore Epstein. In 2020, I changed it again to Anna Petrova. I had realized what I was surrounded by my entire life and thought I could hide from it. I married a man named Wick, kept that name, and decided to start going public with my story just a few months ago.

I had chemically driven amnesia the majority of my life. I am Jeff Epstein’s niece, and I was raised as a sex slave. My father had me separated from my mother and twin brother and administered a substance that was designed to sever my memory. Every time I was taken to or family vacation or trip to the cabin in the mountains, I was given this drug upon which everything would come flooding back. But when it wore off, so would the majority of my memories of it.

And I would try to go to school, perform with my bands, be a regular person. But it broke me. Subconsciously, I knew something was very wrong and I had internalized it on myself. And after attempts in 2015, I got away from the slavery I was in by taking testosterone, transitioning to male. I left Colorado in 2017 and started piecing together back memories I had assumed were only nightmares in about 2020.

That’s the very short version of my story. And Shaun, we could come at this from any angle, any plot point of time. In my autobiography, I invite you to just ask what you are curious about.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: So let’s slow it down then and just go back to the beginning again. How old were you when you first realized that things weren’t as they should be?

Early Awareness and False Identity

ANYA WICK: I had awareness of this in grade school. I remember my supposed 7th birthday was actually already 10 years old. Let me backtrack. My father and stepmother had a baby girl in 1991 who was raised by another family. 1998, they assigned me her birth date on my birth certificate, which they waited 10 years to file, claiming my stepmother was my biological mother, and finally put me in school in the gifted program, telling me I was tall.

I thought it was very strange that my mother was so callous with me. I knew it wasn’t normal that I wouldn’t let her touch me on the shoulder. And I felt worlds away from my peers. I remember in the first grade sitting there journaling. “I don’t feel seven. I feel much older. I feel at once like there’s something I’m missing that the rest of my classmates all understand and that I’ve lived a lot more than that.”

I remember being on the schoolyard talking with my few friends about what would it be like if you were tortured and didn’t know it. I got in trouble with my friend’s mother for drawing stick figures at a slumber party. Of course, it shouldn’t be the child’s fault if they’ve had exposure to anything like that. But I took the blame instead of my parents.

I always knew something was wrong. But because my regular life, you know, my parents were upstanding citizens. My father was a divorce attorney. My mother was on the PTA. I thought I was the problem. I had some memories I retained. But because of the nature of the substance I was on made that reality so different than my regular life. I thought these were nightmares, that I was sick and I didn’t tell anybody.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Why do you think your family got involved in these things?

The Cult of Baal and Generational Abuse

ANYA WICK: It goes back for generations. It goes back for generations. I remember my father confessing that my oldest brother is eight years younger than him. It’s cyclical with men, especially when they stifle it. They repeat the patterns. Which I don’t see as an excuse because I’m not. But, of course, this happens with men. And power and pressure to conform is excellent as a tool for silencing people.

They told me that we belonged to the Cult of Baal. B A apostrophe Al. They told me this with consistency while I was being abused. Now, what you can look up about the Cult of Baal information that is publicly available is that it is thousands of years old. It is a Phoenician, satanic fertility cult. And publicly it’s supposed to have been eradicated. But to my knowledge and my experience, it is not.

This is what people perceive the Illuminati to be. It is a group of elites that practices, forced and uses these crimes to control people. They happen to have a huge reach over politics and entertainment.

The Disney Connection

My great grandfather, according to my father, was Walt Disney before he moved to the United States. His name was Artur Bicke A R T U R B I C K E. And his twin sister, who he had children with, who I am descended from, was named Minnie. That’s where we get Mickey and Minnie Mouse. It’s very cute, right? Except for when you consider the abuse that I suspect is still happening to children who go into the entertainment industry. Children who are born into it.

My father was abused by his parents. And I was raised going to these giant where I would meet other children who were put on television. I was raised getting taken to Bohemian Grove where I was after a ceremonial corpse burning Alex Jones has talked about. And my memories of these circumstances are still somewhat fragmented. These assaults happened a couple times a month, and I’m blessed not to remember every detail.

But my father was consistent in what he told me. It’s hard for me to talk about. I want to just answer your questions honestly as my answers align with what I was told and what I have experienced. Now, this is alleged when birth certificates have been forged. It’s not something I can immediately research myself. All I have to go on is what lies in my memory of who I have met and what I was told.

Why the Cycle Continues

But to answer your basic question, why my family does this, because it was done to them. Because having one man bear as many children in a generation as possible and forcing them through these traumatic events, they believe it creates a stronger bond, that creates more loyalty, that it keeps people from talking. And for the most part, they’re right, because I’m the only one of my siblings who has directly spoken out about this.

There are people who have hinted at it in their music. Of course, Justin Bieber has talked about being assaulted by Usher and Justin Timberlake at P. Diddy’s parties. But I don’t think it’s coincidence they’ve only gone after Sean Combs and not his other alleged perpetrators who were born into the bloodline. There seems to be a level of protection for people who are simply born into that world contrasted with people like Sean Combs or R. Kelly who joined as adults.

But I was not in the boardrooms. I was a child on drugs. So I can’t tell you exactly who organizes this, exactly how it happens. It’s just speculation and memory.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: And, yeah, you’re a very powerful speaker and you’re very well researched, and we’ve had a lot of survivors come on and we salute you, you know, for the level of detail and knowledge that you have. I think it was David Icke who woke me up to the ancient cults and the bloodlines that continued to this, to these generations. And I think you’re the first survivor, perhaps, who’s actually detailed how that has continued over the ages. So if you could maybe expand on that a little bit, I think the viewers would find this fascinating.

ANYA WICK: What specifically would you like expanded on?

SHAUN ATTWOOD: So what was the cult that you. The. That you mentioned earlier?

ANYA WICK: The Ancient One, the cult of Baal B A?

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Yes.

The Truth About the Illuminati

ANYA WICK: Yeah, I know very little about it. My family masqueraded themselves as Jewish publicly, but behind closed doors, you know, at Passover dinners, when I was drugged would admit “we are Satanists.” Now, but I can understand the public has caught on to this. But they call them the Illuminati. And I find that interesting because Illuminati means illuminated.

I perceive the Illuminati, in fact to be individuals like yourself, other conspiracists like Alex Jones, even people like Kanye West who have been trying to illuminate people to this. I do not believe it is a unified organization, but a loose collection of individuals who are illuminated to the cult of Baal, who has successfully mythologized themselves as the Illuminati and convinced people that they are shape shifting reptilians.

You know, myths that can be perpetuated by the psychedelic nature of the tool that they use to abuse victims, which is used to delegitimize people who catch on to what they have been doing. And to be truthful, it was a reason I was anxious to come on here. You know, when people talk about seeing men turn into lizards, it makes everything seem a little bit more delegitimate.

Now, when someone has been given a powerful drug, their minds can experience something like that. They can witness something like that. And it’s something that kept me very confused as a child. I’m in the material world, in this plane. I’m being assaulted by my father, my uncles, my cousins. But my mind is somewhere else. My mind is going on this fantasy ride. And when I awake, I’m very confused.

I also believe there are people who have talked about these outlandish, metaphysical, impossible experiences intentionally to derail conversations about the cults and their power in media and politics.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: How prevalent are these Satanists in high society? And are they disguised?

Control of Media and Politics

ANYA WICK: Yes, they control so much more than I think even I can understand. I told you my father boasted that his grandfather was Walt Disney. Now I remember when Viacom bought Fox, but Fox held a hard line on not selling the news station. Steve raged and cried for a month because that would have been a full monopoly on the American news market.

I remember meeting all sorts of politicians, American and foreign and entertainers. And as far as that goes, I’m happy to answer honestly if you want to ask me about specific people, but I am very scared to name individuals if I am unprompted.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Yeah, if you say, if you say you’ve met somebody, there’s no legal consequences of that.

ANYA WICK: Okay.

Jeffrey Epstein’s Role in the Network

ANYA WICK: For your viewers across the pond, I do have fragments of memory of only once meeting the royals on the one trip I took with my family over to the UK, and it must have been 2005 or 2006. I can’t remember if it was the summer I went into the eighth grade or into the ninth grade.

I have met everyone who has been an American president in my lifetime, including Donald Trump, who I have to say looked like he was at a funeral when he was at the inauguration the second time around. I don’t think he wanted any part of it.

I have met the Kardashians, which is why I believe Kanye West has appeared to have gone off his rocker. I met Harvey Weinstein the same night I met Jeffrey and Ghislaine, and he wouldn’t make eye contact with me. He did not want to participate in the abuse of the small children. I believe that’s a man who is behaving as most Hollywood producers do – doesn’t make what he did with those actresses okay, but it looks to me like this is a man who has an easy scapegoat who wanted to expose what takes place with children in the industry and with our family.

There are a lot of people like that who have been vilified, and while they are not innocent, it’s like choose your evil. Jeffrey was not a hardcore – he was guilty for what he did to those teenagers. But my family ritualizes the abuse of three-year-olds, which Jeffrey was not privy to.

My twin brother was raised on the Disney Channel. That was painful for me. We were separated when we were four and I didn’t see him until he was on TV with the pilot episode in which he pimps out his sister for a trading card. There’s a sequence of shots where the words “royal tycoon” flash on screen, followed by a clip of the gross nerdy boy he tricked into going on a date with plunging himself into a baby’s crib.

And he’s been in the media for making trouble on sets and abusing his partners. I’m not saying his behavior is justified, but when you consider what someone like that goes through as a child and the separation issues that are put on them, it makes sense why abusive behavior is repeated. And, you know, I pray for him regularly.

I am anxious to talk about my siblings because they are victims. I want them to feel that it is safe for them to speak up. But I don’t want to feel like I am betraying them by naming them directly either. And I’ve already talked about on my TikTok channel – I’ve talked a little bit about the last time I saw my mama. Last time I saw my mother, I was getting assaulted by Larry, you know. It sounds like a comedy line almost, and I’ve used it as a comedy line. I enjoy my stand-up; it’s healing for me.

But I decided before coming on here I wasn’t going to – with few exceptions, I didn’t want to name anyone unless you asked me about them. I think there are a lot of people the public speculate on, and if you bring them up, I’m happy to talk about them.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Yeah, so I think the viewers would be very curious then about Jeffrey. And what’s your view on his role in the apparatus?

Jeffrey Epstein: A Pawn in a Larger System

ANYA WICK: My understanding is that he – you know, I met him in Aspen in 2007 and that was a reintroduction. You know, my father said, “Hey, remember your Uncle Jeffrey?” And Jeffrey said, “Hey, Anya, it’s great to see you again.” Ghislaine was there.

What they told me was that Jeffrey worked for Steven, and as I’ve said, he’s guilty for what he did to those teenage girls here in New York City and down in Florida and St. Andrews. But I do not believe he was in charge of orchestrating what has been going on in our family for generations.

With my experiences, I believe he wanted to talk more about the other parties involved. And I know he didn’t kill himself. I’m not sure whether they let him go and get plastic surgery and flee the country or if they did kill him. But I do believe he was a pawn and that his story blew up in the media to keep people from looking beyond him.

If Jeffrey was the one villain in charge of it, then, oh, he’s dead. It’s all over. Everything’s good now. And that leaves my father free to continue abusing three-year-olds and running Viacom from behind a veil while his paralegal runs his divorce practice, as he bragged about to me growing up.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: So you’re saying that Jeffrey wasn’t involved in the full-on occult practices. He was just part of a machine and then they just used him to make an example out of him?

ANYA WICK: He was involved in the full-on occult practices, but not necessarily of his own volition. I have memories of men being forced to assault me when they didn’t want to. I remember one man – this brilliant comedic actor actually has better dramatic work – my father’s screaming at him, telling him to penetrate me and he makes one thrust and backs away.

And my father gets outraged and says, “You’re going to come, you’re going to come.” And this poor man is crying throughout it and I’m barely conscious. Jeffrey may have been involved in the full-on occult practices, but he’s not one of the hardcore of this sickness where they are actually attracted to small children.

Ghislaine Maxwell’s Role

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Yeah, Lady C mentioned that as well about pedophile versus something. So in terms of Maxwell then, who do you think – what do you think her role was?

ANYA WICK: I think she enjoyed it much like my stepmother did. I think she is as guilty as Jeffrey was. But I didn’t know her very well. I don’t even remember a conversation with her. I remember seeing her. I think she got off on the power of it.

I think with men who engage in pedophilia, it’s more of a sickness that arises from their own abuse. Like my grandfather – my alleged grandfather, Walt’s son who worked for the CIA – allegedly faked his death to remove himself from my mother because he was so sickened by what he could not control doing to her.

I contrast that with my stepmother who delighted in abusing me and laughed at me when I was incapacitated by the drug they had me on and made fun of me drooling on myself, being unable to speak. I think with her and with Ghislaine, I’m certain they were abused as children themselves. But there’s a different kind of psychopathy that grows within them where they get off on the power of it and abetting in these acts to please their partners.

Now, Kari Epstein was more sexually attracted to me than she was to her husband, Stephen. But she did also do these things in order to stay in good graces with him, and that was more out of survival. Kari was a very broke cellist in her early adulthood with no familial support, whereas Ghislaine also comes from the aristocracy. She had access to her own funds independent of Jeffrey.

So I can’t speculate too much on what she gained from it out of psychopathic pleasure and sadism, a schadenfreude of sorts. But I’m not a doctor. She was not a large presence in my life. My speculation on her personality is primarily based on what I know about my stepmother.

MK Ultra Programming

SHAUN ATTWOOD: So would you say then that some of the techniques used on you would be classified under the MK Ultra program?

ANYA WICK: Yes, absolutely.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Could you explain that? Could you explain that for viewers who are not familiar with MK Ultra?

ANYA WICK: Okay. These drugs were administered to me when I was an infant. Macro doses were given every single time I was assaulted, and I was kept on micro doses the rest of the time in my waking life to maintain some control, some separation from my peers.

I actually didn’t realize until very recently that I was kept on micro doses – that I was kept on a small dose in my regular waking life. Upon analysis of what would happen when I went on school trips away from Denver for a few days at a time, we would take trips to Washington, D.C. or New York or California. On those trips, after three or four days, I would actually start getting along with my classmates, and they’d be amazed. They’d say, “Wait, Anya, you’re really cool and fun and we like hanging out with you.” And I would end up being the center of the group and not understand why suddenly I’m connecting socially.

But then we’d go back home, I’d see my family again, and the next time at school or at synagogue, I’d feel in my own weird little bubble again. So I was put on these large doses designed to knock me out when I was assaulted, small doses to keep me complacent the rest of the time.

What this did essentially was sever my memory. Everything that happened to me, everything that was boasted about to me that occurred on those large doses was locked away in what I thought was a nightmare fantasy world. I was primarily unconscious for the physical assaults. And if I was awake, I was so high I thought it was my own nightmares.

This ensured I wasn’t going to go telling anybody about it. This ensured I thought I was sick, you know. So when they paid a doctor to tell me that my PTSD responses, like jumping when my stepmother touched me, were bipolar, I believed that. I believed it was my fault.

When I went to rehab in 2015 and was diagnosed with PTSD, right off the bat, the doctors were frustrated with me because I couldn’t tell them what traumatized me. I was beating my head against the wall and all I had going on in my head – I was stuck on this idea that if I were born male, I would be happier because my experience of womanhood I knew subconsciously was slavery.

MK Ultra is the practice of creating slaves with the severed memory, many of whom were my siblings, who I only got to see at family reunions, who I would rush home from school to watch on TV.

The Twin Experiments and Trauma Bonds

ANYA WICK: Me are not the only twins. Most of us are separated. I think I’m one of the only unsuccessful experiments. What they do is they take one of the twins, make them a child star, and watch the other hone their craft independently so they can rise to the level to reunite with them as adults.

And it works because going through that trauma together, no one else can understand it. And that’s part of the reason why I’ve been so anxious to do this podcast. There’s still a door for me I can push open if I choose to stop exposing this industry where people who love me want to see me again. And they do love me.

I know I’m in a situation where I’m struggling right now, but they can’t call me up because that would be to acknowledge how we met each other, right? But they do love me.

I remember in high school, one of my younger brothers brought to one of the reunions this little metal card he made in his metal shop. Plus, engraved on one side was his name, and on the other was the name of my boyfriend. And he said, “I made this for you so you can try to remember. Hide this on you. Hide this in your underwear, in your bra, so you can find it when you get back to the house in Denver. Don’t let your parents see. Don’t let your brother see.”

And it works. After the drugs had worn off, I found this. And I remembered who those boys were to me. And I started packing up a bag so I could run away to Hollywood. But my younger brother found it and showed Kari, who gave me anesthesia and threw it away.

My family does this. The Cult of Baal does this. They do MK Ultra because forging these trauma bonds forges more loyalty. And 99 times out of a hundred victims will choose being with other victims over trying to speak, to eventually prevent there being more victims.

And I’m talking to you because the children who are going through it right now one day are going to wonder why nobody cared enough to try to stop it, to try to say something. Now, they’ll either find me or they will choose to keep their mouths shut because they will understand why, for the most part, victims of MK Ultra choose loyalty over truth. That’s why.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Yeah. And you’re what?

Media Control and Political Connections

ANYA WICK: And it allows them to maintain media control. The first thing you see when you walk into Steve and Kari’s house is a giant poster of Vladimir Lenin. They boasted that one of my brothers is, in fact, the oldest son of the Queen of Jordan. Where I have been, that’s just alleged. But if it’s true, it could explain why Israel and Jordan are allies.

And considering that, and considering my father’s love for all things Russian. It makes it look as though all of these wars are just for show, designed to keep public perception off of this sphere of control and to keep money circulating through different industries.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: So, Anya, why did you decide to start speaking out? And what challenges have you faced?

The Decision to Speak Out

ANYA WICK: I decided to start speaking out because I don’t want any children in my family to have to continue growing up wondering why they don’t think that’s their real mother or their real father. Because I can’t stand the pain of knowing what those girls named pain and help are going through.

And the challenges I faced are what I’ve described with loyalty, with wanting to see my siblings and maybe wondering, okay, is it better for those children going through the same abuse now to simply have a loving adult in some capacity in their lives, or for them to grow up and know that someone tried to speak for them? I am still split in half on that. The consensus in my soul about what the right thing for those children is is as split as my memories used to be.

To other challenges. You know, it’s. You look at me and say, “Oh, well, that’s not true. She’s crazy.” You know, 90% of the people who found me on TikTok know I’m telling the truth. Look up a photo of Shia’s mother and see that we are identical. You know, they understand that you cannot Google the truth if someone is claiming the official records have been forged. But of course, the only proof I possess is in my DNA. Getting anyone to do a DNA test isn’t something I can do.

I moved back to New York City because my ex husband had a scheme to try to allow me to speak about some of this in court, since court testimony can be used as evidence to potentially open up a criminal case. But when I got to the hearing, I was only allowed to say my name and address, and the judge refused to let me speak beyond that.

When we had gone to the FBI a couple years ago, they interviewed my father and said, “Oh, he said, nothing happened. So we’re going to close this case.” If every successful politician is born into this world, they have vested interest in keeping it quiet.

Now, you have a woman who, because of the severity of the trauma that did happen, suffered mental health problems, PTSD. It’s incredibly easy to paint me as insane. And my answer to that is, why would I choose to talk about something so vile if it weren’t real? I’m not profiting from this. If I choose to let this interview go, I’m cutting myself out of the only industry I have any sort of talent in. And the people I’m closest to. It’s fear.

I cannot convince people that Sean Combs is not acting alone when I don’t have proof. I don’t have the video. It’s probably at Larry David’s house. You know, I wasn’t able to record the ceremonies at Bohemian Grove because I was rope bound. They set up the abuse in a way to guarantee I was not going to be able to collect evidence while going through it. All I have is my word and my DNA.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Why did you choose TikTok as a medium?

Choosing TikTok as a Platform

ANYA WICK: Because taking an artistic route which I’m still working on, I’m still trying to finish my screenplay. I’m still doing my stand up just as my own outlet would make my voice just another drop in the bucket of voices who have told the truth through art in a way that will make it dismissed as fiction or as humor.

And TikTok. I didn’t expect it to take off the way it did. And I first posted a video back in August that got stuck in 200 views. I chose TikTok because it was not controlled by Meta. And I do believe the gentleman who owns that initially founded his companies because he wanted to give some freedom to the people. But it got bigger than his vision.

The United States wouldn’t be trying so hard to get rid of TikTok if TikTok were not granting more free speech than the United States is comfortable with being in the hands of the public. No one heard me until I went on TikTok.

Encounters with the Clintons

SHAUN ATTWOOD: So we had ex wizard Satanist from Bohemian Grove on a couple of weeks ago and he mentioned. He mentioned. It tells a story about the Clintons at Bohemian Grove. Did you have any experience of the Clintons or at Bohemian Grove?

ANYA WICK: I have met both of them and their daughters at Bohemian Grove and at resorts in Colorado. They loved going to ski lodges in the off season. They were not there. In Aspen 2007 after the comedy festival, that’s when I remember most vividly. But it’s all fuzzy. I don’t know if we were in Steamboat or in Breckenridge, but I’ve met them a few times and boasted all the time about how well she got along with Bill. She boasted about that even when we were sober.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: So Bill tried to distance himself from Jeffrey. Do you think there was a lot more going on between them?

ANYA WICK: Absolutely. Absolutely. I can’t tell you what exactly, but Bill was on the flight logs because he went to the island. He also went to many, many other where me and other children were present. It’s just fact.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Yep. That’s what Virginia said as well.

ANYA WICK: Yes.

Virginia Giuffre’s Death

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Do you think the death of Virginia is suspicious?

ANYA WICK: Say that again. Pardon me?

SHAUN ATTWOOD: You think. Do you think the death of Virginia is suspicious?

ANYA WICK: Yes, I do. Of course. Of course. To survive a car crash and die in her home a few weeks later. It had my viewers scared about me. What’s protected me is my stating that if they hurt me, it will only validate what I’ve been talking about. That claim is keeping me safe. If they did have an any intention of hurting me before, they can’t now without it making my voice a bigger story.

And on the other side of that, a lot of them love me. We grew up together. It’s tragic. I don’t remember ever meeting Virginia, but that doesn’t mean I didn’t. She may have been a cousin or a sister, I don’t know. But I know she spoke the truth about what Jeffrey and Ghislaine put her through. And I think she was gearing up to speak more.

I do not think that death was a coincidence. I do not believe that was suicide. She had two young children. She had two young children and she had already dedicated her life to speaking for other victims. There is no reason she would have killed herself. And I know some of her family said it might have been, but money talks.

Political Compromise

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Would you say that most people at the top of politics are compromised?

ANYA WICK: Yes, without a doubt. Without a doubt. I know exactly who Donald Trump was talking about. And he spoke of the New York elites during his first campaign cycle. He had no mention of them during the re-election because after that first presidency he realized he had no pull on his own strings and he was not going to be able to do anything to expose this.

I believe Obama wanted to do a lot more that he promised in his campaigns as far as reasonable socialization of our resources to bring us up with the rest of the developed world when it comes to providing housing and health care and basic human rights. And found his hands tied because in America people must be kept poor and busy so they don’t realize how much more power they have when they are unified.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: And would you say that these politicians who are compromised, it’s of a sexual nature mostly.

ANYA WICK: When people, if politician is not born into the cults, they are forced to engage in criminal acts or submit themselves so that those who are born in trust, they cannot snitch on what they are witnessing because the family’s got dirt on them too.

We see the same thing in Hollywood and in the music industry, there’s a long tradition of black men wearing dresses after they make it famous. It’s not because they’re forced to wear a dress, because they’re using that to communicate with each other and tell their viewers, “I had to submit to get here.”

The Clinton Portrait Significance

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Which takes us to the portrait of Bill Clinton in the dress at Jeffrey’s house. What was the significance of that?

ANYA WICK: Bill has engaged in sexual acts where he was on the receiving end. And there’s the metaphorical submission. He was likely forced to engage in acts against children that he didn’t want to engage in, which is associated with weakness, which, unfortunately, is associated with femininity.

I didn’t want to be a woman because I had it drilled into my head that female meant you must submit. And unfortunately, it’s what we’re seeing pervading through society now masquerading itself as feminism. The ideology I fell for, the ideology that saved my life, states your gender. Your personality is not biologically determined, but is a social construct designed to uphold the patriarchy.

Your body or your sex does not determine your gender or personality, but you must change your body if it is not congruent with your socially constructed personality, inadvertently reinforcing those patriarchal standards that are not biologically determined that we are supposed to be fighting.

Men put on the dress after they are forced to submit, whether that means giving their bodies or taking a body that they do not want to take. And we associate that submission with femininity, which is a sickness for men and women alike. It hurts men who do not want to be predatorial, and it hurts women who do not want to be victims. It hurts young boys who are sensitive and young girls who don’t want to be objects.

But agency saves lives. Taking testosterone is. When they stopped selling me, it saved my life. I think most people who adhere to that ideology do so because they’ve reached a breaking point where they cannot exist in toxic masculinity anymore because they cannot continue bearing the pain of being one woman in a society that tells you you are only an object.

Bill had to submit in one way or another. That’s the significance of the dress.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: So were you on testosterone then? For a period of time, yes, for five years. And how did that affect you?

Anya’s Medical Transition and Its Consequences

ANYA WICK: I’m now infertile, but that’s because I had a hysterectomy. The testosterone made my uterus hurt, and my doctors at Mount Sinai and my family encouraged me to remove my uterus instead of ceasing, taking the drugs that were making it hurt.

My breasts had to be reconstructed. My family paid for a mastectomy. It lowered my voice. I’ve had to retrain it to speak in a more neutral tone. I’ll never be a soprano again. But when I sing, I sound a lot more punk rock like I wanted to. When I was younger, I had a full beard. It’s mostly gone now.

I was getting casting calls for roles that required male nudity before I went back on estrogen couldn’t take them because I didn’t have the member that they wanted on camera. Thank goodness I never went that far. What was I going to do? Pack my Speedo? Risk it falling out between takes? No, Covid actually started triggering my desire to quit. That when I started having to wear a mask again. And people from behind knew I was female and would call me a she and I’d get upset about it and see this mustache? I don’t know. The piece then helped me face reality a little bit.

Recovered Memories and Facing Reality

It was also in that period I first took a micro dose of the same substance that my family had me macro dosed on. And I had memories come back that I retained. It took my therapist two years to get me to understand that these were real memories, that it aligned with my psychological profile I did not want to believe was easier for me to stay in denial. I was happier when I was still in denial. My life was easier when I was still in denial.

But these were the same memories that I thought were only nightmares when I was a child. But as soon as those memories came back, I remember just looking in the mirror at terror of resembling those who had caused me pain. I love men. I do. I have a problem with men. I love men. But it was exceptionally horrifying to see how much I looked like my father and the pain of having done that to myself. But I did so much to destroy my body in response to my body being destroyed. So I had to go back.

I quit the testosterone as soon as I could. And I was doing full drag makeup to hide my stubble and wearing wigs while I waited for my hairline to grow back in. It was embarrassing. People thought I was a trans woman. A lot of them who just are waiting for their turn to speak, but they wouldn’t understand. I would tell them very concisely, “I was born female. I was taking testosterone. I’m trying to go back to female.” “So you want to cut your dick off, you want to be a woman.” But those are the same kinds of people who you know.

And I explain why when you Google it doesn’t say he has a sister because our birth certificates were forged. They respond, “Oh, I get what you’re talking about.” But then “how come when I Google your dad, it says he only has three children?” You can’t help some people understand what they’re not willing to understand. Not my responsibility to fix stupid.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: And you with these memories, do you want to talk about them or is it too traumatic?

The Process of Remembering Trauma

ANYA WICK: I’m willing to talk about them. I was. I stayed in denial after the memory started surfacing because I remembered having some nightmares about being assaulted at the family cabin, some memories about meeting a bunch of celebrities at big parties. That was very confusing.

But in 2020, the first new memories to surface were not of the assaults, but of the circumstances around it. Because for most of the assaults, I was usually unconscious. I first remembered my family bragging about what they were doing. And I go to my therapist and I say, “My family lied and told me that they were drugging me. To me, why would they do that?” And she said, “Why would they tell you they were drugging you and you if they weren’t?”

I said, “Well, I know that they did drug me because I tried a tiny, tiny bit of what they bragged about giving me. And I remembered being on it all the time, but I don’t remember the assault yet. I remember having some nightmares about being assaulted.” She says, “Okay, are you sure they were nightmares?” And it would go on like that until I remembered instances of the physical assaults.

Running and hiding from that, trying to hide myself in the bathroom, like that’s going to help anything. Running naked and barefoot down the mountain before pausing and forgetting where I was and wandering back up the hill to the cabin, screaming out for my mother.

Seeking Validation from Multiple Professionals

I went to go see three other doctors after my therapist did so much to do EMDR with me and get me to accept that the brain would not recall false traumatic memories. Those are the memories that it blocks out. Even when substance isn’t part of it. People block out traumatic childhood memories until adulthood.

I went asking other doctors to tell me I was schizophrenic, and they didn’t, because I’m not. They said, “No. You know, our opinion matches that of your other therapist.” And of course, the meds didn’t do anything because therefore, an issue I don’t have.

But so it was a. It was about a two year process between when the memories first started coming back. And I retains memories of being with my twin brother when we were toddlers. I had memories of being with him as teenagers at these reunions and memories of my father and Stepmother and brothers making fun of me for not remembering about my twin brother. And I didn’t want to believe it because it was too sad. It was two years before I remembered being little with him.

Childhood Clues and Peer Recognition

But my peers knew there was one girl who was not dosed properly when she came to the cabin with my family and remembered what they did and everything they told her. That’s when everybody at school started calling me Ren Stevens. It’s the name of the sister character on my brother’s Disney TV show. And I thought they were making fun of me because I was tall and a little bit anal retentive.

But they tried to show me. They pulled me into the computer lab and showed me a picture. “Who are they?” I’m like, “Oh, and his mom, duh.” They’re like, “No. Do you see their faces? Who do they look like? Where do you know them from?” And getting mad at me and saying, “You’re older than us. You’re. You’re not taller than us. You’re just older than us. You’re not smarter than us. You’re older than us. Why don’t you remember this?”

I was pissed. I’d be offended. I thought the kids who were trying to help me get out of my situation were bullying me because it was safer for me. Still, I thought to just go through that than try to run away, try to face it. I couldn’t face it. My brain wouldn’t let me. But that’s how the memories came back. It took about two years and four different doctors to get me to understand it was real. I was in such deep denial.

As far as specific memories, you’re welcome to ask me questions. I don’t know where to start. I don’t know if I want to get into too many specific details.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: It’s just I. I don’t want it to be too traumatic for you. Yeah, you know, we going over these things more like, you know, your TikTok community, your viewers, when you. When you’re talking to them and stuff. Is that cathartic for you to have the love and support of these people?

Finding Purpose in Helping Others

ANYA WICK: It is not for my sake necessarily. The most cathartic for me is my creative work. Another reason I’ve had a barrier, because I would be welcome to just talk about this through creative work. But then it would be another drop in the bucket with people making art about the truth. Why I went to TikTok.

It’s the hundreds of messages from people telling me that they also experienced child sexual abuse and also lived in denial and hurting themselves because of it. And thanking me for telling my story so they could feel brave enough to face their own. It’s for the 63 year old man I made friends with in rehab who told his story for the first time in his life because I was brave enough to tell mine. And you know, for the next several weeks. And thank you so much. I’m so excited to keep telling my story to help other people heal from their own pain.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: That’s what hope can you give people.

Breaking the Cycle of Abuse

ANYA WICK: That’s why it’s. It’s not. It’s not the best outlet for my own healing, but it’s the best way I can help others with theirs and make something beautiful ripple out of the pain that we were all put through. The more people talk about this, the less likely it is to cycle through history, especially men.

I do believe men who are victimized are way more likely to become perpetrators themselves. I know 60% of men in prison experience child sexual abuse and that’s because it’s so stigmatized. They don’t talk about it. And if they don’t talk about it, they can’t heal from it. And when they don’t heal from it, they crave reliving it, but they relive it from the other side of it, taking back that power that was taken from them. It makes sense to a sick man. I don’t want there to be any more sick men. I don’t want there to be any more tortured little girls.

A Healing Dream

I’m going to tell you about a dream I had last month, right? I was back visiting that house I grew up in on Birch Street. But it was flooded with light and there were these Grecian columns as part of the construction. And my father was there, but he was my age in this dream, like he could have been my twin himself. And he was wearing yellow and glowing, really happy to see me, me.

And I asked him “How many times did they.” And smiling at me, he said, “Thousands.” We went into the living room, turned on the tv, watched basketball on mute while some music played like we would growing up. And he took out the big kitchen knife and pulled down his pants and handed me the knife and I began to make an incision. When I woke up, the most healing nightmare I’ve ever had. But that’s why I’m inclined to talk about it. Because Steve never would have become a if he were not a victim of.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: What do you say to the survivors watching this?

ANYA WICK: What do I say to the survivors?

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Yes.

Message to Survivors

ANYA WICK: It wasn’t your fault. You are not weak. It is okay if you’re not ready to talk about it, but you will feel better when you do. You are valuable. You are not. What happened to you? You are loved.

To my siblings specific, I understand why you feel like you can’t speak, but you can and you should to spare your children the same internal struggle. You have power. Do you have responsibility? I pray every day that I’ll get to see you again one day, but because I don’t want the next generation going through what we went through, I’m not okay with staying silent in order to make that happen. And I pray that a handful of you can say something.

Some victims again at large, you do not have to perpetrate to take your power back. All you have to do is claim what happens to you. I don’t want to call us victims. I read a lovely little book from the AK Press a couple weeks ago about consent. And they defined victims as people who are no longer with us. People who lost the psychological battle or even the battle against perpetrators like Virginia and survivors as those who are still here.

We are not victims. We are survivors. We are empowered. You can choose whether to use that power to be parts of waves of change against the fabric of secrecy that’s been draped across our society, or you can choose to be part of that fabric of secrecy which is going to keep you wounded. It’s up to you.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Wow, that’s really powerful. And yeah, I really appreciate you spending time, time with us. And do you want to let the viewers know what they can see at your TikTok and the links in the description box, folks?

Building Community and Supporting Survivors

ANYA WICK: Yeah, I want to start putting some of my comedy on there, some more art. I really want to start interviewing other survivors. I have people watching me, but there are others who I think deserve to have their stories told.

The point of social media is social community. I don’t want to make it all about me. I don’t want to make it all about my suffering. I know I’ve been offline for a little while. TikTok stresses me out. I don’t like social media. I have too many messages to keep up with. I need to find a job right now. I’m not good at monetizing this and I need to be because I need an apartment.

But I’m going to try and give you guys more content again because that community blew me away. I wasn’t prepared for it. And some of you, I’ve gotten to be very connected to, feel very attached to. You’re the reason my phone is still on because of the donations that you made when we thought I was going to need a lawyer. So I want to do something worthwhile with that. You changed my life.

For the first time in my life, people said, “We see you.” I’ve had to walk around the world wearing a bag on my head my whole life, and you guys took that bag off me. I could breathe for the first time. And whether I’m going to keep talking about other victims like some of you want, or just sharing my art and platforming other survivor stories, I want to keep that connection going.

All we’ve got is each other. It’s the whole point of life is other people. And all of you on TikTok changed the course of mine. I hope that’s up to me. It’s up to me to decide what I do with that. Thank you.

Closing Remarks

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Oh, no. Thank you. And viewers, you know, Anya’s links are in the description box. Please support her work. Huge thank you to Anya for coming on and if I have some survivors in mind that we could send over, but I’m going to end this now. Let us know in the comments what you thought and take care wherever you are in the world. Much love, especially look out for the kids. Thank you, Anya. You’re blowing kisses.

ANYA WICK: He’s so precious.

SHAUN ATTWOOD: Oh, thanks.

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