Transcript: What the Bible Says About Red Meat, Pork, Dairy, and Bread – Jordan Rubin

I remember reading a book years ago that talked about how a biblical diet is really more eating vegan. I know that I’ve read other books that have said otherwise.

Why is this book that you’ve written so different in terms of biblical eating and biblical medicine? And how do you think very differently about biblical medicine?

JORDAN RUBIN: Josh, what has amazed me over the years, and I know you agree 100%, I read the Bible every day. Mostly it’s on audio now. I’m an audible learner. Some aspects of technology have been life changing and this is one of them for me. I can’t believe that 10, 20, 30 years of reading the same book that you could receive new revelation the way that we have. And that’s what blows my mind.

People that read the Biblio diet are truly going to learn to live long, master metabolism, fight depression, reduce pain and conquer cancer with healing secrets from the Bible. And someone might say, “But Jordan, if you’ve written biblical books before, the maker’s diet, et cetera, and you’ve read the same book hundreds of times, how is their new revelation?”

All I can say is people are going to be blown away because today we’re going to touch on some of the information that will show that thousands of years teaching what you mentioned – the vegan diet as being biblical, talking about red meat being unhealthy – we are going to blow the lid off of some of these misconceptions. And for anyone watching who believes the Bible is the word of God, we are going to show them the unequivocal truth of how they can restore their health and unlock that potential that God has for all of us.

The Biblio Diet vs. The Paleo Diet

DR. JOSH AXE: I know one of the reasons why you and I wanted to create a diet based on the Bible, the Biblio diet, is that for so many years, people promoted Paleo. And I remember at first I thought, am I the only one that just doesn’t like the term the Paleo diet and sort of the underlying ideas behind it?

In fact, I was, to my knowledge, the first person that wrote an article against a Paleo diet. And this was back in, like, 2009, so this is quite a few years ago. But I know it was making it seem – and a mutual friend of ours, actually, who I saw at Lifetime Fitness yesterday here in Nashville, Mark Sisson, was writing that and talking about it. I respect Mark so much, and he’s done so many amazing things.

But I wrote about in that article some of the foods that I disagreed with, everything from pork to alligator. I mean, some of the different foods that are very not kosher and not healthy that were part of the diet. I started talking about how everyone on the Paleo diet is so against eating grains, but yet they’re eating pounds of almonds and saying, even despite the lectins and phytic acid and all this.

So there was a lot of sort of levels of incoherency, I felt like, with that diet. But what is the difference between a biblical diet, the Biblio Diet, and a diet like the Paleo diet?

JORDAN RUBIN: Well, let me first talk about the origin of the name. So another mutual friend of ours, the late Benny Johnson, Pastor Bill Johnson’s wife, wrote a book on fitness and asked me to write the foreword. And as I was reading her book, I said to her, and this is someone I had immense respect for. And I said, “Benny, as a believer, you reference the Paleo diet. I don’t feel comfortable with that because it presupposes millions and billions of years of human evolution.”

Now, I’m not going to talk about Old Earth, New Earth, but this talks about us coming from apes and how our colon evolved and all of that. If you believe that humans were created by God in a more normal timeline, what I would consider normal, Paleo doesn’t work. And I said, “I wish people would talk about Biblio.”

Now, this was 12 years ago, and Biblio obviously rhymes with Paleo, but the idea is biblio means the book. And so when someone reads the Biblio Diet, we’re going to teach them how to eat and live by the book. The Bible was named the Bible because of the word book. It’s not what it’s called in Hebrew, it’s not what it’s called in Greek.

And the health secrets that we reveal, I would say are hidden in plain sight. And I also believe, Josh, that someone watching today who’s been diagnosed with cancer or Crohn’s disease or depression, or they want to lose weight, they’re going to hear something that is going to radically change their life.

And best of all, when people are out there saying, “I’m following a biblio diet,” that is going to bring glory to God. That is the ultimate reason why we wrote this book and why I’m so excited that God will gain the glory for the health revival that’s going to happen. And I love some of the folks that are behind this Make America Healthy Again movement. I think it’s amazing. But I want God to gain the glory. And I’ve always had a heart to see God’s people lead this revival because Great Health was his idea to begin with.

The Church’s Role in Health and Wellness

DR. JOSH AXE: Can I tell you something that’s always bothered me is that, you know, there are so many references in the Bible of God saying, “I’ve called you to be a light to the world. I’ve called you to be the salt of the earth.” And we know that us being a light – and I think part of the thing that when God’s having this conversation with the Israelites, he’s saying to them, “Listen, some of the food laws, some of these things I’m going to have you do. I’m doing it so you can be different.”

And by the way, not different in a bad way, but different in terms of the healthiest, the brightest, the wisest, radically different in a better way than anyone else because of simply because of the principles and the laws that you’re going to follow.

And I think as Christians, we should be the most hungry to be healthy. We should be the most hungry to follow biblical wisdom in the way we run our businesses, the way we parent our children, all these areas. And I went to a Christian school through 8th grade. I grew up going to every Sunday, not just regular service, but Sunday school, Wednesday nights. So doing those things a lot. And the church potlucks. Growing up in the Midwest, in Ohio, I mean, there was just so much bad food that churches are giving out on a regular basis.

And I always wanted the church to be at the forefront of health and wellness. And I will say there’s a lot more pastors today who are willing to do that. I mean, think about it now, compared to 20 years ago, it’s really a different environment. I think about Craig Groeschel. The guy is fit and healthy. You look at guys like Steven Furtick, there’s a lot of others. A lot of these guys are very fit and healthy. And so a lot has changed. I think, even in terms of this generation of pastors and wanting to honor God with their bodies.

JORDAN RUBIN: Absolutely. I wish that your experience as a child has been radically different from today, but I was at a church recently where they said ice creams and Cokes for everybody in the lawn. And the ice cream, you can imagine is a lot less healthy than the ice cream I make or that I recommend. So there’s still work to be done.

But I was speaking to someone this morning, and I was amazed at the fact that you and I are each going to do an interview on Zoom that’s going to air at a five church or five location church. And they’re in their seventh week of speaking about health and nutrition from the pulpit. I don’t think that’s ever happened, at least to my knowledge. So I’m so excited about what’s beginning. That’s why I say there’s a revival in the making related to our health.

And why shouldn’t there be? The church prayer request lists are growing with cancer, with dementia, with heart disease, with diabetes. And I remember a pastor telling me once when someone comes up to me and says, “Pastor, please pray for me to be healthier, to lose weight, et cetera.” And then he started asking them, “Are you sleeping? Are you eating well? Are you following God’s plan for rest?” And they said, “No, no, no.”

And he said, “I don’t want to pray for you. I want to show you the truth and have you go do it. Because it’s not God that needs to do something in our lives in every instance. Sometimes we need to just stick to the plan. Or in this case, eat by the book.”

The Church as a Light to the World

DR. JOSH AXE: Yes, exactly. You know, another thing just I see sometimes in church culture, one of the reasons I love that there are more pastors speaking out and doing some of this now, but there are a lot of pastors who they – because they don’t want to lose members – they don’t want to talk about anything that’s controversial.

When you look at Jesus, he was very controversial. When you look at the apostles, they were very controversial what they were sharing. And even Jesus talking about, somebody’s asking him about tithing or giving to the government and those things, and he’s sharing his direct opinion on those things.

So when it comes to something like the MAHA movement, you know, I’ve been honored to be able to go to Washington, D.C. and be a part of what that is. But even with that, I really, again, this is another area I want the church at the forefront of being able to address these issues.

You mentioned cancer, you mentioned autoimmune disease. I think pastors and church staffs should be talking about the things that are relevant today. Because if somebody doesn’t learn that at church, they’re going to go and learn it from an influencer online or somebody who is oftentimes ethically questionable versus somebody who is supposed to be leading the flock in teaching people how to do these things and allowing people to have access to the truth in some of these ways.

And so I know that you and I are both passionate about speaking at churches and educating God’s people, educating everybody. But specifically, we believe the church should be a light to the world.

The Biblio Diet vs. The Mediterranean Diet

So one of the first questions I have for you is, what does it look like to eat a biblio diet? I had somebody ask me this recently. They said, “Well, is the biblio diet, is that pretty much like the Mediterranean diet?” And I was like, “No, it’s actually not the Mediterranean diet at all.” There’s a few food overlaps, but overall it’s not the Mediterranean diet. It’s actually fairly different.

JORDAN RUBIN: It is. And I think the Mediterranean diet as people see it today is probably a lot different than the Mediterranean diet throughout history. And so when you put a label on a diet or you talk about blue zones, there’s always bias in there.

And I will tell you that in the Bible, people did not consume pork, shellfish, and other detestable animals that God talks about in Leviticus 11, Deuteronomy 14. This is not kosher. This predates kosher. And it really involves God’s definition of food versus filth. He says, “I have called you from all the peoples on the face of the earth to be different.” You had mentioned this earlier. “Therefore, here’s what you should eat, here’s what you shouldn’t eat.” This is because God cares for us.

And here’s the bottom line. Because of a mistranslation in a New Testament scripture where it says, “Thus, he declared all foods clean,” and people use this for time immemorial that we can eat shellfish and pork. Now, bottom line, that is not the case because our body hasn’t changed. And the physiology and anatomy of a pig, a skunk, a rat, and people say, “I would never eat a rat or a skunk.” Well, they do in some parts of the world, Josh, just like they eat dogs and cats, shellfish. That is a no, no, not because of religious reasons or faith reasons, but because it is a simple law like gravity. Those are the trash cans of the world.

The Science Behind Biblical Dietary Laws

DR. JOSH AXE: Well, the other thing is modern science proves this. I mean, there was an article that came out based on a scientific study, and it basically said shrimp are the dirtiest animal of the sea in terms of dioxins, in terms of just holding on to your point, just pathogens.

And then of course, we know pork is the same. It’s the greatest – I mean, anyone can look this up themselves – the greatest carrier of parasites on the planet. You know, I recently recorded a course on cancer and one of the things that really, this really blew my mind, it talked about the number of people that get cancer because of prior parasitic or parasitic co-infections. And of course, if you’re eating pork, your exposure to parasites is extremely high.

JORDAN RUBIN: And that is just one area of issues that pork and shellfish have. In fact, mussels, which are a form of shellfish, they are studied in certain bodies of water to see how toxic the water is because they literally harbor toxins. And if you want to purify a lake, something that has stagnant water, throw shellfish in there and that will do it. Or catfish, which are bottom feeders. So those are the things you don’t eat.

Now obviously there is no template for artificial sweeteners, artificial flavors, hydrogenated oils or processed plant oils. None of that was in the Bible. So we can throw all of those out because they’re man-made, they’re chemical. And I like to say eat what God created for food and eat food in a form that is healthy for the body because you can take a good food God-given and ruin it right through processing.

Three Controversial Biblical Foods

JORDAN RUBIN: But I’m going to give you three foods, Josh, that were absolutely consumed in the Bible at every chance anyone could. And they’re a bit controversial. One is red meat, two is bread, and three is dairy. Think about it. How many diets recommend all three? Very few diets these days recommend any of the three. And I’m constantly watching things and researching like you are. But there is a path to consume some of these foods in an absolutely healthy and healing way.

DR. JOSH AXE: I’m thinking really hard right now. I want everybody to do this. Name a diet out there that includes bread, red meat and dairy, like milk. I mean, some of the traditional homesteaders, I mean, maybe that, but outside of that I can’t. It’s not vegan, it’s not carnivore, it’s not Paleo, it’s not keto, it’s not. It’s none of those diets, right? None.

JORDAN RUBIN: And that’s why the biblical diet has one filter. Josh, what does the Bible say and what does history say are the foods you should and shouldn’t eat? We talk about fasting. Fasting is definitely biblical. And there are ways you can incorporate that we all do anyway. We all have an overnight fast of some form. We talk about biblical mindset, we talk about biblical movement. Right. And ultimately we talk about biblical medicine.

Because I want to give a message that is the truth, as it says in John, and the truth that will set people free. That doesn’t mean there aren’t times to avoid bread. It doesn’t mean that everyone should consume copious amounts of dairy, which I’m sure you’ll tell everyone how much I consume. Because you always marvel at it.

DR. JOSH AXE: Yes, I will.

JORDAN RUBIN: It doesn’t mean you should consume red meat at every meal. But the argument is, if you believe in the Bible and you believe it is the word of God, you cannot say red meat, bread and dairy are unhealthy for a human being.

The Dairy Difference: A1 vs A2 Casein

DR. JOSH AXE: And I think they’ve gotten such a bad rap because they’re so different now compared to 2000 plus years ago. Let’s touch on dairy first. Because when you and I talk about dairy and the sort of dairy we consume, it’s very different than what you’re going to pick up at your conventional grocery store.

And I will tell a story about Jordan here. So Jordan, one of the first – I think we’re in Denver, Colorado. No, Colorado Springs. And we were Garden of the Gods. Right, that’s where…

JORDAN RUBIN: This is where you first introduced me to a friend that might be more of a friend.

DR. JOSH AXE: Oh, that’s where I – Yes, yes. Chelsea and I had just started dating, and yeah, you met Chelsea.

JORDAN RUBIN: It’s like you’re looking at her in a different way than you’re looking at the other chiropractors at the event.

DR. JOSH AXE: That’s right. So we were there at the Whole Foods Market, and I’m doing lunch with you, and I didn’t really do dairy. I still only do it on occasion. I do a little bit. I just, you know, that’s the one food I tend to not tolerate as well. But I still do it some.

But you ate a block of raw cheese? An entire block. Like, it was like – like sometimes when people go and make sandwiches or make meals or maybe like a slice of cheese. Jordan ate a block. I think it was Manchego, like raw sheep’s cheese. It was something like that. And then I think there was other dairy, too. There was a lot of – it was like – it was a very keto meal for sure at the time. And I was just blown away.

JORDAN RUBIN: Well, I just love it, you know. And I don’t love all dairy, but you mentioned sheep. I love sheep dairy and goat dairy and water buffalo dairy. And then now we see dairy in stores that are labeled A2, which is so amazing because years ago I told you, I said, “Josh, I’ve figured out what makes goat and sheep milk more digestible and more tolerable.”

There’s a protein that is dangerous called A1 beta casein, and A2 is what you find in mother’s milk. So that was something we learned about in 2006, almost 20 years ago. And that’s just one example of God’s great idea, because I believe all the livestock that Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, eventually David, Solomon, and Jesus consumed dairy products from produced this dairy that we now call A2 milk for short.

But really it’s a dairy that is the original milk from cows, goats, sheep, water buffalo produces it. And that one change can make a big difference in the dairy you consume and how tolerable. The Bible says in Proverbs, more or less, “There’s a cause for every effect.” And if the Bible says bread is healthy and Jesus is referred to as the bread of life, there must be healthy bread.

DR. JOSH AXE: Well, I think it’s appropriate for this conversation to know that the first book I ever read on this idea between A1 and A2, the book was called “The Devil in the Milk.” I’d love for you to go just a little bit deeper here on what is the difference between A1 beta casein and A2 and how they affect our bodies.

JORDAN RUBIN: Absolutely.

DR. JOSH AXE: When did this change happen?

The Devil in the Milk: Understanding A1 Beta Casein

JORDAN RUBIN: Yes. Well, when I wrote “The Maker’s Diet,” I said that there is something about goat, sheep and water buffalo dairy that’s different than cow’s milk dairy. And I was hypothesizing that it was the size of the protein or there was something that I saw in all of the people that I coached and what I learned and read about that didn’t make sense to me. But I said, “You need to stick with goat and sheep milk dairy if you’re dealing with inflammatory bowel disease or multiple sclerosis or rheumatoid arthritis,” these are the type of people I coached.

In 2006, I learned about this devil in the milk called A1 beta casein. And it’s one of the two principal types of milk protein. And if someone’s wanting to know where in the milk is it? Think of cottage cheese as a curd. So cheese is curd. Whey we know is different than curd. Think of Little Miss Muffet – casein, which is curd, has two dominant types of protein: A1 and A2 beta casein.

A1 beta casein is believed to have come from a genetic mutation. And we hear about genetic mutations more often now than we have. And that genetic mutation, I believe, resulted from selective breeding of cattle. So if we look around in the US we see – I call it the Chick-fil-A cow. That’s the black and white cow that is a Holstein, or in Australia, New Zealand, Holstein-Friesian. I’m a cow guy, a breed guy. I love all this.

That mutation caused an issue in the protein structure of some cows. And America was fixated on that type of cow that is the highest in A1 because they are able to be manipulated. They can tolerate growth hormones and antibiotics, their udders can swell, and they can produce five or six times or ten times the amount of milk a calf needs. This is what the dairy industry did. And now these Holsteins are everywhere.

And I joke because they’re in the Chick-fil-A commercial, “Eat more chicken.” When meanwhile, that’s not even a beef cow. It just happens to look interesting. It’s a dairy cow. So that milk has permeated almost all US dairy. You can count on the fact, if you’re having cheese, if you’re having milk, yogurt from any conventional source and most organic sources, that it has A1 beta casein.

Now, what makes it bad? When you digest A1 beta casein, it breaks down into something called BCM-7 – beta-casomorphine 7. And what does that tell you? Morphine. So it’s an opiate. And research shows by Dr. Keith Woodford, the book you read, “The Devil in the Milk,” he’s the author, that when you consume dairy with A1 and it breaks down into BCM-7 through the amino acid configuration, it is stimulating your gut as many as six times greater than gluten, because gluten or gliadin has a similar effect.

This opioid or opiate response and early diagnoses of celiac disease, which is extreme gluten intolerance was not gut issues. It was night terrors. It was erratic behavior in children. All of the things you think about when you have opioid excitatory response, right? And so think about this. Consuming dairy with A1 could be six times more harmful than gluten.

Now, I’m a dairy guy. I believe we should consume dairy. But the wrong kind of dairy may be one of the worst things you can consume. Whereas A2 beta casein is found in mother’s milk, it’s found in almost every mammal out there except for the modern, predominantly US cow.

DR. JOSH AXE: It’s crazy.

JORDAN RUBIN: Something is insidious here.

Identifying the Right Type of Dairy

DR. JOSH AXE: Yeah, yeah. And so think about it – if you’re a person listening to this and you’ve noticed when you do dairy, okay, it could be milk, it could be even yogurt or cheese that you know what it causes your nose to run a little bit or gas or bloating or joints hurt, you just – or even your mood changes or you don’t sleep well. It could be this devil in the milk, this protein that’s six times more inflammatory than gluten for most people of A1 casein.

You’ll start to see on packaging, we’re starting to see this now. People say A2 milk actually in their products. I remember this, Jordan, because when I learned this years ago, I think it might have been even 2009. It was either from you or reading an article on this by an author online. And so I switched my protein powder. I was doing a whey casein combo at the time, and I started doing a protein called Goatein, which is a goat milk based protein powder.

Back then, when I started learning that and made that change, and then let’s talk about the right type of dairy. Okay, so when somebody’s buying dairy, number one thing they should look for is, is it A2 dairy? And if it’s sheep and goat, you already know what it is. But if it’s cow’s milk, you want to look for it to say A2. What are some of the other critical factors in dairy? If somebody’s going to buy it, you’re just…

JORDAN RUBIN: Assuming I’m going to let you make fun of my product, Goatein and just like move along in the interview.

DR. JOSH AXE: Hey, I use it. I love that.

The Ultimate Dairy: A2, Organic, and Grass-Fed

JORDAN RUBIN: That was an example of. I knew it was better, I just didn’t know what made it better. But when you’re looking for dairy, you’re exactly right. Look for goat, sheep. Water buffalo is one of my favorites. And you can see it in mozzarella cheese and other cheuses. And soon there’s going to be some yogurt you’re going to see. So you know me, I love water buffalo. I raise water buffalo. They’re. But yes, there are multiple brands that have either a 2 or a 2. A 2.

But I want to say something because we’ve been doing research on this for 19 years. You know this. We had the largest herd of A2 dairy at the time 15 years ago, before anyone knew what it was really. But it’s a passion of mine to see not only A2, which is a start. But organic, grass fed, A2 is the ultimate. And if you can get it raw, unpasteurized, that’s what we call the top of the top of dairy.

I think people are now coming around to this. I’ve been meeting with dairy farmers recently who are converting. I’ve been meeting with major retailers who are super excited. A mutual friend of ours is now over the $3 billion dairy category at Whole Foods. Ben, he moved back into that role, and he and I had a lengthy discussion. He wants to change the way people consume dairy. And it is so, so exciting because this is what the Bible said all along.

And so if you’re out there and you want to try dairy, I usually say, try dairy in the form of butter first. Butter or ghee. Then move into, like, a cheese or a yogurt. Because there are people that have a challenge with lactose, regardless of whether it’s A2 or A1.

But don’t buy the misconception. And you know this. Josh and I get frustrated. There are so many influencers now that are hopping on the A2 bandwagon, excited about that. But they’ll say if you buy milk from a Jersey cow, or if you buy this or that. I have tested 10,000 cows for their genetics, and Jersey is not much better than Holstein.

Make sure to look for either A two or A two forward slash. A two, because there’s two. It’s a double variant in the genetic. And I can explain that another time. Or buy goat, sheep, or water buffalo. When you go to grocery stores or health food stores, they’ll have the animal picture on the area where you buy the cheese. Because sometimes I’m in there looking and it’s hard to tell.

But you will see a big difference and a lot of dairy that you find in India, Africa and the Middle East. It’s predominantly A2. And people that come over from there or their lineages from there, they have problems consuming A1 dairy. I’m one of them because way back, being Jewish, my family comes from that area.

But I see African Americans, I see Indian people that can’t tolerate dairy in the US but they can tolerate it in their home country because the dairy is different. And that’s a very telltale sign.

The Bible was recorded in the Middle East. There is no doubt in my mind when they consumed dairy, and they did. It says, “goat milk for your maidens and for your health.” It talks about Abraham, Isaac and Jacob being nomadic. They consumed lots of dairy. When David brought food to the Israeli army fighting the Philistines. There was curd, there was butter, there was dairy. It was predominant when you’re in a nomadic culture.

DR. JOSH AXE: Well, you know, here’s another one, you know, you know Abraham, when he’s visited by, you know, the Lord or the, and the two angels, I mean that’s, you know, he’s, I think he’s. One of the things he might be feeding them is, you know, some dairy there as well.

JORDAN RUBIN: You introduced a great concept. Let’s go to red meat.

DR. JOSH AXE: So maybe we should come up with a dairy brand like the angel in the milk. Yeah, something like that.

Red Meat: The Ultimate Biblical Health Food

JORDAN RUBIN: Dr. Well, that’s actually phenomenal. I didn’t even think of that because, yes, an angelic host, we think partook in the food. We know they were offered it and that was right before Sodom and Gomorrah. So they used that energy for some clobbering time after that. So it’s a little fantastic four reference there.

So red meat is the ultimate health food and delicacy in the Bible. It’s the ultimate. It’s not good, it’s not okay. It’s the ultimate. And here’s why I say this. I’ll use your story, for example, when Abraham was visited by the Lord, the Lord of hosts, he was obviously negotiating with God then, which was pretty amazing, saying, “well, what if there’s 40 righteous people in Sodom? What if there’s 30, 20, 10, 5?” He’s literally negotiating with God, which is so amazing. I’m getting chills. I try to negotiate with God sometimes myself. It doesn’t always work.

So he says, “Sarah, go kill the fatted calf, go bring some curd, make this amazing meal” when anyone could afford it. When anyone had a special guest in the Bible and I would argue everywhere on the planet they would serve red meat, they would kill the fatted calf. This is also part of the prodigal son story too. If you think about it, the fatted calf was probably a 4 to 6 year old bull that was intact. And we’re into that another time on how to properly raise animals and slaughter them. This was a health food.

And for the Christian Medical and Dental association, which is an organization of believers who believe in the Bible that are medical doctors. To say that red meat is not good for you is a travesty. It’s just not true.

So Abraham gave the fatted calf to the angelic host. In the story of the prodigal son, which Jesus spoke, they killed the fatted calf. And even more importantly, in First Kings chapter 4, verses 22 and 23. And this is one of, I would say, two major revelations in the biblio diet that I’ve never talked about, which blows my mind because it’s the same Bible we hear about Solomon’s daily provisions or the. I call it the wisest meal on the earth.

Why do I say that? Because the Bible says that Solomon was the wisest man on the earth. It says that every king, every king in the world came to hear Solomon and they were blown away by his wisdom. And Solomon told his people and served, or had his servants serve every day, red meat and bread. It’s mind boggling. And today there’s an attack on red meat and there’s an attack on bread.

But I would argue that Solomon, who knew everything about animals and our anatomy and physiology, with the greatest amount of wisdom and the greatest amount of wealth, if you could eat anything on the planet, wouldn’t it be what would sustain you and make you healthier? And that’s why I’m telling people today, you can follow the world, you can follow an influencer, or you can follow God.

The Bible: The Ultimate Guide for Health and Life

DR. JOSH AXE: Yeah, I love it. It’s such a great message. And I think that there are so many things in the Bible that if you are looking to live your best life possible, the Bible is still the ultimate guide if you want to learn how to run a business. I mean, there are books like “Thou Shalt Prosper” and other books written there. I know Dave Ramsey follows this advice. It’s like, if you want to be as wealthy as possible, follow the principles of the Bible.

If you want to have the best relationships, if you want to become your best you, if you want to have the biggest impact in the world, those principles are in the Bible. And the same is true when it comes to dietary and lifestyle practices. If you want to be the healthiest you, if you want to. And if you’ve got a condition, if you want to beat cancer, if you want to reverse autoimmune disease, if you want to heal your gut, if you want to balance your hormones, these principles are in the Bible. If you look deep enough or have somebody help interpret like Jordan, in terms of what is the Bible saying here, in terms of what are those practices you should follow?

And I do want to mention, here’s the book that Jordan and I here have co authored. It’s called “The Biblio Diet.” And this book is going to be released very soon and you can get it on Amazon.com it’s going to be in bookstores nationwide. But again, here it’s “The Biblio Diet,” and it’s “Healing Secrets of the Bible.”

And we cover so much in this book. Everything from the exact diet that the biblical characters followed, such as Jesus, David, Abraham, Esther, everyone. We go through what they ate. We go through things like healing herbs of the Bible, essential oils of the Bible. We go through the principles of fasting. They’re actually utilized in the Bible. And just general healing therapies of the Bible. We do get into science as well. We back up some of it as well, even though the Bible is a greater authority than science today. But we do get into that.

And so I want to encourage you, get this book. We really think that this is a book that every Christian should have. And we’re also doing a lot of speaking, a lot of church programs. There are some major churches that are going to be bringing the congregation through a healing program here with “The Biblio Diet.” So we’re really excited about this. And it was a way Jordan and I really wanted to honor God and really bring the truth about what the Bible says about eating and lifestyle medicine. And so we also think it’s a great, great guy for longevity.

There’s all these biohacks and longevity out there. You know, I was thinking about this with biohacking, almost every single biohack is taken from nature because we’re not getting enough of it. For instance, now listen, I love infrared light therapy, okay? And I love red light. But there are even greater benefits. Even though I use red light therapy, especially in the winter, there are even greater benefits from the sun that God created. You know, sunbathing. I mean, you’re getting so many other lights, you’re getting so many other wavelengths that you’re not getting in red light therapy. And that’s true for just numerous things.

The Original Biohackers Were Biblical

JORDAN RUBIN: Absolutely. In fact, I was doing some research, Josh, reminding myself of the health lineage I have, because I used to tell a story of the different doctors and health experts that ultimately were in the chain that led me back to health. And the first or the top of the chain was Dr. Auguste Rallier from Switzerland. He introduced something called heliotherapy, which is using the sun to heal.

He had a sanatorium, which is a health retreat or a clinic, and he took on a young, very sick individual with tuberculosis, which was one of the most challenging terminal diseases of the time. And this young man was healed at his clinic through heliotherapy or sunlight. His name was Paul Bragg, and he went on to found the famous Bragg Company, known for its apple cider vinegar.

And the chain goes on then Paul Bragg helped Jack LaLanne who helped a man named Bud Keith, who helped me by introducing me to the healing secrets of the Bible. So we talk about sunlight, even just the subtitle “Live long, master metabolism, reduce pain, fight depression and conquer cancer with healing secrets from the Bible.” How many people out there are going to benefit or have a family member that needs it?

And this is something exciting. You and I each share the blueprint where we healed from life threatening and or terminal illness. And it was a combination of what they would call today mind, body, medicine. But for us it’s God’s plan and following it. And I love what you’re saying. The original biohackers were in the Bible and yet they didn’t have to hack anything. They followed a simple plan that is thousands of years old.

And you made a great point. The Bible is an amazing source for marriage, for raising children and for business. I’ll give you a great example. I didn’t even tell you this. I was in Costa Rica, walking barefoot, getting sunlight. I was looking at the sun, full, sort of full body sun. It was probably 10am so it was right on my body as I was walking, earthing, grounding, all of that, listening to the Bible on the app like I do every morning.

And I was praying to God. And you’ll appreciate this because you know how I operate. “Lord, I have so many opportunities to invest and to be involved in businesses. I don’t want to spend a minute of time outside of your plan. I don’t want to waste any time or money. Please tell me what I should do.”

And I’m listening to Ecclesiastes, which is arguably one of the most depressing books in the Bible, right? It’s Solomon saying this all amounts to nothing. I tried everything. I ate the best. It’s all vanity. So Ecclesiastes 11:2, right after I’m praying this. “Invest in seven ventures. Yes, eight.” Have you ever seen that in the Bible?

DR. JOSH AXE: No.

The Biblio Diet: God’s Investment Strategy

JORDAN RUBIN: How amazing is that? So I’m getting chills again. And I’m so I jot it down and I’m the kind of person when I hear from God, I’m going to do it. So I am looking at that as my filter for investments.

And we know that Jesus in the parable of the 10 talents and the parable of the minas, he talks about investing, he talks about being an entrepreneur. Because the three servants, when the master was gone, two of them went and started businesses. One of them hid his money in the ground. And the master said, “At least you should have put it in the bank so it could have earned interest.” So Jesus is teaching us that that’s how we should go.

So if anyone’s out there saying, “I’ve tried everything, I’m desperate for a health breakthrough or transformation,” I believe the Biblio Diet is for you. And it warms my heart to think that people would go around saying, “I’m on the Biblio Diet.”

Now, you mentioned Mark Sisson, who’s amazing, and so many others. People are like, “There’s the father of the Paleo Diet.” There is no father of the Biblio Diet except for the ancient of days, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. And notice, this isn’t the Jordan diet. It’s not the Dr. Axe diet. This is the Biblio Diet.

We are messengers delivering thousands of years of revelation for such a time as this. Because it’s impossible to think that you and I, who read the Bible so often, could leave things out in the past. But it’s happened. And we have had our eyes opened to biblical secrets that I think can heal cancer, I think can help people conquer depression, eliminate pain, overcome inflammatory bowel disease infections. It’s all here.

And I’m so excited that people get a chance to learn about it for the first time and they can check the biblical reference. Because again, if you believe the Bible is the word of God, you’re going to see bedrock truth here.

Biblical Bread vs. Modern Bread

DR. JOSH AXE: I want to go back to the last food we didn’t cover there. As we were talking about red meat and dairy, bread, you know, we see Jesus eating bread constantly, you know, and so bread has got a really bad rep. There’s a couple things that I want to say and then feel free to share your thoughts too.

But one is, you know, the grains they were consuming were very different then. Okay. Now we’ve all. Most people at this point. We have a very. I have a very educated audience who lists the podcast here. So we know there’s a difference between our conventional grain today that’s been hybridized and something like Einkorn wheat.

You know, when Chelsea and I were in Italy last year and we’re driving through Tuscany, these beautiful fields of gold, golden wheat. You know, they’re growing Einkorn there. And you’ll notice it’s more of a yellow color. It’s not that sort of pale white or caramel color. So there’s a difference there. There’s less gluten, there’s less, you know, carbohydrates. It’s just. It’s a very different product.

In addition, they probably milled their grains that same day. They probably harvested and very soon milled them. It’s going to be more nutrient dense. There was a sourdough. They might have been laid out in the sun, and they were probably sprouted, and then they were probably fermented in a sourdough and made in a sourdough bread. And sometimes they used multiple grains, not just wheat, but also barley and rye. And it was probably a pretty darn nutrient dense food. It’s very different than the bread today.

JORDAN RUBIN: And it was probably like a brick. So think about this. You mentioned Jesus ate bread all the time. There are three times when Jesus was recorded as eating something. One was during his life and he ate bread and fish. One was during, after his resurrection, he ate bread and fish, and one was what we call the Last Supper. And he broke bread.

So undoubtedly he ate it. He even says, “He who dips the bread in the dish with me, Judas is the one who’s going to betray me.” So clearly Jesus ate bread. He was referred to as the bread of life. Scriptures will say “Man cannot live on bread alone.” Now, notice they’re assuming you’re going to live on bread in the Bible, but they just said, “You can’t live on bread alone.” Bread was synonymous with food. It is almost the same word.

There are so many reasons why bread and grains have changed today. You alluded to a few of them. There’s no doubt it was sourdough. Josh, because they’re nomads. There’s yeast in the air. It’s just. It’s happening. And they used wine to preserve things. So they might have put a little bit of that in there. The grains weren’t sprayed with glyphosate at the end of them.

The other time, I’ll say the fourth is when the disciples were hungry and they were eating grains in the field and the Pharisees were telling them how, telling Jesus, “Why didn’t your disciples wash their hands before they ate?” They’re just plucking heads of grain.

Two major feasts of the Lord celebrate the grain harvest. And one of them, and this is why Jesus is called the bread of life, most people don’t know this because the first fruits harvest called Yom Habikurim was a harvest of barley. So the barley harvest was the feast of first fruits. And Paul later calls Jesus the first fruits of the Lord. He is God’s sacrifice, God’s offering to us.

I believe that bread can be healthy. Now, I will say this because I’ve written books geared towards people with autoimmune and inflammatory bowel disease. There is a time we should eliminate grains because our gut is so wrecked, however sprouted or even, I believe, more importantly, true sourdough bread. Not the white kind that you can get at every grocery store, but true sourdough bread can be amazing.

So I got home from a two day trip. You and I were talking off the air. I was on television for 24 hours, more or less straight.

DR. JOSH AXE: Yeah, that’s a lot.

JORDAN RUBIN: And I got home and I like to think my body craves what it needs. Part of my meal was two slices and of sourdough einkorn bread fermented for 72 hours along with some water buffalo butter on top. Sounds pretty good. I know. You’re just like, “What is he even talking about?”

I am excited, Josh, that there’s a. I would say a revolution in sourdough today. Like, I’m hearing friends of mine that aren’t even into health, they’re like going out of town. Like, “Who’s going to watch it? You know, should I have my mom watch it? Should I?” And I’m thinking, is it their kid? Is it their dog? Or sourdough culture?

The Sourdough Revolution

DR. JOSH AXE: We do the same thing. I mean, Chelsea is first off, she makes the most amazing sourdough bread. Like, it is awesome. Our girls love it. Both our girls this morning for breakfast had. It’s sort of that thing is like, are you having butter with your bread or bread with bread with butter? Yeah, there’s so much butter on it, but it’s. Yeah, she’s been doing it.

So Chelsea, and she was inspired by a friend of ours, everybody, you know, Carrie Underwood, she’s been making sourdough. And I think they were. They were. They were texting, and Carrie was posting her pictures. And Chelsea’s like, “Okay, I’m going to get into this.” So she started making sourdough. This is probably almost three years ago now, or maybe. Yeah, about three years ago. And since then, we have had sourdough pancakes, sourdough waffles, sourdough cinnamon buns, sourdough tortillas, loads and loads of just amazing sourdough.

JORDAN RUBIN: And we have an Einkorn sourdough pizza that you actually, after you make the crust, you let it expand even more, and it’s amazing. It’s like a deep dish pizza. That is so delicious. And Einkorn’s great. But you mentioned barley. There are good forms of rye. Unfortunately, today we have to find the right grain. Just like cows with that genetic mutation. We have selectively bred grains for all the wrong reasons.

They actually want more gluten in grains, Josh, because that helps the bread stick together. Whereas in the past, you would have had that coarse, you know, milled feeling when you consumed it. And I just think the tampering with our food, the detrimental effects, they’re starting to end, and people are taking their life back.

God’s Plan for Health and Healing

And so what the biblio diet really is. It’s a roadmap for those who want to live God’s way to eat God’s way. And if someone’s watching and says, “I don’t believe in God. I’m not a Christian. I’m not someone who cares about what the Bible says.” Well, if you want to live long, master metabolism, reduce pain, fight depression, and conquer cancer, and nothing’s worked, maybe you should eat by the book, because God is a God of action, not a God of words.

And I believe if someone’s watching, God’s going to impart favor on them by following his plan, whether they believe him or not. And I’ve got such great stories, Josh. I remember getting a letter of someone saying, “Jordan, I’m an atheist. I don’t believe in God. But I saw your biblical health plan, heal my son.” And I bet, Josh, their minds are open now because God’s a God of action.

And you know what? We should be a people of action, too, and quit arguing about what’s good and what’s bad. I used to say this. I would visit cancer clinics around the world when I was dealing with Crohn’s disease. And the most know it all angry, arguing people were those that were literally dying and they’re, they’re frustrated because nothing’s working for them yet. They’re trying to convince somebody that what they heard from some doctor or influencer, it was not an influencer at the time, author, whatever is the right way. Meanwhile, their results are, they’re dying.

And I believe that people are going to experience life and abundant life by reading the Biblio Diet. And I don’t say that easily. I know what that I know the weight to that. But I feel like this book is not interpreting anything. It’s just showing what God already did, what he already said in a way that we’ve missed it.

And I didn’t even touch on something we’re going to devote an entire program on. Josh, I believe God has a plan to heal cancer. He did it in my life. He did it in your cousin and our mutual close friend, Dr. Pete Sulak. There’s so many more people and we’re going to unveil something that is going to blow people’s minds because I have waited 17 years to share this message and we’re sharing it in the biblio diet.

Biblical Answers to Cancer

DR. JOSH AXE: Yeah. Yeah. That’s an amazing part of the book, really talking about healing cancer. I know it’s something that I’m going to have you on again here in just a month or so and we’re going to dive deep into healing secrets of the Bible related to cancer as well. But this is something that obviously affects almost everybody.

When we had Dr. Pete Sulak and Dr. Gazagoli on, one of the things we talked about is like cancer has doubled in people over the last 50 years, despite US spending more and more and more and more chemotherapy, more radiation. So that’s another thing too. Is that the world’s most, I would say, terrifying disease?

JORDAN RUBIN: Yes, 100% is.

DR. JOSH AXE: The Bible has answers for it. It does, yeah. And that disease, I know you and I both believe and we’ll dive into this more in the future. It’s not just physical, it’s spiritual. There’s something going on and we dive into that.

The Spiritual Dimension of Cancer

JORDAN RUBIN: So I’m excited and I’ll tease this. Josh, this is hard to say and it’s harder for people to hear. I have worked with tens of thousands of people over the years coaching them in their health journey. And a lot of it was inflammatory bowel disease, autoimmune disease, rheumatoid arthritis, ankylosing spondylitis. Think of all the itises. And then there’s cancer.

I believe on a physical sense cancer is less difficult to fight naturally than MS or rheumatoid arthritis or even Crohn’s and ulcerative colitis. It’s just my experience. The difference? There’s something spiritual about cancer. I think there’s something demonic about cancer, which you can get that out of me when we talk in the future. That’ll be a little more controversial.

But as someone who’s overcome cancer and stared death in the face, I have a new perspective. Or at least 17 years ago, I developed a new perspective on that, and it’s just something like nothing else. Now I’ll say Lou Gehrig’s disease or ALS is horrific. Scleroderma can be horrific. The list goes on and on.

But cancer is something that changes the mindset and the belief of someone who’s diagnosed with it. And I think man has elevated it on purpose. I don’t want to sound out there, but there’s something wrong with a single disease name for a solid tumor in your colon or something going on with your blood and leukemia. It’s not the same – it can’t be the same physical thing. It makes no sense. There’s something more insidious, and I look forward to the future program where we share that.

But in the meantime, if someone orders the biblio diet, go to Amazon.com to get it. We’re going to outline in bibliomedicine how someone can conquer cancer, whether they’re following conventional treatment or integrative treatment. We’re focused on the most important aspects of your health, your mindset, and incorporating this bibliomedicine into your life. And I believe God has allowed this message to be here for such a time as this.

Biblical Medicine: A Holistic Approach

DR. JOSH AXE: You know, I think one of the things you and I both feel very passionate about is biblical medicine. Part of that is food. But it’s so much more than that. I mean, it’s prayer, it’s meditation, it’s praise. It’s following things in the Bible, like in James saying, “go and have the elders of the church lay their hands on you and have him pray for you for healing.”

So there is a whole healing protocol you can follow that’s biblical, and that’s not to say that… But if you’re like when I was counseling somebody through who had cancer recently, and she’s doing IV therapy, she’s doing NK cells, she is doing a number of things that are more modern, scientific, cutting edge, but doing those along with a lot of these biblical practices in order to fight cancer and give herself her best shot of complete healing.

JORDAN RUBIN: I think it’s critical, no matter what we’re doing in today’s day and age, to have that foundational bedrock in how we eat and how we live. We wouldn’t want to live our life without a spiritual foundation. But I wish I could tell you that being a Christian, being born again is going to mean you are not going to die from cancer. You’re going to be healed from cancer. I’ve seen different, and I hate to say it, but you have to follow God’s plan for you.

And I’ll give an example. People say, “Jordan, can I be a Christian, go to heaven and eat whatever I want and live however I want?” It’s the stupid joke of yes, and you’ll get there a lot sooner. But at the same time, think of it this way, because I trusted Jesus as my Lord and Savior, but then I jump out of a 10 story building, does that mean I’m going to live because I’m a Christian? I broke God’s law of gravity.

I think some of what God shares with us in marriage, in raising children, in finances and in health, it’s like a law of gravity and we are going against it, thinking we’re going to miraculously overcome. And that’s God is a God of order. He’s a God of principles and he’s a God of miracles. And you and I have both experienced more miracles in a process than instantaneous. Wouldn’t you say that?

DR. JOSH AXE: Oh, yeah, absolutely.

Honey: The Bible’s Ultimate Sweetener

DR. JOSH AXE: So, Jordan, we’ve covered three major foods. We talked about red meat, we talked about bread, we talked about… I want to talk about just a few others. I want to talk about honey and I want to talk about salt. And by the way, this is one of my favorite things we get into in the book.

I’m a huge… We’re both huge honey fans. In fact, if somebody asks us what our favorite natural sweetener is, it’s not monk fruit, it’s not stevia, it’s definitely not artificial sweetener. It’s not coconut sugar. It’s honey. Why is honey the ultimate sweetener for health issues?

JORDAN RUBIN: Honey is the Bible’s sweetener. There is no doubt the Bible referred to the promised land, which was deliverance for the people of Israel as “the land of milk and honey.” It says that not because literally there’s milk coming out of the sky or you find honey flowing out of the rocks. It’s because those are the symbols of God’s promises to us in abundance and fertile land.

When there’s fertile land, the animals produce abundant, healthy milk. And when there’s lots of flowers and plants, the bees produce honey. Honey shouldn’t be considered a sweetener. It should be considered a medicine cabinet. If you consume it in the right form, whether it’s raw, unheated honey that’s local for your allergies, or whether it’s manuka honey, melapana honey. These are therapeutic honeys from New Zealand and South America, respectively.

I actually talked to someone about a honey from Madagascar that he sent me that could be even better than Manuka. I haven’t talked to you about that yet, but it’s super exciting. Honey actually collects small amounts of all the botanicals in the area. So in a sense, if you believe in homeopathy or if you believe in herbal medicine, which you should, honey is a collector of that. And it’s antimicrobial. And it tastes so good.

Now, just like dairy and bread, you can ruin honey by heating it, by processing it. But I got to tell you, consuming honeycomb is amazing, not only for sweetness and for energy, because it helps power your body and brain. But there’s a verse in the Bible that says if you eat honeycomb, it’s good for the bones. Honeycomb contains certain amino acids that actually help your bones and your joints. Amazing.

The Problem with Store-Bought Honey

DR. JOSH AXE: Yeah. There are so many benefits of honey in the studies. I want to hit on a few studies here. There’s one out of Texas A&M, and they said around 76% of honey you buy at the store is not even honey. It is so filtered and so heated and so damaged. There’s zero pollen in it. Zero. And so, pretty much, it’s sugar.

However, if you get good, real honey, buy it at your local farmer’s market, buy it at a health food store. It’s an amazing healing superfood. You mentioned the honeycomb. Loads of benefits there. There’s loads of benefits of propolis. I actually think that propolis is maybe one of the most underutilized forms of medicine out there. I mean, there are several studies on it being effective for autoimmune disease and for strengthening your own immune system. And so it’s the ultimate immune modulator out there today. I think that’s fantastic.

We’ve got royal jelly, which is great for anti-aging and longevity. It’s known as a yin tonic in Chinese medicine. Probably the greatest anti-aging compound for females. And then bee pollen. I mean, that’s an amazing superfood. That’s great for allergies, too. Combining that with raw local honey. So there are loads and loads of benefits.

When you go back to the tombs, like 3,000 years, they actually found honey still intact.

JORDAN RUBIN: Yes. It lasts thousands of years. It is so unique. That’s why I said it shouldn’t be considered a sweetener. It should be considered a medicine cabinet because it’s different than every other sweetener. I don’t think maple syrup’s too bad, but it doesn’t do what honey does. It’s just okay. Agave I don’t like, but it doesn’t do what honey does.

Everyone’s talking about allulose and these other sweeteners that are 99.9% processed. I don’t mind monk fruit. I don’t mind stevia. It’s better than sugar from cane or beets. But honey’s in a different category. And it bothers me when people say the other…

Honey as Medicine

DR. JOSH AXE: Yeah. We had a… when Arwen was about… Arwen’s my daughter, she was about six months old, she had cradle cap, I remember, and we put honey on. I mean, we tried some other things first, actually. And then we did honey and within days just disappeared. Totally disappeared. It was absolutely amazing. And so, now we didn’t feed it to her… everybody I know, under 1 years old, which, but we put it on her. It’s so funny because sometimes I’ll say things and then I’ll get comments like…

JORDAN RUBIN: Listen, I made my own infant formula for all my kids out of 14 ingredients. So feeding honey to someone who’s under 2 is not the worst indiscretion by any stretch.

DR. JOSH AXE: Exactly.

JORDAN RUBIN: Kind of silly, actually.

DR. JOSH AXE: It is, exactly. But as we’ve been talking about I mean it is an amazing healing food for numerous things.

Bee Venom Therapy: Nature’s Original Regenerative Medicine

DR. JOSH AXE: This is interesting. I had my brother in law, Noah, you know Noah, he came to me and he said we take care at the health institute, we take care of patients. And he’s doing some of the practitioner calls and he said, “I have a woman who is doing bee venom therapy for her results.” And he said she’s seen some really amazing results because… And then I’ve read up on numerous people. I had somebody we once bought a house from, he did this for injuries and he just swore by it.

And it’s sort of nature’s… I think it was nature’s original PRP or stem cell therapy, one of the nature’s original regenerative medicine therapies. Have you read it all or heard anybody say?

JORDAN RUBIN: Absolutely. Well, when you go to New Zealand. I was in New Zealand visiting a Maori Manuka honey brand and we went and harvested. I saw their processing in New Zealand. Bee venom is used for skincare. You might actually call it nature’s Botox along with regenerative medicine because you’re getting that feedback loop.

So some people, if you’re stung by a bee, it’s a horrible experience, but it could actually be good for you. Now I would not say the same thing about wasps and yellow jackets, but it’s very unique that even something like that, it’s a hormetic stress is what it is. It’s what we talk about when we talk about sauna and cold plunge and all of these other… Which we address in the biblio diet too.

Because the environment in the Bible was harsh. The environment throughout history was harsh. And getting stung by a bee was probably just one example. And if the land was flowing with milk and honey, there are probably a lot of bees.

DR. JOSH AXE: Wouldn’t it be crazy? And this happens. I mean, I had somebody I knew who had arthritis and they just… And it literally relieved their arthritis pain completely.

The Power of Salt: Biblical Wisdom vs. Modern Misconceptions

JORDAN RUBIN: Yes, bee venom, that is how it was originally studied because beekeepers or apiarians were found when they were stung frequently that they had less aches and pains. So that’s how it all started.

You mentioned salt. So salt is amazing in the Bible. And I talked to a group of doctors last week and I shared this. There’s some sayings we have in America and in the world that we don’t think about their etymology, which is where they come from. So the term “salary,” which is what was originally paid to people thousands of years ago, comes from the root word that means salt. So people were paid in salt.

And you’ve heard the expression, “he’s not worth his salt.” That means someone didn’t perform at work, just like “the cream of the crop” means you’re the best. Meanwhile, cream’s bad, salt’s bad. There’s been an attack on salt.

I remember years ago reading a book, and I love this name, so I’m going to say it. Dr. Faradun Batman Gelidge. He wrote the book “The Body’s Many Cries for Water,” and then he wrote “The Water and Salt Therapy.” He was an Iranian medical doctor, prisoner of war, and he cured thousands of patients in prison from peptic ulcer disease and other conditions with water and salt. But it was never just water. He always used salt in there.

And we have had this ridiculous attack on salt, just like on fat, when the Bible talks about being “the light of the world, the salt of the earth.” And the Bible says if the salt loses its saltiness, it’s not worth anything. Throw it in the dung pile. Which, by the way, salt’s a great fertilizer on top of it.

We’re seeing a resurgence in salt today where people are using more of it, which is good, but they’re not using the best quality salt. And so you and I talk about in the Biblio diet, in the “Salt of the Earth” section, what is the best salt, how to use it, and how could it help with overall health and vitality? Because a lot of conditions are due to dehydration and lack of minerals.

Yeah, salt is a source of minerals, whether it’s from the ocean or from a cave. And this idea of low fat, low salt, again, this is in the Christian Medical Dental association and all these medical organizations. It’s a bunch of nonsense.

Hydration and Electrolytes: The Missing Link

DR. JOSH AXE: Yeah, so salt’s amazing. I had somebody recently, and she was struggling with migraine headaches. She was struggling with joint pain. And I had her just start upping her salt and doing some hydration and completely gone. Completely gone.

So there’s a… I think I read a stat on 70 to 80% of people are chronically dehydrated and they don’t know it. And it’s not… Hydration is not just water. It’s water plus electrolytes, especially sodium and potassium. And that’s why when you’re buying salt, you want to make sure you buy one that is a multimineral salt. I mean, something that has sodium, but ideally has some other minerals in there, which is why I know you and I buy a lot of the same brands of salt and use those different types of salt on a regular basis.

JORDAN RUBIN: Yup. And if you do want a good quality salt, there are now many good brands. Celtic Sea salt, Baja Gold is good. And some others. The key is get a whole mineral salt. And a lot of times they are imported from other countries because they treat their salt like they treat their bread, like they treat their wine, like they treat their olive oil.

It’s a shame we have almost no cultural history to food anymore. But you can go around the world and people will talk about the salt, the cheese, the wine, the olive oil like it’s their kid.

DR. JOSH AXE: Oh, yeah.

JORDAN RUBIN: And that’s why we love going…

DR. JOSH AXE: Or their sourdough starter.

The Sacred Nature of Food Culture

JORDAN RUBIN: Their sourdough starter, forget about it. That is like a kid. But I do love when I hear people talk about healing foods. For example, olive oil we talk about in the book, and that’s even something that’s kind of been adulterated here in the United States.

But I went to the Greek islands and a multigenerational olive oil orchard and just listening to them talk about the fact that their extra virgin wild olive oil is their medicine. And I came back and as part of our evening, I’ll say ritual at dinner, we quote Acts 1:8, which says “we will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes upon us.” And we say “we will be your witnesses.” Because I live in two locations in Nashville, Tennessee, and Birmingham, Alabama, “and to all the ends of the earth.”

And then we chug between a tablespoon and an ounce of olive oil that we brought back from the Greek islands because I knew the quality. And that’s another example of biblical medicine.

The Science Behind Extra Virgin Olive Oil

DR. JOSH AXE: Oh, yeah. I mean, olive oil is incredible. You know, when you look at the studies on fats and oils, there is no other oil out there that has the medical benefits of extra virgin olive oil.

And another thing, you know, there was a misunderstanding on olive oil in cooking with it. There was about 10 years ago, a study came out and said, “hey, these are the smoke points of oils, and olive oil’s smoke point is lower.” And so you shouldn’t cook on it unless maybe it’s very, very low heat for a short time.

And their more recent studies have come out and said it really depends on the quality of the olive oil. If you’re doing a high quality extra virgin olive oil, the smoke is actually not an issue there. Actually, there are new studies showing it might be the best oil to cook with in a lot of cases.

So anyways, I mean, extra virgin olive oil is probably the number one oil you should be using. It’s better than avocado oil, in my opinion. It’s better than… I even like it better than butter. It is my single favorite oil out there. And when you bite, it should taste green and spicy.

JORDAN RUBIN: My kids always are, at the end, because the more bitter it is, the more beneficial. Here’s a great, delicious treat. So take your sourdough bread. In my case, it’s Einkorn. Take olive oil and put some spices and herbs in the olive oil. Dip the Einkorn sourdough bread in olive oil and then put butter on it. There you go. That’ll wake you up in the morning.

DR. JOSH AXE: Oh, it’s so good. It’s so good.

Looking Ahead: Future Conversations

Well, Jordan, I love this conversation. I know we’re going to do more. I want to have you on a few more times because I really want to dive into healing cancer. I want to dive into how to heal gut issues and autoimmune issues. And I also want to do one on longevity where we get into…

I actually have a question. I just want to sort of pose this. Don’t answer it today. We’re going to answer this in a future one. If Moses were here today giving food laws, what would make it and what wouldn’t? Because there’s so many things now that, you know, all these different additives and foods and certain foods have different levels of processing that were different from back then. What would he be saying today? So I’m interested to hear your take on that.

JORDAN RUBIN: I might have a costume for that one, Josh.

DR. JOSH AXE: Wow. Maybe put a wig on. Maybe you and I can both grow. I know we both grow good beard. Yours is actually even thicker than mine. But, you know, we can do that in preparation.

JORDAN RUBIN: If I grow up, if I grow a beard today at almost 50, it will look like Moses. So we could go for it.

DR. JOSH AXE: That’s true. That’s true. Exactly.

Get the Book and Join the Movement

Well, I want to encourage everybody. Check out the book. This is something Jordan and I poured our heart and our soul into. We really believe that God has a healing plan for your life and that no matter what you’re struggling with today, autoimmune disease, hormone issues, even cancer, you can heal following God’s wisdom. And we cover a lot of this in the book.

And again, it’s in bookstores nationwide. But also Amazon.com you can go out and order an early copy here of “The Biblio Diet: Healing Secrets of the Bible.” And it’s also a great way to support Jordan, all the great work he’s doing. So I encourage you guys to get the book “The Biblio Diet.”

Maybe let your church know about it because we’re going to be doing a lot of programs in churches because we want to help people heal and get God’s people healthy. So I want to encourage you to maybe, maybe bring it up to your pastor as well. There’s a lot of really well known pastors and churches that are going to be doing programs with this as well.

I want to encourage you to do this. If you’re not subscribed to the podcast, make sure to subscribe. We’ve got a lot more episodes coming out with Jordan and if you’re not subscribed, you’re not going to know about them. Also, it’s the number one thing you can do to support the channel is subscribe. It allows me to bring on more high profile guests, do more episodes with world renowned leaders like Jordan, Mark Hyman, so many others.

So I want to just say thank you all for subscribing and share this. There are so many people that don’t know the truth that the Bible is the greatest book ever written for everything, but also including for your health and for your family’s health. And so I want to encourage you, hey, share this. More people need to know the truth about how to heal using the Bible as medicine.

Well, hey, thanks so much for watching and listening here to the Dr. Josh Axe Show. I’ll be back next week with another episode.

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