Transcript of Master Shi Heng Yi on The Diary Of A CEO Podcast

Consciousness is a big field. Then we have science, another very, very big field. So some say, okay, is it that consciousness creates matter or is it the other way around? Which one is which one is the fundamental basis. What is the basis of our interaction?

So the truth is the fact right now is regardless of science, no science, how our evolution developed. Right now we are here. Your body, my body, we are here. This is what we are having right now at the same time, in the way of how this lifestyle at the moment is, we won’t have more than 50 more years to go in that body.

So very simple, without believing, without any religious aspect. Once again, the truth is the lifetime of what you carry right now and what I carry right now, it’s limited. And now just imagine you would be, let’s say, the director of your own movie. Jump out of the body and watch yourself. Right now you are sitting, we sit on the same table and you are writing your story. How do you want to write the story?

You want to afterwards, after this podcast, you want to feel uncomfortable, feel unsafe, feel unloved, feel like being just unsatisfied with the whole life, cry or anything like this, or how do you imagine what is a really nice way of living for you, the next 50 years?

So, and based on that purpose can be different. You say, I do like to travel. I do like to invest this lifetime in this body, to have the feeling at least that I can contribute something to all the fellow brothers and sisters that are around us. It makes me like, I wake up, I like to do it. It gives me purpose. So it is something very, very personal. Which also means that in a way, speaking in these terms right now, I do not believe that every human being has the same purpose when it comes to this type of purpose.

But now there’s another type of purpose which is more or less personally for me. Why do I think that in the first place we have been put with all these possibilities and positively said? I do think it is a blessing being able to just experience. It’s a blessing that we have been granted the possibility of simply experiencing what this existence is capable of creating, including everything, including the joy, including the happiness, including the tears, including the heartbreaks.

All of this without the separation. Whether you prefer one area or not the one, sometimes the one goes with the other. But the purpose, in a way, is just be and experience. The only thing that happens and which is a big part nowadays is if you take your current existence too serious. If you completely base your identity, your being, on what you think you are. But like I said, it’s just the picture right now.

Yes, but just sometimes make it very simple. Jump out of yourself and be the director. Be the director of this avatar. And then it just opens another perspective. Because in that moment you just realize it’s like a movie. Not everything is always positive. But in the moment where there are times of struggle, still not being caught inside your own creation, identity, illusion of the self—different expressions for that. It’s a very helpful way of thinking.

The Search for Meaning

STEVEN BARTLETT: There are so many people that say they are struggling to find meaning in their life or they feel purposelessness. And you know, I get so many messages from people all over the world saying that they say things like, is this it? Is this all my life is?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: This is literally also one point that you just mentioned is that “isn’t there more.” That has always been a part that followed me along the way. Especially now in the last three, four years after social media, the algorithm of social media really started also pushing us quite out there. More requests were coming of doing workshops, of doing podcasts, of teaching here, of teaching there, of making television show, of participating in movies.

And of course all together with this, doors start to open, different things start to come in. But at some point I just couldn’t believe that this is supposed to be the purpose because it all still had to do with doing, the constant doing. And there I felt in my life now looking at this, this couldn’t be it. So I looked for alternatives always and always again, especially feeling that along the way of what you would say, achieving something, being recognized at something.

But there’s another side that goes hand in hand with it that the public doesn’t see. There were times I could simply be surrounded with thousands, thousands of people, but still feel lonely. It’s not what you’re surrounded with, it’s with what you are connected. And there I felt like there is always again this type of force. What is it that drives you on? Going outwards, going outwards, going outwards you lose yourself. But this self is the only thing that can give you connection in this life.

Connection to the Source

STEVEN BARTLETT: And what do you need to be connected to? Then you talked about being surrounded by thousands and being lonely. And it’s really about what you’re connected to. What does one need to be connected to?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Maybe before I answer you this question, there’s one thing I maybe want to mention beforehand. So when I went to elementary school and also during my school time, I actually for example joined Christian lessons. So by my parents I grew up with Buddhist tradition, let’s say from the martial art training, I also got introduced into so called Zen Buddhism because my father always told me, look son, we are here in a foreign country, you’re a foreigner. It’s always better to have friends than to have enemies.

That’s why I made always friends with everyone. Meaning I had a lot of Russian friends, I had a lot of Arabic friends. I had a lot of Turkish friends. Multicultural also, meaning at some point I also got introduced into Islam. Bottom line is taking all of this knowledge from the past into my mind, no matter from which angle I’m watching right now.

I do believe that we all have a source. There is a source. So whether you call that source the universe, whether you call the source God, whether this source is the infinite energy, I don’t know. There are so many different expressions to it. But when I look at all these teachings, all are always pointing at one and the same thing.

Let’s just take the expression of Yin and Yang, the symbol everybody knows in the world, and there is that nice. Yin and Yang have a mother. The mother sometimes simply being illustrated as one circle. So yin and Yang as the expression from duality, polarity, existence of number two. Where do the two come from? They must come from one.

So simple. Like in our way, you are there, I am here. 1, 2, where do we come from? There must be something that we have as a common denominator. And this source is the only thing that can connect us. Because it’s not your family, it’s not my family. They’re still different. That is not enough. Going. Just looking at. We are humans, animals, same, whatever.

And whoever gave us the possibility to be here is the same who gave you the permission? It is the same who gave me the permission and the blessing. And this is what I think. This is the level of mind, this is the level of connection that never leaves you lonely. This is the one that I mean.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Being connected to the source.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Now, for someone that is listening to this and is confused at this juncture, and they’re asking themselves, what is that source? You’ve described it in many potential ways, but it’s the. My attempt at describing it is it is ultimately where we came from that is the source. Is there a better way of describing it for people that might be unfamiliar with the concept?

# Mindfulness and Personal Growth

Finding Your Own Path

MASTER SHI HENG YI: First of all, I cannot speak without it, and it would make sense to everyone. That’s already the first very, very difficult part. That’s why my intention is never to say, what is it? The only thing I can do is to give pointers. But ultimately there’s only one person who will be able to find it out, and it’s not me finding it out for somebody else. Everybody will find out for himself or herself.

So every human being, I do think, is at a different level of his growth, of his development, and everybody gets what he needs. Exactly. In the moment where he is in, which is why I think everybody at this moment in time is exactly where he needs to be for the next elevation to take place.

The only thing you need to do is look at yourself right now and just find out what is it that makes you unhappy. What exactly is it that at this moment in your life is binding you and restricting you from moving on? And this is the same question for everyone. But what you ultimately need to tackle is different.

In the past, I sometimes played Super Mario and Luigi and it’s the same. If you don’t manage level number one, you won’t see level number two. The challenges for number two won’t come. The end boss from number two is not going to come first. You finish level one, but once number one is finished, you won’t face the same stuff anymore. And there is something along this line where it sometimes is like a game at the same time. Don’t take it so serious.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Helps on that point of we’re all struggling with something based on the levels we’re at. If you had to try and summarize what the common answer is to what people are struggling with, what do you think that might be?

I was thinking about my best friends because sometimes it’s easier to step outside of oneself and look at others. When I was reflecting on the conversations I’ve had with them over the last couple of weeks about things they’re struggling with. And I would define a lot of it as wanting. So wanting to improve their businesses, wanting to improve maybe their romantic situations and find love. I would say the essence of it, the suffering, seems to be striving for something that they’re unable to grab. But I wondered if you had a different perspective on that.

The Struggle Between Doing and Being

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Two things that right now would come to my mind. There is always the struggle between doing and being. Doing – I would ask why are you doing so? Why do you want to go into action? Mostly there is a goal. Why do you have that goal? Because you’re aiming at receiving something that in the moment where you have it, apparently you are lacking.

So that means this type of goal setting, in my perspective, I would automatically refer to it already that your goal setting already comes from a space of lack. You feel like you’re lacking something. That’s why you need to do. You feel like you are lacking something. That’s why you need to educate yourself. This is the one direction now.

Coming back, maybe sounds again too philosophical, connected with the source. There’s nothing to add and there’s nothing to take away from you. So apparently when somebody has this very, very high ambition of doing something, achieving something, then most likely the chances are there this is not coming from a connection to the source. It is coming from the idea of wanting to nourish or create an identity. An identity that represents something that you think you want to represent.

So this is the one area, the doing versus the being. And then the second thing is that ultimately goes hand in hand with this way of living your life, is that for that, one thing is being forgotten along the line. The truth of that whoever and whatever you are creating and are intending to create and are intending to gather now and starting to attain things, your attainment maximum is going to last hundred years. That is the other truth.

And I do believe people understand exactly what I said. But there comes the fight now again, the fight between, yes, between this very strong identity that wants to just maintain itself and the other side of just forget about your identity. Be as you are. That’s it. No matter what you’re going to attain, you have it for 100 years. Afterwards, it’s gone. So just be, don’t stress yourself too much with what you don’t have.

Well, unfortunately, and this is always going to continue like this, unfortunately, there are always three ways how you’re going to learn this. Sometimes people just need to have the experience to realize, okay, I did it, I got it, now I realize I don’t need it. But in the first place, you need to have it. First way of learning.

Second way of learning, you do trust a certain teacher, you do trust a certain guide or a mentor. You just copy the way how he’s living his life. So your approach is you just copy because you see, oh, apparently the person lives a good life, so you just copy. Second way of learning.

And the third way of learning is you maybe have like a teacher or a master. He tells you some wise words, you contemplate about it, you think about it. And because you are thinking about it, it already puts you on the alternative path without you needing to try it for yourself.

And there will always be people in this world in these three categories because simply telling somebody, look, don’t put your hand in the fire, they’re still going to do it. But latest, when they do it like two times, three times, then it’s done.

STEVEN BARTLETT: But a lot of people never get the thing that they’re pursuing. So, you know, someone might say, I want to be a millionaire or I want to have this Lamborghini sports car. The majority of people who aspire to that statistically won’t ever reach it. So they’ll spend their whole life just in pursuit. They’ll never get the lesson of path one, where you try it and you realize that.

Learning to Let Go

MASTER SHI HENG YI: But maybe that is also already the lesson involved in this person’s life. You have this goal in the mind. You put all your energy, all your effort into trying to achieve that. You’re 20 years old, you’re trying. You’re 30 years old, you’re trying. 40 years already, you’re still trying. 50 years, you still haven’t let go of the idea.

Well, at some point, hopefully you see exactly that, that senseless approach of how you personally already wasted 30 years of following a goal with the conclusion of two things. Number one, you haven’t achieved it yet, or number two, you didn’t have the right way of achieving it.

But the bottom line is you have two ways now what to do. Let go of the idea that you need it and redirect your life or redirect your approach of how you still want to achieve that goal if you don’t want to let go of it. But apparently one of these two things is not right.

And the more you want your life now, let’s say in the future to be quite different than what you’re used to, the more you need to be able to let go, let go of patterns, let go of the way of thoughts that you had in the last years and months. Now, if nothing changes about that, there will not come a new life.

STEVEN BARTLETT: So many of us live in patterns, the same cycles. We end up getting the same results, and those results result in unhappiness and suffering. And I was speaking to a friend over the weekend about how one of our other friends has lived in a bit of a pattern and they’ve been unable to find love and companionship because of some things that happened when they were younger.

I think they were bullied, so they have this sort of deeper sense of having to prove themselves and insecurity. And this shows up all the time, because when they meet someone, they present a facade which might not necessarily be accurate. And then very quickly the relationship ends because it was never real in the first place, but this person’s now aware of it, but it’s still happening over and over again.

They’re still living out the same pattern in their life and still getting the same results and dissatisfaction. So when we think about trauma at an early age, that results in this sort of cyclical pattern of getting same behavior, same results. I wondered if you had a perspective on how one can let go of that and therefore break the pattern.

Breaking Patterns Through Awareness and Training

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Let me draw you a picture. I was a 4-year-old boy, having father and mother, Asian origin, being refugees from Vietnam, Laos, meaning they ran away from the war, coming to Europe, coming to Germany, with the idea that for the children to have a better security on the one side, feeling more safe in Germany, without the instability that they witness in their own country.

And so of course, father and mother with this idea put a lot of pressure in early ages already in terms of you need to be good at school, you need to achieve, you need to prove yourself. So this is the education from father and mother at the same time.

With the age of four, I went into a Shaolin kung fu school learning martial arts. And every martial artist practitioner probably knows teachers and masters usually are not the ones telling you, oh, yes, you did that very good. Yes, very well. No, they just say, okay, more deeper, faster, harder.

So bottom line is, from the age of four growing up, the only thing that in a way I felt was actually, you’re never enough. No matter what I brought home in terms of grades, if it was a B, why was another A? If it was A, why is it not an A+? If I did already 100 push ups question is, why don’t you make 150? If I was fast already, it was still not fast enough. So constantly this type of never enough.

Okay, ultimately, meaning, and this is all now, I can just tell you 40 years later, but now I can see it ultimately meaning that at some point this little boy started simply to build up a shield, build up such a shield to be less dependent anymore on what other people think about me. Meaning I just started to rely everything in my life purely on what I think, at the same time building up emotional blockages and emotional walls. Nothing to penetrate and at the same time also nothing to express to the outside.

So now, having entered into a very new circumstance in my life where I need to take into consideration the opinion and the emotional state of my beloved, of my partner, of my son, I can feel how my old patterns sometimes are still trying to sneak in.

So the only thing to do is what to do to break patterns. Number one, you need to see you have one. And number two, you need to replace old patterns, which ultimately mean patterns. It’s habitual behavior, it’s habits. How do you build habits by continuous behavioral patterns that you continuously do. So there is something about consistency and continuity that ultimately builds a pattern.

So, and this is now where, for example, in this field of martial arts, that’s exactly what it’s about, consistency of having a training regimen every day. This is, you know, it’s not helpful to like 6 days per week do nothing and then you go one day to the gym and give your everything. No, it’s better you have some type of consistency throughout the whole day. This is what builds patterns, healthy patterns.

And so similar like this I would describe. Now, what is somebody supposed to do? Number one, look at yourself and see yourself. We are all not perfect, but according to the circumstances that you are facing right now, today, what type of character do you think with? What do you want to equip your character that he is able to go through this current times in the best possible manner? What is not useful for you anymore? Try to get rid of it and get your new skills in and then.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Train those, and then train, of course, those new patterns. We don’t often think about training some of the virtues that we want to acquire and the patterns we want to have. We kind of think that we have to select them and then we’ll do our best to live them. But the idea that I might have to train certain new behaviors is a really compelling one because you’re right, in the context of any physical development, I have to go to the gym and I have to do my repetitions to build that thing, that strength.

But I was just thinking about creating a training regimen for certain behaviors and new patterns that I want in my life and trying to make sure I do them every day, which is not something that I’ve ever considered. Three months ago, you became a dad to a young boy, to a young son.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes.

Raising a Man in Today’s World

STEVEN BARTLETT: So you’re now in the process of raising a man yourself. And there’s a lot of dialogue at the moment in the UK, but also just broadly in the Western world around what it is to be a man and how to raise men. I think much of this dialogue has been sparked by some shocking statistics that show young men are struggling now more than ever, in various ways. I think the single biggest killer of men under the age of 45 is themselves. And also there’s just an overarching sense of, I think, purposeless meaninglessness, that they’re struggling in school more so than women are.

Some forecasts predict that for every two women that graduate university or college, only one man will graduate in the near future. And it’s pretty shocking. So when I think about the way that you’re intent on raising your young man, but also what it is that young men in particular are missing in their lives. I wondered if you had had an answer.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: From this moment, there’s one thing I can tell by myself what I would absolutely prevent when it would come to the education or what I share with my son. Like I said, I felt I was never enough. There was always something that additionally needed to be done.

So which literally means for me, for my son, there is nothing to be done, there is nothing he has to achieve. If there would be something, it is stay connected. So in terms of I don’t see myself as somebody who is now having the responsibility to shape my son. No, I only provide the framework. I try to provide the most safe framework for my son. He can try out whatever he wants. If he fails, he will learn by himself to get up again and keep trying.

So to fail and then to continue, I just want to build up this framework as good as I can to make him feel safe. But trial and error is what I do believe is the way how you find yourself. So definitely not being spoiled, but at the same time also not like keeping something away from him where I make him feel like he’s not enough.

So ultimately I do think in the modern way of how to express it in all these attachment theories. Very simple, of course. It’s the secure. The secure way of being a stable, own built, self-made, self-sufficient individual who knows his own value. Why? Because he failed and got up.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Why do you think so many young men are struggling?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Whatever shows up right now at this moment, 2025, it didn’t start in 2025. Whatever appears right now, sometimes it’s the result of how things have been handled, how the education has been from previous years, whether it’s the last 10 years, whether it’s the last 20 years.

So it’s not necessarily what did the generation right now did wrong? Let’s say no, it’s also the question of what did the previous generation missed to keep passing on that ultimately led to the result that we have nowadays. So, and this is the question where I do think it’s multi-layered.

The Five Hindrances

STEVEN BARTLETT: You gave a TED talk in 2020 almost five years ago now about the five hindrances. What are the five hindrances? You described them as five mental states that are holding us back.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Let’s put the context first. Take a symbol. Just you have a goal setting, you set yourself whatever goal it is, you have your goal. So your mind is set on the goal. Normally the five hindrances now simply describe there are five mental states that would actually make it difficult for you to still keep your goal in the mind, whatever goal that is.

The number one, for example, is called sensual desire. Sensual desire means you are too receptive for any type of pleasurable feeling in regards to your five senses. You are being too quickly attracted when you see something beautiful, you are too quickly attracted if you smell something tasty, you are too quickly distracted when you have physical touch.

So the first hindrance means you are losing the goal already. Because in the moment something pleasurable is being presented to you, your mind has shifted already. So that means that first mental state only means, look, be aware of what is it that you are very easily attracted to. It doesn’t say it’s bad, it doesn’t say it’s good. It just says in the context of you want to reach your goal.

How to reach the goal the quickest, be focused with your energy. Meaning be focused with the mind. Don’t lose the goal from the mind, whatever you do, from the moment of waking up until the evening, whatever you do, keep the goal in the mind. This is the quickest way of making this goal become real.

Number two, simply said, you don’t like discomfort, you don’t like challenges, you don’t like hardship. In that TEDx talk, I described it like you were like walking along the path and then suddenly it starts to rain, but you don’t like rain. So instead of you just continue, follow the path. You are starting to make your mind busy about what you don’t like. And already that means the mind starts to shift again, losing the focus of the goal.

So this idea, hindrance number one, hindrance number two. Actually, you can easily say it like this is the goal. Two things not to do. Spend your time enjoying, don’t do this, or spend your time rejecting that. Things are not the way how you imagine them to be. Both of these things, one is you follow pleasure, and the other thing, you’re rejecting any challenges. Both of these things is something to be aware of when it comes to stay focused along the path.

Discipline and Awareness

STEVEN BARTLETT: When we think about this first hindrance of sensual desire, is this where discipline comes into play? The idea of discipline, because that word is often used, but it’s often lacking a clear definition, but also a clear understanding of how one attains and exhibits discipline. Because when I think about the things that require me to have discipline, it is these desires, it is the five gates, it is something I want to eat, it is maybe some kind of touch that I want to have, et cetera. So is this where discipline is important?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: No, even for example, like in the book, or even now, when we talk about, we have the five hindrances, we have the 14 virtues, we have the eight rules, we have the four here and the 13 here and the six.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Okay.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: It’s a very good guideline because it makes it easy for us humans to have something like really structured. There are four steps, there are six steps, there are five steps whatsoever. What I want to say is just in this way. It’s also that only discipline wouldn’t be helpful if in the first place you do not possess the ability to see it, to realize it, to be aware of it.

Meaning you have discipline, but you are never aware actually when is the moment actually appearing right now that this sensory desire is hitting in. You’re not aware of it. So the discipline wouldn’t help you if you don’t have this awareness. So always meaning, I do think that there are different qualities of the mind that come into play for you to adjust yourself properly.

STEVEN BARTLETT: I was thinking about my friend when you mentioned awareness there, the friend I described earlier, who exhibits the same pattern. And although they might be aware of the pattern, they might say, you know, I have this pattern. I don’t believe they’re aware the moment where that pattern begins like this, the singular trigger which sends them in that loop.

So I was thinking the same about myself. I was like, there’s some behaviors that I have that I don’t like. And although I’m aware of them in the moment when it happens, I might not be conscious that the pattern has begun, someone has said something, something has happened, and then you go on that pattern, or you reach into the refrigerator at 1am in the morning and grab the thing, or you end up being triggered. So I wondered if there’s a practice at all to increase our awareness of the trigger moment.

Inner Work and Awareness

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes, this is, for example, where I very much appreciate so many different teachings that are meanwhile existing here, freely available, for example, through the social media, including breath work, including yoga practices, all of them. If you have a proper teacher, I’m very sure that this is exactly what is starting to raise your awareness for something that in this field, when you’re spending some time, we refer to as energy.

If you’re not aware of your own inner layer, let’s say like this, and somebody insults you, it can happen that like somebody insults me and then I just started exploding. Yeah, but the fact is, before something explodes, before I explode, first of all, something must be lit already. The small little flame already must have been lit.

So when I already knew who is it that I’m going to meet, maybe that already knowing, hearing the name from him already was, ah, was already the starting point of a potential explosion to happen. Yeah. So then, ah, this was where, when this little flame already started being there. And then you literally can feel things like this. You can feel when something is, has been injected, let’s say into you when something starts to arise.

Because when the fire is already too big, when the whole house is burning, you’re not going to put down that fire in any way. You can only put down all of these fires before things come too big. Meaning we must find a way to be directly grabbing the root, grabbing the core, or grabbing the source of the explosion.

And the only way that I know is you need to become more sensitive for everything that goes on in your body, in your surrounding, in everything. This is where, for me, awareness does play a role. And yes, and especially when it comes to becoming aware of your emotional states, this is absolutely inner work. This has nothing to do with doing work out here. It’s inner work.

STEVEN BARTLETT: How does one begin the journey of doing that inner work?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: You give trust in the vision that when you are investing your time right now to become more aware of yourself, of your emotional state, then this is going to benefit your life. That’s the starting point.

STEVEN BARTLETT: You believe in it.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: You believe in it. So you don’t do it because somebody tells you you’re supposed to do it. You do it because you genuinely believe. This is the way. I want to know more about myself. I want to really understand what is it that I am made out of. You want to figure out is there something inside of myself? I tried to look away for many years, but I know it’s still there and was afraid to look at it. All of these things.

There’s only one way to make yourself free. You need to become transparent. If there are spots inside of ourselves where there’s no light yet, it can’t be, it can’t be bringing light to everything that has been in the dark. This is another area of the past which at some point everybody will face.

And even though that is, even though that this is now just like a saying, but just the idea, whatever you’re doing, whatever you’re thinking, whether people are around you or you are alone, just imagine there is one who always sees what you’re doing. So live your life based on that.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Then that person is you.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Also.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Who else is it?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: It’s the elevated version of you, but it’s true. It’s you and you.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Once I’ve shone a light on that area of me, so I have greater awareness of its existence, and it’s now transparent. Is it a case then of what is the work I then have to do to make a change in that context? So we’re talking here about managing one’s emotions and getting a grip of one’s emotions so you can avoid being triggered or perpetrating the same patterns in your life that have led you to the same outcomes. First, you believe that it’s possible to change. You gain a greater awareness of the parts of yourself that you kept in the dark that you might want to change. And then what does one do from there?

# The Path of Lightness and Freedom

Understanding the Consequences of Our Actions

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Because I came from this martial art field. Also meaning that Dao teaching, or the principles of Yin and Yang have always been part of it. Let me put it like this. Whatever you are thinking, saying, or doing has a consequence. So this consequence that you have created or that you are intending to create, ask yourself, what is that consequence actually? Does it make yourself? Does it make your being, your interaction with people, does it make it feel more light, more pleasurable, more enjoying, more free, more nourishing? Or is the result that you are about to create going in the other direction?

Meaning you are nourishing conflict, you are nourishing aggression. Feeling like you are carrying the suffering of the world on your shoulder, feeling like there’s a burden on you, feeling like there’s a stone on your heart, feeling like you’re being put under pressure. All of these expressions have something to do with density, have something to do with pressure.

But then when we look at no matter which tradition it is, Buddhism, enlightenment, freedom, liberation, elevation, no matter what it is, you see, it is just two forces in the world. Two forces in the world, one aiming for limitlessness and the other one aiming for restricting and very clear boundaries. These are the two forces.

And this is exactly now turning the view upon yourself. What are you made out of your patterns, the emotional states that follow you within a week. Looking back the last week, what was the most dominating emotion you felt inside yourself? Was it one that had the character of limiting yourself in a way, or were you in an emotional state through the week that was light, cool, liberated, free, uplifting, joyful? Which of these?

This simply gives you exactly from what to what do I think you need to transform yourself if you want this. So, why do I think that this is the goal? Lightness. Lightness.

Beyond Words: The Nature of Experience

Let’s just imagine after this conversation, your best friend or your best girlfriend is going to ask you, so how was this conversation? Even if we are maybe just talking three hours, four hours. Even if you spent two days explaining to your best friend how this conversation was, it’s not the truth. It is not the truth.

How is this conversation even right now? We cannot even speak about it. I tell you how this conversation right now really is. How do you want to describe this? You will be the only one ever knowing how this is. It doesn’t matter who’s going to ask you afterwards, what you’re going to tell them. You want to feel it. You need to experience it. There is no other way.

And this is the nature of words. This is why these ancient stories come. For example, one master and his student walk up on the mountain early in the morning. Then the sun rises up, and then the student says, “Oh, master, what a beautiful sunrise.” And then the master slaps him and never takes him to a walk anymore.

Why was the teacher so hard to him? Because in the moment where you give something that you experience a word, you limit its nature. You naturally limit its nature.

So how does this now translate into what we can do with this knowledge? Whatever is being dense and limiting, I don’t think it’s the way. I think everything for us to practice is look beyond limitations, look beyond the words, look beyond the shape. Practice to look beyond the superficiality of things, because this is where the meaning lies, or this is where part of the realization lies.

STEVEN BARTLETT: I think in my life, I want to be light, but the way that my life tends to operate is I might aspire for that, but then I fall into almost a bit of an autopilot. And I run the same pattern throughout the week. I respond in the same ways to the same external stimulus.

So although I might aspire to be freer and to be less agitated or to be all those things, I quickly fall back into my old path, my old autopilot, because life does seem to come at me pretty quickly. If I look at my calendar, it’s just full every day.

So I wake up and I’m like, with one eye open, looking at my phone schedule to figure out what day it is and what that means and what I have to do and what’s just happened. And all the podcast has gone out. I’ve got this email from this person and there’s my calendar when I’m late by 20 minutes. And although I might have the day before said to myself that this week we’re going to be joyful and light and free, it feels like the week hits me like a truck and then boom, autopilot.

Setting Goals and Facing Life’s Challenges

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So our goal is set in a way. And now comes the next realization. Just because your goal is set doesn’t mean this life is going to give you exactly what you’re looking for. Meaning you really must make sure how important is that goal really for you.

I witness it in my life as well. When it started to become a lot public, the calendar went full. And at some point I said to myself, okay, now it’s becoming too full. Let’s start to settle down a bit. Let’s start to stay a little bit more in the background. But then still requests coming in still. And then you were thinking, ah, come this one still.

But ultimately it’s really up to you, how much do you really want it? And it’s going to continue like this until you will ultimately come to the point and it’s going to come quickly, I do think, where you realize for yourself that it’s an infinite direction of possibilities. They will never run out. But you will still have to figure out what is it that you really want from your life.

STEVEN BARTLETT: People will say, well, I want to have a mansion and I would like to have a private jet and I would like to have a beautiful partner or I’d like to have a trophy.

The Lesson of Letting Go

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Valid. Absolutely understandable as well. But I do think that this universe is going to let you realize your lesson in the way how you need it. You’re going to have your mansion, you’re going to have your beautiful wife. You’re going to have it all. There is something that’s going to put you back on track. There is something that’s going to put you back on track. Telling you you need to readjust.

Why? Because it has always been like this. We come with nothing, we go with nothing. What does it mean? This universe is going to make sure that you going to go with nothing. Which means at some point before it’s time for you to go, you will be faced with the fact of learning, the necessity of letting go of what you have attained in this lifetime.

And if you have not learned and have not understood that this is going to come, then I think it’s a very, very hard awakening, it’s a very painful awakening to realize that you have spent 70 years, 80 years following your goal and now there is no other choice, you have to let go.

It’s not my invention, it’s just my observation. And this is why in the ancient traditions, in the text of Chan Buddhism, Zen Buddhism, it’s very simply said like this. How do you know that you have practiced this path, this tradition in a decent manner? It is simply by feeling inside yourself how easy, how willing are you actually to let go of what you have?

If you feel that you are mentally attached to things, still mentally attached to possession, you’re far away from the state of being what this Chan Buddhism, what this Chan teaching is wanting to reveal to you.

What it also means is if you have the possibility of attaining everything that you were speaking about, you are absolutely happy to do so. You can own everything. It’s never about promoting “to have this is not good.” No. But to have attachment, at least in this type of tradition, will have consequence. So it’s not about what is it that you possess, it’s about what of these possessions are possessing you. That’s it.

Possessions Without Attachment

STEVEN BARTLETT: And therefore is it possible to possess things and to pursue the possession of things while also having a relationship with them where they don’t possess you? Can I go in pursuit of getting a sports car, and is it possible to then have the sports car and pursue it without it possessing me and therefore me avoiding the consequences that come with that unhealthy relationship to possession? Because in your life there must be things that you’re pursuing and you get those things. So your book sells a million copies, your YouTube channel does exceptionally well. You pursued those things.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Let’s start with a sports car. It depends on the rest of the circumstances. If the salary that you have, for example, is just as much that you can pay your rent, nevertheless you want to have that sports car, therefore take a loan, then buy the sports car. It’s very probable you’re going to be very attached to the car simply because of the situation you bought it from. You didn’t buy it from a position of abundance. So this is already not a good starting point to afford something that you actually cannot afford.

It is different when you have the possibilities and you just spend the time and spend also the money on the sports car and see it what it is and realistically see how much time you spend with it. I do think the excitement in the beginning is there for a week, maybe a month. That’s already long, but it’s fading.

And at some point there will even be a day you don’t even see it because you’re busy. Then there would be a week when you see the car once standing around somewhere. And then there will be a month passing by where you are traveling the world and you’re not even sure anymore when was it the last time that you were riding it.

When you observe them and actually realize, yeah, it’s the truth. This is how the development of things with possessions is. In the beginning, it’s always like you want to have, you want to have, and then they fade.

Diving into this type of mentality of really understanding, wanting is the one part. And then realizing how is life really? Do you need it? Is it necessary? Can you afford it? It’s the second part, it just opens another perspective and then you just decide for yourself.

Whether something is possessing you or you can possess something without being attached to it, very much is linked to all of this. From which position did you buy it from? Did you attain it from? And then the second thing is how much time do you literally really spend with it?

Understanding Ill Will

STEVEN BARTLETT: The second of the five hindrances is ill will. A negative emotion such as dislike stops you from chasing a goal. Can you give me some context on this one? What do you mean by ill will?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: I make it super simple when it comes to the five hindrances. Whatever appears in our life, if I have my goal set right now, what you are not supposed to do is to witness something and now if you have the number one, sensual desire, sensory desire, what we tend to do is we start to pull things towards us. That’s number one.

The second thing, what not to do, this is what it all belongs to that family of non-judgment, is when ill will, something appears in your life, something you witness. You meet a person you don’t want to meet, you get the message, you don’t want to read that message, whatever it is, and you try to avoid it by doing actions in order to push it away from you.

So what it ultimately means is don’t do any of them. Because whatever you try to hold onto, the nature of things is that this is happening, swinging away, it’s going to move away from you. And whatever you try to avoid and push away from you is just a question of time until it’s going to move pretty close towards you.

STEVEN BARTLETT: It’s going to come towards you.

The Power of Focus and Non-Attachment

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Going to come towards you. Okay, so that means also in the way of how it’s expressed, don’t touch the water. If you don’t want to have a life that is too shaky, don’t touch the water. Because in the moment you touch, your touch is the initiation for the ripples to appear. Same way you want to follow that goal, you want to have it easy along that goal. Don’t touch any additional water along your goal. Don’t touch it because you like something and don’t touch it because you dislike something.

Because when you walk towards the goal and you do here and here and here, you’re just going to ripple your whole surroundings, which ultimately means your energy is being just drawn away from your initial goal. That’s how I would say it is. An ill will is one of these expressions of you don’t like something and then you invest the energy there. You like something and it draws your energy back to there. An ill will is similar in this category belonging to this idea of don’t push, don’t pull.

Managing Public Opinion

STEVEN BARTLETT: As you’ve become more popular and you’ve got millions of views across the Internet, your TED Talk, I think, from the link, one of the links that I saw had some 20 million views and it probably has tens of more millions of views all over the Internet. There’s going to be more and more people sending you messages, interacting with you and saying amazing things, saying not so amazing things. We experienced this. Obviously, as a podcaster, you just receive all kinds of feedback from everybody. When you think about how you manage that and you manage other people’s opinion of you, does this tie into ill will? And I guess the ultimate question is, do you care what people think about you?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So there was a time I cared a lot. A lot, a lot, a lot, very much. But within the last five, six years, I really had my hard lessons. Being perfectly honest, number one thing I need to learn is also to really not take things too deep into consideration, especially from people that I’ve never met in my life. Number one, that is the first area I needed to learn, which means everything that’s on social media, everything that is publicly available, this is one thing. Why? Because what they judge, or if they judge or what they comment, they can only comment on the character that is actually being available to them.

Which is ultimately what? Which is for example, also let’s say that person Shengyi. Named Shengyi on that cover. Always like having a good uniform in a way representing something. Yes. But I’m simply not limited to only this type of representation. And this is something really, really important in general now to bring out there to the world.

It is not good, it is not helpful if this idea of putting people on higher pedestal is not a good idea. The idea of raising somebody up to be our guru, raising somebody up to be our master, raising somebody up, oh yes, he is the special one. All of these things are doing exactly the opposite of what I’m trying to bring into the world of what I do believe is the key, especially in these times right now, worldwide.

It is to become aware of the reality and the fake. This is the current situation that we’re in. That the threshold that the line between whether something is real or whether something is artificial or not real. It’s becoming so incredibly slim, that line. This is why at the moment our world seems so fractured. There are the ones which are completely about, let’s go into the nature and then there’s the other fraction which is all about going into the technology, into everything that’s available nowadays. Where ultimately meaning at some point you will be able to just spend your whole life in your living room. Because everything you want to see and want to partially experience, you just call it into your living room is going to be possible at some point in time.

So how do we get to the point? Yeah, exactly because of this. It’s not good if people raise you up and make you unhuman. And this is what is being attacked. So this is number one that takes a little bit the pressure off from me to take it too seriously because I just know they are seeing something, but it’s a fraction of what I am.

This number one second realization at the same time was. It’s also not helpful or wasn’t helpful or let’s say was also a lesson for me. Even the close people, even the very close people in my surrounding that stayed with me for eight, nine years. Sometimes even such close people don’t know who you are can also happen. Hurts double as much as people saying something about you that don’t know you. Now you have people that you thought know you and still they didn’t get you. Also very painful.

So ultimately leading only to one thing. It only leads to one thing. You would have right now, the impression of, so what’s the only way? Just go your way regardless of what people think. In a way. Yes. But have understanding for them and no ill will against them.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Have empathy for their lack of understanding.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes. That is ultimately the only thing that me, as a result, for the current state of being that I took as my consequence. Yes. So be careful. Be very aware. Who are you letting into your circle? And ultimately rely on yourself and maintain your… Sorry to say, but it’s the heart. Maintain the purity of your intention.

The Power of Focus

STEVEN BARTLETT: One of the things that I’ve noticed in your work is that you have this huge emphasis on being able to focus oneself. And when I talked to you about this brick, I think just before we started recording, you said to me that the average person on the street might not be able to break it, but if someone was really, really strong, they might be able to break it. However, the key to breaking this brick isn’t strength necessarily. It’s the ability to really, really focus. And when we talked about the five hindrances, they will sway us from focus, it will distract us from that ability to focus. So you cultivated that ability to focus, which culminates in you being able to smash this brick with your hand. And it’s not necessarily a strength thing. You’re saying it is this connection between mind and body focused at a particular moment?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes.

STEVEN BARTLETT: So can you show me you smashing this brick?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Absolutely.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Do you put the brick in the middle of the blocks, or do you just put it there?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Put it like this.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Oh, see? Okay. Okay. So I chop it down on one side. Okay.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Do you have another brick?

STEVEN BARTLETT: Yeah, there’s another one here. You’re going to pitch your brick.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: One is too easy.

STEVEN BARTLETT: So what were you doing then in the lead up to that?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: You just have your hands, like, here to the front. If I touch you like this and only do here.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Yeah.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: See this? Like, I don’t have a good feeling for you. I don’t have a good feeling for your body. Yeah. Because it’s like, it’s superficial right now. What I do is, like, when I touch you. No. So it’s not this type of touching you. When I touch you, I literally try to sense your body structure. I feel, like, inside you, where is the tension? Where’s the relaxation? Inside the body. So it’s like we call it. I’m reading your body. I’m reading your body. How is it? Where is the energy locked? Where is it dense? Where is it loose?

So the same I do with the stone. But when I touch the stone, I literally feel inside. Like sounds funny, but I feel inside the structure of the stone. I feel the density of the stone in my fingers and then I just see, okay, now I know how the energy is going to come down. I know how the energy is going to come down. And then I just like see how does it fit together. So on the one side I feel the structure of the stone, on the other side I know what type of energy is going to come in those two. I combine and then I just boom, do it. That’s it.

STEVEN BARTLETT: And how does that translate to life generally?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Good question.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Because we, you know, it’s not a problem I have day to day. But that ability to understand the energy of something and the structure of something and then really understand, be able to cultivate your own focused energy when you need it.

Applying Focus to Life

MASTER SHI HENG YI: I do. So do you need to have this ability to live a proper life? I don’t think so. But somebody who is able to break the stone like this definitely possesses some type of skill set, raises the probability that you can do something with that mindset in your daily life. Which means already the only way to do this is you know what consistency means, you know what patience means. You also know what like endurance means or like training means in all of these character attributes that make it possible to break the stone. Just also builds the foundation, I would say, to integrate this now into other areas of life.

Yeah. So it’s not about the breaking of the stone, but at the same time it’s also an expression of look, the human, your body is capable of doing a lot of things and this is just one of them. There are so many extraordinary abilities that people can do nowadays, but all of them have one thing in common. You have a vision and you find a proper way how to nourish that vision, that the vision becomes real. Similar like this.

STEVEN BARTLETT: So this is a consequence of.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes.

STEVEN BARTLETT: A long journey of several character traits and attributes which you’ve cultivated over a long period of time. And this is just a symptom or a consequence of those things.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: You know, that’s exactly the thing. Similar like, you know, when nowadays you look at any type of competition, sports, the event itself, the competition is being recorded. That one minute performance. Yeah. Or that nine rings or that three minutes.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Yeah.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: But everything that makes it possible for them to perform in that one minute on that show, nobody sees what is lying in front of there. Similar like this. Yeah. It’s with less than one second, the stone is broken. Yeah. But took like a few years to be able to do that one second.

STEVEN BARTLETT: And how long would it take me to learn how to do two bricks like you just did? Then how long do you think you would have to spend training me?

The Physical Training

MASTER SHI HENG YI: You’re looking at my hand because it’s important. Because it’s literally not only about. It’s not just about the focus of the mind. It literally is also about building the density now physically speaking, the density of the bone structure. So I can just give you, if you like, a little example. What we do is this part and this part of the arm, we just smash it like this.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Oh my gosh. This is like a.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So like this.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Okay.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Then you just try like one. Come just.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Oh, my God. Yours is like steel.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yeah. And this is what it is. Yeah. So it is changing you. If you want, you can like touch. You can feel it.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Yeah, it’s like steel. Mine’s like polystyrene. In comparison to that. Well, it was just feels like steel. It felt like I was hitting a bar or something. Okay. So you’ve got to build up the strength.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Still, to answer the question, I do think three months, but dedicated training. Yeah.

STEVEN BARTLETT: And what would that training look like?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So right now, as I explained before, this is why I also, like in the book I mentioned one of the grandmasters that I also learned a lot of the methods from. This is now let’s say it’s a stone.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Yeah.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Stone belong to the family of Earth because. Okay. Earth. Now in Asian tradition we have like the five elements or the five transition phases. Wood, earth, metal, fire, water, like these five elements. So the proper training starts with the so called wood training.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Okay.

Conditioning the Body Through Elements

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So we are using a lot of wooden material to actually condition our body. You’re not going to break stones. You break like first of all wooden things. After wood is no problem for you, then we go to the next layer which is going to be stone. This was this one, for example. After stone comes metal. And so like this, we go through all the layers until your body has increased in its abilities. You know the frequency of wood, you know the frequency of stone, you know the frequency and vibration of metal. And this is how we increase our ability to just be able to actually maintain our strength in the field of all five elements.

STEVEN BARTLETT: You can break metal or you can hit metal.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: You can hit metal.

STEVEN BARTLETT: You can hit metal. Okay.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: You can hit metal.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Thank you. Fascinating.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Thank you.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Thank you so much. Thank you.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: You’re welcome.

The Virtues of Shaolin Tradition

STEVEN BARTLETT: I was really thinking a lot about these virtues. In Shaolin tradition, virtues are a guiding system in both martial arts and daily life. Shaolin warrior practices thinking deliberately and mindfully about the virtues of everyday life for his or her life. And there are two categories of virtues. The virtues to be expected and the virtues to be learnt. What are these virtues that you speak about in the Shaolin tradition?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Prior to somebody entering now, let’s say into the temple and wants to learn from there. First of all, we also as teachers want to find out what does the character of that personality already possesses. And these are, for example, what we are looking for are ultimately the virtues to be expected. Virtues to be expected are, for example, self control, a certain amount of self control, a certain amount of discipline.

STEVEN BARTLETT: So self control, what does that mean in this context? If I’m self controlled, what am I?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: You don’t let your emotions run over you. You don’t even if something makes you angry. But in this context, it’s not honorable, it’s not respectful to now shout out, you shouldn’t do it. You should be able to maintain your emotional states, maintain your temper, let’s say also at least to a certain extent. This is where I would say it comes to self control.

STEVEN BARTLETT: And the second one you said was discipline.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So discipline, meaning you have, like I said, even if it’s called the virtues to be expected, expected means they should be visible somehow, but not to the fullest extent to what people are capable of discipline. Just meaning this understanding that if you come to the temple life, you know, it’s going to be difficult to wake up every day at the same time, and then start to go through the daily structure. So it needs some type of commitment, let’s say. I know it’s hard, but I’m willing to do it. This type of discipline, this is also, in a way, expected. And then another one is simply to be benevolent as well.

STEVEN BARTLETT: So that’s kindness and compassion for your brothers and sisters.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Kind of it goes, yeah. The virtues sometimes swim into each other, but this idea of, why do we have these virtues in the first place? And again, it’s like in Star Wars the Force, what you’re learning, the cultivation of energy, the skills that you are learning, these are very, very powerful things. But what makes the difference between somebody possessing this power and using it for the sake of humanity or somebody using it not for the betterment of humanity? It’s the character. The power is the same. It’s the character. It’s the carrier of the power. It’s the one who is responsible to hold this power, to maintain this power, that one must be trained as well. And this is where the virtues hit in. The virtues are building the framework of the power character of the Avatar. Ultimately, that is then receiving all different types of training, skill training that we, at least in the Shaolin tradition, we would say it’s good to know them.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Same in business, really. I looked at a lot of these virtues and I thought, they’re all the kinds of things that we’re looking for in a good team member. So discipline, self control, modesty, benevolence, humility, respect, righteousness, trust, loyalty, willpower, perseverance, persistence, courage, and patience.

The Three Categories of Virtues

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So ultimately, like I said before in the Shaolin traditional texts is broken down into 14 different virtues. Four of them to be expected, another five virtues of action, another five virtues of the mind. Just simply when you will later on fly through it again. The virtues of action, what does it mean, virtues of action? It is, how should you behave? Behave in a loyal way, behave in a trustful way, behave in a respectful way, behave in a courageous way. So this is how should you do something?

And the virtues of mind, for example, they say, what is it that nourishes the way for you to put the virtues of action into practice? How can you learn to behave respectfully? Because naturally, if people like insulting you, you don’t behave respectfully towards them. So how can you still behave respectfully, still be loyal to people? How do you do it? Well, then this is where it then comes to the virtues of the mind to really learn, to be patient, to really know what does it mean to be persistent, to persevere during your training? And this is ultimately how I would describe it to easily understand.

Spiritual Beliefs and Oneness

STEVEN BARTLETT: Do you believe in a God or do you believe in a religion? If someone asked you which religion do you follow? What would your answer be?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: I would call it the religion of oneness. The religion of oneness. I do believe that we are connected in some way and it is my journey. I don’t want to just intellectualize it. The path is to lay out and remove all the friction and all the obstacles to just realize that it is like this.

This is maybe also like a very essential point along the complete line. Whether somebody reads the book or whether somebody watches all these type of YouTube channel. I myself always grew up in the need to attain something, to add something up on top of my life. This tradition, the whole tradition I’m talking about is actually quite the opposite. That’s why in the latest videos or publications, for example, I often mention that actually there is nothing I can give to anyone. It’s not that you miss something in your life. Remember you’re not in a lack, but in the moment where it feels like we are meeting and I give you something. When you even think that I’m giving you something and you are about to receive something, that’s not the right state of mind already. I have nothing to give you. The only thing that I really try to do is take stuff away from you, take things away from you that are covering that you see that you are complete.

STEVEN BARTLETT: What things tend to cover us that need to be taken away?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Everything that builds up identity, everything that builds up a stronger and stronger identity. Everything that you keep from the past in your mind. The more that you keep the past in the mind, the stronger your identity is. I do think this is one correlation that also goes hand in hand. The more you keep past elements inside your mind, the less likely you will be able to break free into the future and open up for the possibilities that this lifetime might still have for you.

Finding Peace Rather Than Happiness

STEVEN BARTLETT: Are you happy?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: It’s a difficult question. I’m not searching for happiness. I’m searching for peace. So my state of what I’m aiming for, I would say it is peace. Because happiness for me, taken by this word, if there’s happiness, there is sadness. If something can rise, something must fall. If you can attain something, there’s something to lose that’s why it’s difficult. That’s why I stopped the moment. I don’t know what type of happiness you mean. Being satisfied with where I’m standing. Yes. Does it mean that I don’t have hard moments? I have hard moments. And that’s why for me, like what is it I ultimately look for? I would call it. It’s just peace.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Are you at peace more and more?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes, more and more and more.

STEVEN BARTLETT: What’s in the way of your peace?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: I would call it karmic relations. Karmic connections that you just think like you cannot avoid them, you cannot avoid them anymore.

STEVEN BARTLETT: What is karmic connections?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Karmic connection. Meaning because your mother gave birth to you automatically, whatever your mother is doing or not doing, however, the state of health of your mother is going to affect you in a way. So there are sometimes people in this world, you have a closer karmic relation towards them. So what they are doing is also going to affect you. And in my case, it’s the same.

So, meaning, literally, real life speaking. So my son, yes, he is a very strong karmic relation. He’s on the one side, my own flesh and blood together with my beloved. But it also means the way how my son feels, it is affecting me. And this is something that I still need to regulate, learn to regulate. Which also sometimes means, I mean, if you only sleep like two hours per night, then it is like this. But you have good training to still maintain your peace afterwards. But it is. These are simple things. Yes.

Daily Practices and Morning Routine

STEVEN BARTLETT: And what is your practice in terms of your routines? What you do every day that brings you back to yourself so that you can regulate yourself? From the moment you wake up in the morning? Are there any routines that you try and execute every day?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Number one is one of the first things is really try as often as you can to remind yourself and put yourself in that proper state of what you think you are. I wake up and try to not already have any type of thought from yesterday in my mind. I try to wake up empty. Let’s call it like this. And meaning also try to at all moments immerse myself as much as I can in the present moment. That’s what it is. Live in the here and now.

How you do this to live in the here and now, stop jumping into the past and stop jumping into the future. Then you live in the here and now. But you must practice it. And literally meaning how you do it, make yourself empty. Because the only thing that fills your mind with past and future is your thoughts. The Mind.

STEVEN BARTLETT: So if I watched you for the first hour when you woke up in the morning, what would I see?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: On a typical day, I wake up and sit on the sofa and still just sit. So just being awake and just breathe, literally just realizing, slowly scanning my own body from the inside, going through the body so really making sure in a way that everything that’s going to come up during this day is being perceived very consciously. I slowly build up my energies, prepare. This is how I would call it. It doesn’t look very special looking from the outside. Unless I wake up and the son is asking for something, then of course I have my duties to do. But if I can really have my day after waking up still the next hour is still I spend alone. This is what I prefer to do.

STEVEN BARTLETT: And do you do exercise in the morning?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes.

STEVEN BARTLETT: What do you do?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Push ups, sit ups and standing practice.

STEVEN BARTLETT: What? Standing practice?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Partially. It’s also. Some of them are like mentioned in the book, but literally it is what it sounds like. I choose one position that I’m standing in and then I hold that position for 15 minutes.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Why?

Building Energy Through Willpower

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So let’s take all the spiritual part out of this because there are some positions that are looking so strange that at some point I also ask myself, how would somebody even invest his lifetime standing and putting yourself through such a position? Well, there must be a reason why in ancient times it is kept as a secret practice to stay like this. And since I discovered it, I do have to say that it’s not this one. At some point, the squatting monkey is called. This is a practice that builds up what we call energy.

How do you build up energy? It is by giving your mind something where you need to have willpower to maintain it. Willpower and development of energy go hand in hand with each other. The will to live, the will to keep going. The will. The will, strong will, iron will. Energy is also very high. And so literally some of these positions are so demanding on the body that in order to maintain this position you have to have will. You need to create something about yourself where you are pushing yourself. And this is when we have time. I show you the exercise and this is why I do it.

STEVEN BARTLETT: So how important is that for everybody’s life to do hard things, do you think? Because it’s very easy not to do hard things in the comfort world we live in.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: When I mention it, and then you directly look up in a way to me or any professionals who then do this type of training, of course, it’s beyond any normal person’s abilities, but it’s not about you need to learn and do the hard stuff like this. But one thing is for sure, this lifetime, living a life as a human, definitely it’s not easy. Let’s put it like this. Living this lifetime is not easy. The more wishes you have, the more difficult it becomes. The more ambitious you are, the more you will have to face.

So bottom line is, I do think that in the moment where you just on a regular basis, put yourself consciously and willingly in different situations and circumstances that actually represent a little bit the structures of life, there are moments in this lifetime where you are going to be super tense, super tense. And then it’s good to know already how does it feel and what is it that you can do well to learn and release the tension. That’s why releasing tension is also a big part of the exercises.

The one thing is learning to release tension. The other thing is, like when you are too sloppy, when you’re too slacky, how to increase your tension, how to increase the energy level again for you to get back into structure again. So it’s always this balance. And ultimately, how does it help people to know the hard stuff? Well, because I do think that it is symbolizing this way of life. It is symbolizing the patterns of what you are going to go through in this lifetime.

STEVEN BARTLETT: And so you are almost training to do hard things, because hard things are an inevitability of the life we live in.

Walking Through the Valley of Pain

MASTER SHI HENG YI: This training that I went through for the moment, maybe take all the spiritual part out, simply the kung fu training, the Shaolin kung fu training, there is a saying which is Shaolin kung fu, literally means walking through the valley of pain. So what does it mean when you are doing stretching, stretching, stretching, it’s going to be painful. When you are doing strength training, it’s going to be painful. When you do conditioning training, it’s going to be painful.

So the whole path on this martial art journey, it is just filled with working yourself up to the level of where it feels uncomfortable, getting some consistency into the practice until the point where that uncomfortable feeling just started disappearing. Why? Because somehow you broke that initial comfort zone.

But then it doesn’t end now, next level, until you’re building up. First of all, yeah, whatever we’re doing later on, I will show you some practices is not that I do not feel pain, I also feel pain. Maybe I feel it later. But the essential part is that my connection, my relation between the pain of the body towards what would it affect in the way of how I take my decisions? That is a different one.

I feel the pain, but at the moment I feel the pain. But I see no necessity to still change something about my way right now. Why? Because I can take the pain. Whereas when you are not used to this pain, you feel it and then it tells you, let’s say it’s painful. The mind says, okay, it’s not good. And so you directly change something. And this is just the difference. So it’s not that I became numb. No. I just feel there is an additional layer that I can observe about myself. It is painful, but it’s okay for right now.

STEVEN BARTLETT: And that’s a habit you’ve learned, I guess, over time. That’s a process you’ve learned, which is you still have the same stimulus, the same feeling, but you tell yourself, you’ve learned to tell yourself a different story about that feeling, or you’ve turned, you believe something differently about that feeling. Many people would feel the pain of, I don’t know, starting a new career journey, starting a business, whatever might be painful. And they would tell themselves the story that that means they are not good enough or they shouldn’t do it, or that it’s a threat and they might stop. Whereas because you’ve cultivated this new relationship with pain, you’re able to do these things and tell yourself a better story.

Extending Your Comfort Zone

MASTER SHI HENG YI: I spent my lifetime, for some part, to really wanting to build up my body and build up the skills related to the field of martial arts. So I want to build this up. Other people want to build up their business. I do think there is something similar in the way of building up.

When I build up my body, how do I really build up? How do I make my body grow? It only works if I find a continuous way of exposing my body to situations outside of the comfort zone of what I know. Elsewise, it wouldn’t be called growth if I every day just do something towards the body that the body already knows how to do. There’s nothing growing.

So the idea of understanding where is the comfort zone of my body, then on a regular basis, very little. Must not be a big jump, but very little. Extending this comfort zone until the body naturally takes it as a habit. In raising the bar of where your comfort zone actually is, always a little bit, always a little bit, always a little. But this only is possible, I think, by what’s called going over your limits.

But now comes the thing. You can go over the limits by really exaggerating at risking to be injured or you make the idea of going over the limit consciously aware, carefully still going over the limit, but in a still controlled way. Let’s say you know, it’s the limit now, but at the same time, at some point you also realize our bodies, our mind is so intelligent before the. When we are stretching, at some point, you feel like everything’s going to rip apart. But I know, and this is why if we would stretch, even though you say, ah, it hurts, I know we can still go more, you think, but I just know, because your body is so intelligent that before something serious really happens, he tells you way before that that be careful.

And this figuring out where is really this limit, this is what makes the difference. There is a limit. Yes, but this limit still has a range of where we can still move inside. Yes. And I do think that this as a general line applies to everything if you want to grow. And step by step, by doing so, the comfort zone extends.

So how is something new supposed to enter into your life? Well, there’s only one way, exactly the way that many people are also afraid of right now. Going to the unknown. But that’s exactly what it is. If this table is our comfort zone and you just stay on here, you will never know how beautiful London streets are. If you just stay here, you need to go into the unknown. You need to slowly walk your find your way out here.

But that means that going into the uncertainty is nothing bad for me. I’m really, really happy uncertainty is existing in this world because I cannot imagine how boring it would be if I would already know with certainty where I’m going to be in 20 years.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Is there something practical one can do to get better at stepping outside of their comfort zone? Because in our everyday lives, stepping outside of our comfort zone might just mean putting our hand up in a meeting or doing a public talk, or starting an Instagram page for our cupcakes. Or it could be small things, it could be learning how to run. What’s the first sort of small step one should take to develop that habit of being okay in the uncertainty of our growth zone?

Breaking Free from Fear

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Some people say, just start reading. I do think that people who do like reading, this is something meaning always look for something new to learn. Always realize that the things able to still be discovered is way bigger than what you think you know. And that means exactly the way of how you also describe it now. Exactly the last 20 times, you stay quiet the next time you raise your hand, whatever it is, just don’t stay in the old patterns. Break the cycle. This is where I would say a great potential lies in.

STEVEN BARTLETT: The thing that holds us back is fear.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes.

STEVEN BARTLETT: How do we overcome that fear?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So am I fearless? No. Do I fear a lot of things? No. I do think there’s only one thing that ultimately makes you break free from fear, which is to find a way and wake up from that dream. You don’t take things too seriously in this lifetime to just change. Let’s put like this. Change your perspective, rationalize things if you like. It’s similar. Fear and worry. Yes.

At least when I look at my worries I had in the last month, well, for sure, 80%, 90% of all the worries just didn’t happen in the first place. 10% might somehow came true. But then again I asked myself, good, so the 10% that came true, even so I had the worries, what could I do about it? Coming to the conclusion, nothing. Nothing.

And then something just really started to shift inside of me where I literally let go of something. Let go of this idea that everything is like one directional, that everything that you’re going to encounter in this lifetime is going to be beautiful. Everything in this lifetime is going to be peaceful. Everybody you’re going to meet along your journey is going to be well hearted towards you. No, it’s not.

Because in the moment where you have well hearted people, you have ill willed people, and in the moment where there is success, where you want to be part of the success story, you’re going to be part of the failing story. And in the moment where you want to be part of the light story, you’re going to be part of the dark story. This is how it is. This is the world of what we call the world of Yin and yang. This is the world of birth and death, of aging and sickness. And this is why in the ancient traditions more and more even nowadays, why in the first place, there is this whole idea about liberating yourself, breaking free and all of these things.

The Five Hindrances and the RAIN Method

STEVEN BARTLETT: We were talking about the five hindrances, and the first of those was the sensual desires which we talked about. And the second was ill will. The third is dullness, lack of motivation to move forward in life. And the fourth is restlessness, unable to focus on the present moment. And the fifth is skeptical doubt, indecisiveness and not trusting yourself. And to overcome the five hindrances, you recommend the four Step RAIN method. What is the four Step RAIN method?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes, I do think it’s called RAIN method. That has also been taught to me because it’s easy to remember what is it that you’re supposed to do. Like I said, in this context of putting it simple, you have set yourself a goal. There are five mental states that could make it difficult for you to reach that goal. Those five mental states are these five hindrances.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Could you read those out for me again?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So sensory desire, sensual desire here, ill will, dullness, sloth topper or restlessness. And then ultimately indecisiveness or self doubt.

Now, what does the RAIN method tell you? Number one, it tells you with the R, Recognize, recognize or realize. So along your journey, every day, just sitting somewhere, contemplating, learn to realize. In which mental state are you actually finding yourself right now? This is just the recognition, the realization of where you are.

The A stands for acknowledge or acceptance. So even you know the second one was called ill will or actually it’s called aversion to denying something, pushing something away from you. Very important right now. Same here. You recognize something inside of you about you. Of course, second one. Accepting it, acknowledging it is important.

Yes, I. Meaning now, investigation. Investigation meaning okay, I see I am. I see I’m dull. I see I’m like. I see I’m restless. Okay, I accept that I have this feeling right now. Now investigation meaning okay, what is it like? How did I get into this state? Have I been there this morning already in that state of being? No, this morning I really felt good. So what happened now since the morning until now that put me in this state of restlessness? To who did I talk to? Was it a message that I received? What is it ultimately that led to this feeling of restlessness? So we investigating like a detector investigating.

And ultimately the N, difficult one, but it is standing for non-identification. So a non-identification, meaning I mentioned it before. Even if you just use it as a picture right now, as a concept if you want. But try not to identify your being too much with your body and too much with the mind. And if you don’t identify with the body and not identify yourself too much with the mind, also you do not identify yourself too much with all the things that you investigated that you felt like were nourishing your restlessness.

A Message for the Future

STEVEN BARTLETT: If you had one last message to share, and that message was a message you had to share for your son. Because one day the inevitability of life means that you do have to have one last conversation. And we don’t always get to choose what that one last conversation is. But if you do get to choose that last conversation with your 3-month-old son, once he’s able to process it a little bit better, so he was 18 years old, what would that message be?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Concepts are concepts, theories are theories. Be careful or be aware of what you are keeping or what are you nourishing in the mind. Never restrict yourself to any concept, never restrict yourself to any identity, never restrict yourself to any type of role. What you create, you create. And you can create quite a lot of things. Yeah, something along these lines, probably.

The Impact of Losing His Father

STEVEN BARTLETT: I read that when you lost your father, that had quite a profound impact on your life and your way of understanding the world. Your father passed away from cancer when you were sort of roughly 28 years old. It was roughly around 2012. And this, I read, gave you a deeper sense of purpose. How did that impact you as a man?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Just imagine, like when I talked before about enduring things going through my childhood and always receiving, let’s say, to never be enough. But still, I mean, still I had this internal fire going to still always give my best, but for the sake of my parents. And so, yeah, from the age of four, elementary school, give your best. High school, give your best. Studying. Give your best. Study again. Okay, I do again. So all the time. Not because I necessarily wanted all of this, just because for the sake of my parents, for the sake of. They are the ones who allowed me in the first place to, in a way, be alive also thanks to them.

So this was, in a way, my expression of what they say. As long as they are alive, I listen to them. And then walking all the way up to this academic education, then finally graduating after 20 years. And then I just returned from the graduation back to Kaiserslautern, the city where I lived, and that was the last year I spent with my father.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Yeah.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So literally meaning spending so many years in this academic education for my father, and now he’s not even there to witness that it has been done for him. Now, this was like a point where I thought, like, yeah, this was the one area that stuck somehow a little bit hard.

And then the next things, I call it maybe small, but it’s not so small, apparently, because I grew up in, let’s say, this Asian tradition with, let’s say, different type of beliefs or rituals or ceremonies that we do. One of these things was that when my father was still lying in hospital and it was clear that it’s just going to take a few days until he would pass away, he, for example, also said, well, he only said it to me because he knows I would be the only one who is able to do it. Don’t cry for me. Because he couldn’t say to my mother, she cannot handle it. Couldn’t say to my brother, but because I trust in the tradition.

The reason why not to cry when my father passed away is because we do think the body is there. The body passes away, the spirit sets itself free. And when the Spirit simply realizes that all the sons are there, the families there crying. The spirit, in a way, is still bound to this realm, bound to the earth realm, let’s say. And in order to be able to help my father actually to move on quicker, that was the reason why it is sometimes so important to don’t show any grief in the moment when a beloved one passes away.

But all of these things. Spending so many years for my father, then he’s not there to realize it, then not being able to cry, and then being in all this very hard field and always overachieving and no problem working 16 hours a day. Well, these are all the things that made it possible to be where I am right now. But at the same time, I just do feel like, especially in the moment now when my son started to come and all of these things, I just felt like there’s a lot blocked there or there’s a lot that still needs to be released for the sake of my son.

Seeking Recognition

STEVEN BARTLETT: What is it you needed and when did you need it?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: I would call it recognition. Being recognized by my father at some point to finally somehow say, you did well, is enough. But it didn’t come until today, so I still keep going. I never heard it from my father, from a mother. I also don’t hear it well, maybe in a different way. But I do think it is the father’s recognition that you probably aim for. These are absolutely things that do shape my character. For sure.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Many people will be able to relate in their own ways, and maybe their parents have now passed on or are no longer with us. I’m wondering if there is a way to hear it from yourself.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes, there is. There is. And again, this leads to the fact of sometimes it’s very, very helpful to really shut the world out of you and spend time with yourself and actually create what you think you were missing there. Create it because you’re the one who creates it. That’s exactly what I do think that when we were speaking about it right now, of course, we could say that what is it that I was looking for from my father? Fact is, I’m not going to hear it from him anymore. So I need to hear it of course, by myself. And this is where it comes to all these type of practices and methods that many specialists now, they also like emphasizing, regardless of how you call them.

STEVEN BARTLETT: And what are those sentences in particular? That if I was your father, you would want me to say to you right now?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Well, it’s something like, you did well, you did enough. I see what you are doing. But now take your energy back and give it to your son. Give him everything that you feel you didn’t receive from me.

STEVEN BARTLETT: If you heard those words from him, how do you think you would change?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: I do think there will be change and I do think there is already change. This is maybe like the path where specialists nowadays would say is not necessarily an area of the conscious mind. I do think that these are talks right now more dealing with what’s subconsciously stored inside our mind. I think this is where it plays a role.

Especially when it’s about patterns that come up. It’s not consciously. When you’re conscious enough, you can regulate already a lot. It’s the subconscious things that you are not aware of that are still a part of your life. And if you wouldn’t have asked about my father, I wouldn’t even think about him for one month is all not a problem. But I do still think that these are like very deep layers that just translate a lot unconsciously into the way of doing things, way of how I see things also. And this is where I feel like it probably would help.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Have you grieved his passing?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes, yes, I do think at some extent when the 49 days, that’s the period of where it’s normally said don’t grieve at that time, 49 days afterwards. I did, yes. But probably there’s still a lot more to release.

STEVEN BARTLETT: You’ve written this wonderful book which describes the way to self mastery. And it’s a really transformative book that I highly recommend everybody checks out. I’m going to link it below. When we talk about self mastery, what is it you mean? What is it to master oneself?

The Master Within

MASTER SHI HENG YI: So growing up, like I said, in this field of martial arts, I met a lot of masters, I met a lot of grandmasters. I always went looking for other instructors, looking for somebody outside of myself to be a mentor, to be a guide for me. But at some point, always realizing that everybody, no matter who it was, they possessed some type of skill that I wanted to learn from them.

But there was one thing that in a way none of them could help me with, and that was how do I run my own life? I can learn skills from you, I can learn skills from here, I can improve in this area, in this area. But putting all these skills, putting all this knowledge, putting all the advice, putting it into a structure into a frame and then to run my own life with it. There’s only one person who can do this. Yourself.

And this is where I meant that. Don’t rely on a master for him to run your life. Don’t rely on a mentor, a guide, whatever to run your life. This whole journey is about you. Learn and acquire the skills and acquire the knowledge and acquire whatever you think is necessary to bring out the best version. Let’s call it like this. The best refined potential about yourself, about what you believe you are capable of bringing out about yourself.

Meaning the master is already sitting inside of each individual. It’s just that we don’t nourish that master inside of us enough.

STEVEN BARTLETT: And who in particular at this moment in time do you believe would benefit most from the message inside the covers of this book?

Don’t Outsource Your Well-Being

MASTER SHI HENG YI: The more you feel like your well-being about yourself is being dependent on any third parties, anything outsourced. So if the government, you feel like, if any decision from the government affects you, read the book. If your colleagues at work affect you by what they say and what they think, that’s also something.

Every time when you have the feeling your well-being is dependent on something that you feel you have no influence in. Because this is exactly, this is the antidote. This book is literally telling: Don’t outsource your well-being to anything that you cannot influence or control. Which literally means place the emphasis and the foundation of your well-being only on things that you have influence on. Which one is that? Your body and your mind.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Of all the things we’ve discussed today, is there anything, anything at all that you think is the most important thing that we missed for the person that sat there at home? And I’ll give you a persona of the person they are, they’re feeling a little bit lost in their life. They’re feeling like they could do more. They’re maybe lacking in purpose and meaning in their life a little bit. They’re struggling in various areas with their relationships, maybe a little bit with work. And they’re feeling the normal pressures of life that we all feel. Is there anything for that person that’s listening now and that’s gotten this far in the conversation that you might see in their ear right now?

The Journey to Success

MASTER SHI HENG YI: It’s sometimes really nice to see the full picture. The full picture of me is I didn’t start like being on the cover of the book. I didn’t start like having all the abilities and skills that I have nowadays. I didn’t start with all the social media channels as they are right now. I started actually in the poorest area of that city in Kaiserslautern that until today is known to be like the area where people do not like to go. This is where I come out from.

So was my life always easy? Well, I don’t think so. But there are just a few fundamental things that meanwhile, after like 40 years, meeting people, talking with people, looking into the world, being able to actually see some type of structures in the world, I do believe that what you might call successful people or people that somehow made it in whatever way you think is made it, I do think they have something in common.

There is something in common amongst them. And one thing that I would definitely say is to really be able to endure is one area really having that persistence. Even though, okay, today is not working, everything goes wrong. Yeah. But not cutting it off, like suddenly this type of persistence and consistency, like just knowing and trusting. Okay, let’s do it again. So literally, trial and error, hard times, good times. To just understand that this life is—

STEVEN BARTLETT: Like this up and down.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: There is an up and down. The success doesn’t come without the failure. The brightness right now that is being seen from people. Yeah. But there’s another side that built the foundation for people nowadays to shine. And just to understand. A lot of things is possible, but it’s never one directional.

Identifying Your Next Area of Growth

And now to put things really literally into practice, one of the easiest things. How do I know what should be the next? What should I do tomorrow? What should I do tomorrow?

Okay, look at yourself and ask yourself what is the most disturbing, whatever it is from the last week in your life? What is disturbing you about your life the most from the last week? You can even extend it to what is it? Which emotional state is it that followed you primarily in the last one month?

And then maybe investigating. Okay, what is it that brings up that emotion, that state inside of you? Is it somebody who triggers it? Is it something that triggers it? So really boil it down to the point that you actually see. This is what blocks me right now in my life. This is literally what blocks me in my life. I want to move into the future, but this here, it follows me. It blocks me. It takes my energy. It’s this one. I can literally see it. That is the one.

Now invest all of the energy to figure out the solution for this one. Because if you took care of this already the last half year, the chances are very, very high you’re going to have it the next half year, which means you’re going to have it already for one year. And if you do nothing about it, it’s going to be two years and it’s going to be three years. And in three years, you still sit there and complain that you were not able to move on. Yes, because it’s the same pattern and it is the same hindrance still in the life.

And this is, for example, how I know what is my next area of development, the one that, let’s say, shakes me the most at the moment. If I think about, literally I think about, is it something in the business area that shakes me? No. Is it something in the family area that shakes me? No. Is it something in the relationship area that shakes me? And like this you find out, okay, that is the next one. Let’s tackle it.

And so we will always find something that in a way, like we would say, we could optimize. And I do believe that in the moment where you say, no, I have arrived, I think then there’s really nothing to be done. Then, just to be free.

Greatest Regret

STEVEN BARTLETT: We have a closing tradition on this podcast where the last guest leaves a question for the next guest, not knowing who they’re going to be leaving the question for, and the question that has been left for you is, what is your greatest regret?

MASTER SHI HENG YI: I would say that 40 years, whatever I said and whatever decision I took in the last 40 years, I could always stand behind it. I pushed decisions through and I gave commands to do it the way that I wanted, because behind it, my mind was always supporting all of this.

Just in the recent months, I had to take a decision. I would have wished to have a little bit more time to make it, to make the transition more pleasant, but I couldn’t. I had no choice. And so despite of not feeling that it is the right way to do it, I still had to do it. And this is what I regret.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Like firing someone, letting someone go kind of like this.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Yes.

STEVEN BARTLETT: Thank you. Thank you so much for the message you’re putting out into the world. Because it’s an increasingly necessary message. Because I think we’re all searching for answers and for a variety of different reasons. And your message, as I read it throughout the book, the striking thing about it is it’s a simple one, but that doesn’t mean it’s an easy one. But it’s a very, very necessary one.

And for anyone that does relate to the things we’ve described today and the situations we’ve described, that people are feeling at the moment. I’d highly recommend you give this book a try because it is a completely different message. So thank you for writing such an incredible book and thank you for the wisdom that you’ve put out into the world. I highly recommend everybody goes and checks out your YouTube channel because there’s much more content there and you’re a real star on YouTube. Your TED talk is a smash hit sensation that’s changed millions of people’s lives as well. So thank you again for your time today. It’s been a huge honor.

MASTER SHI HENG YI: Thank you, Steven, for the invitation. Appreciated having this conversation.

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