Transcript: Dolly Parton Interview on Dumb Blonde Podcast

A lot of your songs are deeply personal, and some of them reference your father’s tough love. And you’ve also spoken about your mom’s faith, how she was extremely religious. Do you feel that the tough love approach and her religious views is kind of what made you so independent, or like, dare I say, rebellious?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:05:06 – 00:05:34): Oh, I don’t think I’m rebellious as much as I’m just strong. And I get my work ethic from my dad, and I get my spirituality, my faith, but also just my creativity from my mom’s side of the family because they were all musical.

Now, Dad’s people worked hard, and Dad was not a tough dad. He was strong, though. We knew we better watch out.

BUNNIE XO: (00:05:34 – 00:05:35): He wasn’t one to play with.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:05:36 – 00:06:03): No, he wasn’t going to beat us to death or anything like that. But we weren’t afraid of Mama either. We’d get by with anything with her. But she would say, okay, now that’s enough. You couldn’t push her over the edge.

But I think that was a good combination with Mom’s faith and with Dad’s strength, that it made us really all pretty well-balanced kids, I think.

BUNNIE XO: (00:06:04 – 00:06:09): I love that. I love that a lot. The respect that you have for your parents still after all these years is admirable also.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:06:10 – 00:07:03): Yeah, well, I loved my family. I still do. I stay as close as I can to them. Certainly, I don’t see them as often as I’d love to, but they’re always in my heart, and I always carry home with me wherever I go.

I write so many songs in order — well, it comes natural to me, but I often do it just to keep all that straight and keep that still present, because it’s so easy, and I’m sure you know, living out in this big world, you can just go any way, whether it be right or wrong. But it’s like if you keep that thing that you remember as a child, that faith — I keep that very— I’m a big person on faith and keeping that strength, because that’s my creative energy and my spiritual energy is the thing that keeps me motivated, keeps me strong, keeps me from falling through the cracks.

BUNNIE XO: (00:07:04 – 00:07:04): Keeps you grounded.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:07:04 – 00:07:05): Crazy world.

BUNNIE XO: (00:07:05 – 00:07:36): Yeah, I always say that. I’m like, whenever you’re on your knees, you’re in the best position to pray. That has been the only thing that has gotten me through in any hard times in my life is being able to call on Jesus and be like, all right, big homie, I know we got this. I know you got this for me.

Speaking about family and you being so close with your brothers and sisters, everybody knows you as Dolly the Icon, but how did they know you before all of this? If they could describe you, how would they describe the Dolly that they grew up with?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:07:37 – 00:08:22): Well, I was just another one of those little ragged kids up there in the Smokies, in the mountains. But we all loved the music. I took it more serious, I think, because my Uncle Bill, one of my mom’s brothers, he took a great interest in me because he saw me paying more attention to it than maybe some of the others did, because I was always trying to learn all the chords on a guitar, any kind of an instrument laying around.

And so they knew me as somebody that’s going to offer to do their chores if they’ll come help me sing on a song, or if they’ll add some background or help me work up a background part that I thought of. I remember once, when I was in school, somebody came up with Pig Latin.

BUNNIE XO: (00:08:22 – 00:08:24): I never learned how to speak that.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:08:24 – 00:09:53): Well, I did, because I was fascinated with anything different.

I came up with a song called “Friendliest Enemy,” and I wanted the backgrounds to be like she was my best friend to go with that in the background. So it was like, “Iche, azwe, aime, espe, infre. Iche, azwe, aime, espe, infre.” And that meant “she was my best friend.” But if the song was, “She’s the friendliest enemy I believe ever did see, and she’d better get my baby off her mind.” “Is she? I swear I may espay and pray.”

Anyway, that’s a hit, darling. I had to get my sisters because they had to learn it. They had to learn all that, and I had to offer to do their chores for a week or two for them to take the time to do it and just make them do it. So that kind of stuff.

So they knew me as somebody that was always singing, always writing, always fidgety. I couldn’t stay still. I was just kind of always full of energy in life. But we all loved each other. We all had our own personalities. We all loved each other for the way we were, and that’s how we still are.

Some of us are more like Mama’s people, or some are more like Dad’s. But I was really a good mix between the two, and I love that.

BUNNIE XO: (00:09:53 – 00:09:59): That is perfect. And I really think you need to release that song in Pig Latin. Start a new trend again. The kids will love it.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:09:59 – 00:10:18): We actually did it up in one of the shows at Dollywood when I was telling my life story. So we worked it in a couple of years ago at the Dolly show, and my nieces got such a kick having to learn to sing it up there on the show. But everybody was singing it because everybody tried to learn that little part.

BUNNIE XO: (00:10:18 – 00:10:26): I love it. I know I was so jealous of the people who could do Pig Latin because I just couldn’t do it. I just could not catch on to it or how to do it. So I’m just fascinated that you—

DOLLY PARTON: (00:10:26 – 00:10:27): I was a pig, so I learned.

BUNNIE XO: (00:10:27 – 00:10:29): Stop it right now.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:10:29 – 00:10:31): Oh, I was a farmer’s daughter.

Losing Baby Larry

BUNNIE XO: (00:10:31 – 00:10:58): I love that. So circling back to your family, you helped raise — being from 12 children, you guys all took turns raising a baby, right, in the family? The oldest ones did. That is what I had read. And you had one specifically, your brother Larry, that you helped raise. Can we touch base on that whole situation a little bit?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:10:58 – 00:11:04): Well, let me clear up a little bit. We all had — I have a sister and 2 brothers older than me.

BUNNIE XO: (00:11:04 – 00:11:04): Yes.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:11:04 – 00:11:25): And there’s 8 kids younger. But Mama had so many kids, there was only 18 months, 2 years difference in all of our ages. Mom and Daddy married when Mama was 15. She had her first baby at 16. And so they were just born one right after another. So any older child had to help with whoever was coming along.

BUNNIE XO: (00:11:25 – 00:11:25): Right.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:11:25 – 00:11:29): But the little one that was going to be my baby was little Larry.

BUNNIE XO: (00:11:30 – 00:11:30): Yeah.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:11:30 – 00:12:21): He didn’t live that long, actually. He was — he died at birth. But I’d followed Mama around when she was pregnant the whole time. She said that was going to be mine. I’d sing to it and I’d kiss on the belly and, you know, couldn’t wait for my baby to come. But he didn’t make it.

And it just crushed me because I didn’t understand about death and all of that. So that was a real hit for me at that age, that I had lost my baby. I thought I had a guilt thing about it somehow, that I’d done something wrong. But I think any child that goes through a thing like that — we all grieved over him, not just me. But I more than the others because he was supposed to be mine. I was picturing how I was going to rock him and how I was going to sing him my songs and all that. But we loved all the kids, and we all helped with all the kids.

BUNNIE XO: (00:12:24 – 00:12:47): You’ve spoken about the influence of your family. So would you say that Larry’s spirit and the memory of him has continued to impact you both personally and professionally? Because after that, he passed away when you were 9, correct? And then at 10 is when you started performing. I feel like maybe it was kind of like a push. Was that your way of dealing with the pain?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:12:48 – 00:14:10): No, I don’t think that had anything to do with it. I was so musically oriented anyway, and I had my dreams. It did take me a while — I was so depressed as a little kid over that. Took me a while to kind of overcome that. Weeks, months, kind of. And to where I really wasn’t all that interested in stuff.

But I don’t think that had anything to do with the rest of my life. It just taught me about grief. You know how we all have to learn those things at some age? So that was a real hard hit. But after I got over the grief of that and I moved on, I knew he was in heaven. And if Mama could handle it, certainly I could, you know, that kind of thing.

But I just was ready to go on, and my Uncle Bill was pushing me on, and he saw my desire, my dreams. And so he would take me around to different local things to sing, on local radio and TV. But all of those things help to make up a human being, all those memories of the bad and the good. I think that just all — you don’t even know what parts they really play, the little things that happen. It just either, if nothing else, it makes your heart tender, or you know how you have to protect certain things, and it teaches you. You’ve got to know about those things.

BUNNIE XO: (00:14:11 – 00:14:30): Yes, ma’am. I couldn’t agree more. At 10 years old, you’re starting to work with Uncle Bill, and you’re going around performing and stuff like that. At 10 years old, a lot of kids are still figuring out who they are. How did you find your confidence to stand out and perform at such a young age?

Finding Confidence and Early Performing

DOLLY PARTON: (00:14:31 – 00:14:42): Well, I was always writing songs. I was always able to rhyme, and Mama was always fascinated, and there was always so much commotion in a house with that many kids.

BUNNIE XO: (00:14:42 – 00:14:43): Oh, I can imagine.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:14:43 – 00:16:30): None of us really got any real special attention unless we were in trouble or something, you’re going to get called out with something. But I learned early on, Mama was always fascinated. When I’d sing these songs that I’d written — I was writing songs at 8, 7, 8, 9 years old about people getting killed in the war and things that I’d never seen or done. But I was able to rhyme and write.

And Mama would always — I noticed early on that I’d get more attention because of that. And of course, everybody wants to be paid attention to. Everybody wants to be special. So when somebody came to our house, Mom would often say, “Run and get your guitar.” And then she’d say to whoever was there, “I want you to hear this thing this little thing wrote.”

So I’d be really just singing my song, and I was getting all that extra attention, which is making some of the other kids jealous because they weren’t doing it. But they didn’t work as hard as I did learning them chords. I had little calluses on my little fingers, cut deep. They were hard. They hardened. I had to really learn it till it hardens those calluses for you to play. So I took the time to do a lot of the things that some of the little younger ones weren’t willing to do.

So I just saw that — I got the confidence from Mama bragging on me, and I knew that I could do something that some of them couldn’t, playing the guitar and all that. And then my Uncle Bill, he took great pride in me, and anytime somebody would tell me, “Oh, you’re going to be good,” I just kind of took that. And my personality was very susceptible to that kind of stuff.

BUNNIE XO: (00:16:31 – 00:16:43): Do you feel like you’re an old soul because you were able to relate to those songs of people losing people in the war and stuff like that? To be 10 years old and writing songs like that, you would have to resonate with them in some way.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:16:44 – 00:17:30): Well, I’m just very perceptive, and I had the gift of rhyme, as I mentioned, and I had the gift of song. And so I would just hear things, and I could kind of take a story from one other thing and I could change a few things around. So I didn’t feel like I was necessarily an old soul or that I had lived before or anything. I mean, I might have. I hope I did. Hope I might live again.

But I just think I was just able to do that because I had — I was very perceptive and receptive, and I just had a very creative mind. I had a great imagination, so it wasn’t hard for me to make up a bunch of junk.

BUNNIE XO: (00:17:30 – 00:17:35): Well, being around 12 kids, I’m sure to even just get any sort of peace, you had to have a great imagination.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:17:36 – 00:17:51): Yeah, I’d sneak off because there was a lot of kids going on. I’d sneak out behind the woodshed or around the outhouse, sit back there, do whatever, write my songs, find a shady spot or a warm spot. But yeah, I was always into that guitar and always writing my songs.

BUNNIE XO: (00:17:51 – 00:18:20): I love everything that you do is productive. I want my daughter to watch this, our daughter to watch this, because she’s 16 right now. She’s still trying to find her place in this world. And I think it’s awesome that you were so productive at such a young age. Can we talk about Uncle Bill? Because Uncle Bill really believed in you, and he took you to all these shows, and then he landed you in the Cas Walker Farm and Home Hour, and you became a regular on that show. Can you take me on that journey?

The Cas Walker Show and Uncle Bill

DOLLY PARTON: (00:18:22 – 00:19:20): Well, Knoxville was about 30 miles from where we actually lived, and I had an aunt that lived in Knoxville. That was where the show was from. And so I would, in the summer, after I got to where I actually got the job, when I got old enough to be allowed to stay away from home — but I was so homesick.

She worked at one of those department stores, and my uncle was a carpenter. So I was there in that house a lot, and I would go up to the top of the hill from where they lived, and I’d catch a bus down to the radio station, take my little guitar, and I would go walk across the viaduct — this big bridge — have my little guitar, and then I would go do the Cas Walker Show, play my little guitar, do my songs. And Bill wasn’t always with me then. Bill was doing a lot of other things, but when I was working on the—

BUNNIE XO: (00:19:20 – 00:19:21): Bill was living a full life.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:19:21 – 00:21:26): Walker Show. Yeah, well, he did some other things, but I could go there. And the guys that worked with the Cas Walker Show — the Brewster brothers especially — they’d back me up and work with me playing the songs or singing some with me.

And then sometimes I’d wait while I was waiting for the bus, I’d just get my guitar out and be singing, and some people would walk by and they’d think that I was standing on the corner, and they’d drop money in my guitar case, which I loved because then I’d go on home and buy those little Jiffy Burgers up at the top of the hill from where my aunt lived. They were like little crystal White Castle things. Oh, that was great. Greatest thing if I made enough, somebody threw enough money in. And then I got on to that, to where I just kind of play it.

And I even wrote a song with my brother Floyd called “Nickels and Dimes,” and it was about that time when I was walking across. But working with the Cas Walker Show was amazing. Bill had taken me there early on before I got the job. He’s the one that got me on the Cas Walker Show, as you mentioned. And he’d take me to the county fair, where I could join in contests and different things like that.

And then eventually, he would take me back and forth to Nashville. He saw that I was so serious about it, and he saw that I had potential. And Bill was a great guitar player. Bill wrote great songs. We wrote great songs together. In fact, in ’67, we won the Song of the Year, BMI Song of the Year, “Put It Off Until Tomorrow,” Bill Phillips on Decca Records. He was a pretty big artist at the time.

And so when we had sent the demo to him from when we’d just written it, then they wanted me to sing on the demo. So that was kind of like my first kind of break, of being heard on the real radio. Everybody, the DJs, were calling, “Who’s the girl singing with Bill Phillips on the Bill Phillips song?” So anyway, that was kind of a moment too.

BUNNIE XO: (00:21:26 – 00:21:41): That’s awesome that Uncle Bill’s been so pivotal in your career. That’s amazing. At 10 years old, being on the Cas Walker Show, who were some of your musical influences? Was there anybody that you wanted to be like, or did you have an idea of, “Hey, I’m going to pave my own way”?

Musical Influences

DOLLY PARTON: (00:21:42 – 00:22:01): Well, all of my people were very musical, and so I think some of my greatest influences were within my own family. I had an aunt, Dorothy Jo, one of my mom’s sisters. She played the banjo, she played the guitar, and she wrote great songs, and she was an evangelist. She also was a Pentecostal preacher.

BUNNIE XO: (00:22:01 – 00:22:02): I love that.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:22:02 – 00:23:17): Yeah, and I used to be just totally influenced by her. But as far as some of the others, there was Kitty Wells on the Grand Ole Opry, and Roy Acuff. And there was some, early on, after I got out to where we really had a little bit more exposure to big radio and all, there was a woman named Rose Maddox. It was the Maddox Brothers and Rose. She worked with her brothers, and that was the first time I’d ever seen people dress in the rhinestones. They wore kind of Western, kind of like how the Grand Ole Opry does, but they were the first ones I’d ever seen do that.

And they also put a show together, a little — they did little bits, a little comedy and little things, and I thought that was amazing. So you find that now that I’m older, I look back and I find that I have just picked up bits and pieces from so many people through the years, and I’ve learned so much that I didn’t realize. I’m like a sponge, without even knowing that I’m doing it. And then later on I’ll do something and I’ll think, “Oh, that reminds me so much of when I saw so-and-so.” You just learn through watching.

BUNNIE XO: (00:23:18 – 00:23:38): I always say we’re like a masterpiece of all the art we pick up from each person. It’s just like little gems of their souls that we take with us, and we look back on and we’re like, “Okay, this influenced this and this influenced that.” So I love that you always give credit where credit’s due. Because I’m the same way. If anybody asks me, “What’s your look?” I’m like, “Dolly.” I’m Dolly all day long.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:23:38 – 00:23:40): Well, I wish I looked like you.

BUNNIE XO: (00:23:40 – 00:23:40): Oh, stop it.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:23:40 – 00:23:42): You didn’t need me for that.

BUNNIE XO: (00:23:42 – 00:23:46): Oh, you listen, we could trade outfits right now and I’d be happy. I love this outfit right here.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:23:46 – 00:23:48): Well, yeah, we love God, I guess.

BUNNIE XO: (00:23:48 – 00:24:05): We’re liking that one. Absolutely, yes. So circling back, let’s talk about the Grand Ole Opry, because you made your first appearance at the Grand Ole Opry when you were 13 years old. How was that for you, walking out on that stage at 13, being introduced by Johnny Cash?

The Grand Ole Opry and Johnny Cash

DOLLY PARTON: (00:24:05 – 00:24:05): It was scary.

BUNNIE XO: (00:24:06 – 00:24:08): Yeah, I could imagine.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:24:08 – 00:24:25): My heart was beating like a drum, but I always said my desire to do a thing has always been greater than my fear of it. So I just try to hold on to that. I thought, well, I can’t turn around in the middle of the stage and run back. I thought, right, I got to finish it.

BUNNIE XO: (00:24:25 – 00:24:26): It’s kind of how I felt today.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:24:26 – 00:24:27): No matter what.

BUNNIE XO: (00:24:27 – 00:24:28): I was so scared.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:24:29 – 00:24:29): Oh no.

BUNNIE XO: (00:24:30 – 00:24:34): In a good way though. I feel like if you’re not scared of what you’re doing, you’re not growing.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:24:35 – 00:25:25): Well, I agree with that. But anyway, that was scary. That was big. That was working with, just being around all those big artists. But I was also in awe of it. And, like I said, of course, I was just a country kid. You’re always nervous the first time you ever eat in a restaurant around people you’re not used to, knowing how to do that, what spoons and forks. And even to this day, I still don’t know exactly, when I go to these big fine meals and all that.

But I figure, well, I wouldn’t be here if I wasn’t a star. So to hell with them. I’m going to eat what I eat and do how I do. But I still would like to know those things, but I just never — and now I don’t care. Sometimes you think, oh, it gets to a point where you’ve earned — you just kind of watch other people. That’s how you learn. It’s like, I’ll watch them, and when they pick that up, I’ll pick that up and I’ll do this.

BUNNIE XO: (00:25:25 – 00:25:30): I could never — I could not point out a salad fork to you if somebody paid me. I don’t know how to do that either.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:25:30 – 00:25:44): That’s what I’m saying. I just kind of watch — if it’s a big old big thing, like if I’m invited to eat with the royal family or something, you’d think — I’m very uncomfortable. But I mean, I better watch so I don’t make a fool of myself.

BUNNIE XO: (00:25:44 – 00:25:45): No.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:25:45 – 00:25:46): Or them.

BUNNIE XO: (00:25:46 – 00:26:03): So circling back to the Opry, Johnny Cash introduced you, and he’s known for his powerful presence and mentorship. What do you remember about your interaction with him that night, and did he say anything to you that stuck with you throughout your career?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:26:03 – 00:26:04): He said hello.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:26:04 – 00:26:22): That stuck with me because at that time I thought — see, I had seen Johnny Cash at another time when we were sitting in the audience, and I had the biggest crush on him. Oh my gosh, he had so much magnetism. And I was young, I was just beginning to feel those hormones, you know, to where you feel those things.

BUNNIE XO: (00:26:22 – 00:26:24): I never felt very masculine energy.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:26:25 – 00:26:35): Well, he did, you know, he had all that movement. And I found out later it’s because he was coming off drugs. He had twitches. I thought it was magnetism.

BUNNIE XO: (00:26:35 – 00:26:37): I love that.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:26:37 – 00:26:41): But there was some truth in that. I think the way he was kind of moving—

BUNNIE XO: (00:26:41 – 00:26:42): He was a Pisces, right?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:26:42 – 00:27:19): Yeah. But I loved him. And for years and years, I told him he was my first crush, and he was. And then, in my Broadway musical, the story, I covered that, about Johnny touching me on the shoulder. It may have just changed my life. Because I thought I was grown then, because I felt all those feelings. But he was a real nice guy and very quiet. But I became best friends with June and Johnny after. So as the years went by, we would visit and we liked each other a lot.

BUNNIE XO: (00:27:19 – 00:27:21): She was a good woman. I really, I really—

DOLLY PARTON: (00:27:21 – 00:27:38): She was a loudmouth like me. So we got along just fine. And Johnny, I remember when somebody said something about, “Johnny, don’t you get tired of hearing June talk all the time?” And he said, “No, I do some of my best thinking when June’s talking.”

BUNNIE XO: (00:27:38 – 00:27:39): Spoken like a true man.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:27:39 – 00:27:43): But I think he does some of his best thinking when I’m talking.

BUNNIE XO: (00:27:43 – 00:27:48): Yeah, I think that’s how all husbands are. They just tune us out. They’re just so used to us.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:27:48 – 00:27:48): I’m sure they do.

BUNNIE XO: (00:27:49 – 00:28:02): When you performed that night, did you already have a sense of the legacy that you wanted to build in country music, or did that experience at the Opry shift your perspective on what was possible for you as an artist?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:28:02 – 00:29:11): Because at that time I was just so nervous, and I reflected on that years later, as I still do. But at that time it was just a big deal to be there at the Grand Ole Opry with all those big-name artists. I was just kind of addled about the whole thing.

But I knew that — just like when I got my encore on the Cas Walker Show the first time I was on there, and I thought, “Oh boy, I’m going to be a star.” And now, years later, I realize they weren’t applauding so much because I was good, it was just because I was little. You know, you have to develop and grow. But everybody wants to be good to a kid, and the fact that I was out there doing it, I think they were just extra nice. And I think a whole lot of that might have been so with the Opry. It was just kind of cute when you see a young person doing something. But I did feel, and I thought back on it shortly after, thinking, wow, I was on the Grand Ole Opry and they liked me.

BUNNIE XO: (00:29:12 – 00:29:13): So they asked you for 3 encores.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:29:13 – 00:29:15): This is what I want to do.

BUNNIE XO: (00:29:15 – 00:29:19): Yeah, they asked you for 3 encores after your first performance.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:29:19 – 00:29:27): No, I’m joking. No, actually, they did applaud, and I kept singing the same last verse a couple of times.

BUNNIE XO: (00:29:27 – 00:29:29): She’s like, this is all you get.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:29:29 – 00:29:32): Yeah, this is all I practiced.

Moving to Nashville

BUNNIE XO: (00:29:32 – 00:29:52): So soon after that, you ended up moving to Nashville, and you graduated from high school, correct? And then you ended up moving to Nashville with minimal amounts of money. How did you make ends meet in those early days, and were there any creative or unexpected ways you found to survive while pursuing your dreams out there?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:29:53 – 00:30:52): Well, I was lucky because there are so many songwriters in Nashville and publishing companies, and a lot of the people that write songs are not good singers. So all the publishing companies, they hire — if there’s female songs, that you can get a job singing those songs. So I got work through Tree Publishing Company. Buddy Killen was a dear friend, and so he would get me on these sessions singing some of the songs that these writers had written, singing the girls’ songs.

And then I didn’t have a car, didn’t have a phone, didn’t have anything. And so all these musicians — because I was a right pretty girl at that time, just young girl, coming in — I had all these musicians that were on the sessions always willing to drive me home, always willing to stop, buy me a burger. Some of them thinking they might get more. And some of them might have, but that was not because I—

BUNNIE XO: (00:30:54 – 00:30:54): Lucky fellas.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:30:55 – 00:31:50): I know, but I’m serious. It’s like they were always so good to me. Everybody seemed to know that my heart was in a good place and that I was just a country girl. I was funny, always cracking jokes, just being, well, like I am now, really. But everybody got a kick out of me. So I was just one of the boys because I had 6 brothers and all my uncles and my grandma. I was not a bit shy around the men, and I knew how to maneuver with all that.

So I made money, and then I also got on a small salary with Tree Publishing Company in those early days. And then later I got with Combine Music with Fred Foster, Monument Records. They had a publishing company, so I got — I was lucky that I always got a little bit of a salary as a writer of my own songs, in addition to being able to sing some of the demos.

BUNNIE XO: (00:31:51 – 00:31:55): She’s like, I figured it out, sister. I did what I had to do. I love that.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:31:55 – 00:32:27): So in the early days, I would walk down to the hotels and I would walk through the hallways and I would see all the trays out in front of the doors, and any food, like all those little mustard and ketchup packets and bottles — I’d take those all back, and anything that looked pretty decent to still eat, I would get it. I would just kind of get a cloth, get a napkin off of the tray, and put it all in my purse.

BUNNIE XO: (00:32:27 – 00:32:29): Yeah, just whatever you had to do to survive.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:32:29 – 00:33:07): And there was a restaurant down around 12th Avenue at that time — this was different places I lived, but right above the hill — it was called Kalser’s. It became very famous. It was a meat and 3, and the Kalser brothers owned it. And I would walk down there, and they liked me, so they would give me free food. They would give me a good meal, but I would clean off the tables, and I would refill the salt and pepper shakers, and I would do all the things that you do like that. So I would do that. I didn’t get it for money, but I got good food, and then they would pack me stuff to take home too.

BUNNIE XO: (00:33:08 – 00:33:25): Oh, that is so sweet. I never knew what a meat and 3 was until I moved to Nashville. My husband was like, “We’re going to go to a meat and 3,” and I was like, “What is that?” And I love them now. I think the concept is so awesome. I think they need them all over everywhere, not just in the South, like on the West Coast and everywhere. I think they would just be a hit.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:33:26 – 00:34:11): But I guess if somebody out there doesn’t know what a meat and 3 is — it’s whatever the choice of meat, whether it be meatloaf, and it’s like 3 vegetables, 3 side dishes you get.

All of those terms, I never — I remember once I was on the road with one of my brothers, and he played the bass in one of my first bands. And we’d stopped at a truck stop, and he looked at the menu, and it had corned beef and cabbage. When they brought it, he said, “Well, where’s my corn?” Because he didn’t know it was corned beef, beef fed from corn. Corned beef. It was corned beef and cabbage, and he said, “Well, where’s my corn?” “Well, did you want corn, sir?” He said, “Well, is that his corn?”

BUNNIE XO: (00:34:11 – 00:34:13): He took it literal.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:34:13 – 00:34:21): Yeah, we always — there’s jokes about those things with country boys coming to Nashville, to tell their stories.

Meeting Carl Dean

BUNNIE XO: (00:34:21 – 00:34:34): So switching gears, we’re going to talk about Carl for a second, because you came to Nashville — did you think coming to Nashville you were going to meet the love of your life? No. As soon as you came here?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:34:35 – 00:34:45): I left 2 boyfriends back home that had wanted to marry me, and I kept saying, “No, I’m going to move to Nashville.” I mean, well, I left 2 boyfriends.

BUNNIE XO: (00:34:46 – 00:34:48): I love that there was 2 of them.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:34:48 – 00:34:52): Yeah, well, I dated — not at the same time, but they were like in that—

BUNNIE XO: (00:34:52 – 00:34:53): It’s okay if you did.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:34:53 – 00:36:11): Well, I know that’s true too, but my point is that I thought, well, the last thing I want is a boyfriend. I got it, because I’m leaving 2 boyfriends here, and I kept saying, no, I’m going to Nashville. And so I got here and I thought, well, that’s the last thing I’m going to get caught up with some boy, until I get my feet on the ground, get things going.

And the very day I got to Nashville, I met Carl Dean. And 60 years later, I’m still with Carl Dean. We’ve been together 60 years. We’ve been married 58, going on — that’s 6 decades. Well, it took. But anyway, he’s a good guy, and he’s quiet and I’m loud, and we just — we’re funny. Oh, he’s hilarious.

And I think one of the things that’s made it last so long through the years, we love each other, we respect each other, but we have a lot of fun. Anytime things get too much tension going on, either one of us can find a joke about it, to break the tension. And where it’s not — we don’t let it go so far. We never fought back and forth, and I’m glad now.

BUNNIE XO: (00:36:11 – 00:36:12): That’s amazing.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:36:12 – 00:36:38): We never did, because once you start that, that becomes a lifetime thing. I’ve seen it with so many people, and I thought, I ain’t ever starting that. I couldn’t bear to think that he’d say something I couldn’t take. It would hurt, because I’m a very sensitive person toward other people and myself. You may hurt people’s feelings not knowing it, but knowingly you don’t do it.

BUNNIE XO: (00:36:38 – 00:37:08): Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Jay and I always say you have to be comfortable with having uncomfortable conversations, and you have to be best friends. You have to remember why you fell in love with each other. We’re only 8 years in, but I can’t wait to 60 years in with them like you and Carl. In a world where love and marriage is often romanticized, what do you think was the most important but sometimes overlooked aspect of you and Carl’s relationship?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:37:09 – 00:39:12): Well, he was a homebody, and that worked well for us, because he was — well, he was in asphalt paving, but he just — I don’t know if anybody out there pays attention to astrology — he’s Cancer and I’m Capricorn, and those are compatible. Soulmates. Because the Capricorn is the mountain goat and it’s always climbing, wanting to look down on the other side. And the Cancer is more of a homebody, and he really was.

He never — he loved to go places if we were going to drive cross-country or go somewhere we had planned. But boy, he could never wait to get home. He wanted to be around home, and I’m a gypsy by nature. I just loved going, loved to see what else is out there. But I think that’s worked well for us. He’s not the least — he loves music, but he’s not the least bit interested in being in it. And he told me that right up front.

I begged him to go with me in ’67. We got married in ’66, so that’s when I won the first award for the BMI Song of the Year. And I rented him a tux and begged him to go, and he did. And oh, he was so uncomfortable the whole night. As soon as we hit the door, he started pulling off stuff. He said, “Look, now I want you to do everything you want to do, and I wish you the best, but don’t ever ask me to go to another one of these damn things because I ain’t going.” And he never did.

So we just kind of have that respect. And I respected that because I didn’t know he was going to be that uneasy. But he doesn’t even like to go out to big dinners or anything like that. So even on anniversaries and stuff like that, we usually stay home and make something special, do something special like that. Or go to McDonald’s or go somewhere we want to go that’s comfortable. Now we will go to Mexican restaurants. He does. He will go in, sit in a booth, and do that. He loves that.

BUNNIE XO: (00:39:12 – 00:39:13): Does Carl love nachos?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:39:14 – 00:39:34): Yeah, he does. He loves Mexican food, period. We’ll go sit in a booth, like if it’s an anniversary, or just sometimes on a Saturday we just go. We know where to go before the crowd comes. He doesn’t like big crowds. But anyway, he’s just special to me and I just love him like he is.

BUNNIE XO: (00:39:34 – 00:39:37): You light up whenever you talk about him. I love to see that.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:39:37 – 00:39:39): He’s good. Everybody loves Carl.

BUNNIE XO: (00:39:39 – 00:39:43): What’s something that you would want the world to know about Carl that they don’t know?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:39:44 – 00:39:46): He doesn’t want me to tell the world nothing about Carl.

BUNNIE XO: (00:39:47 – 00:39:50): I love that. I love that he’s such a private person.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:39:50 – 00:40:01): Yeah. He is. I can talk what I want to, but he’ll say, “Just leave me out the whole damn thing.” He’d say, “Don’t say nothing I said.” But I do all the time because he’s funny.

BUNNIE XO: (00:40:01 – 00:40:27): Oh, I love that so much. And I also wanted to tell you, I always tell everybody, whenever they say, “Oh, you’re like a young Dolly,” I’m like — Dolly’s birthday is January 17th, mine’s January 22nd, so we’re on the same cusp. And that’s like always my thing. I’m like, I’m just like Dolly. I love that. So we have the same cusp, the 17th through the 22nd. So moving on from sweet Carl. Okay, gotcha.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:40:27 – 00:40:28): Oh boy, we could talk forever.

Dolly’s Brands: Makeup, Wine, and More

BUNNIE XO: (00:40:29 – 00:40:52): I know, there’s so much I wanted to talk to you about. So your signature look, the big hair, the bold makeup, and all that stuff — you now have your own makeup line that we have sitting in front of us right now. Can you show me some of your products? Because I’m really excited about learning.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:40:52 – 00:41:31): There’s so much stuff. We got the lipsticks, we got great lipstick, and we’ve got all the beautiful colors, and we have these wonderful glosses too with all the different colors. But I have always wanted to have my own line of makeup, and I love lipstick, and you do too. And I love gloss, and I love the shine, and I love all the beautiful things.

We don’t have the full line that we will eventually have. We started out with our lipsticks and with our glosses. So we’re going to have a line of everything. We got our eyeliners in the different colors, so we’ve got great stuff. So have you not had a chance to see anything?

BUNNIE XO: (00:41:31 – 00:41:34): I did, I did get to see it. They wanted me to look at these with you.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:41:35 – 00:41:37): Don’t knock everything over if I try to get it.

BUNNIE XO: (00:41:37 – 00:41:53): No, you’re good. Oh, look at these, some of these right here. I mean, you have — Dolly, your name is on everything. There’s nothing that you haven’t covered. I just want to tell you, your Dolly Parton brownies are — I brag about them on my podcast all the time. I will eat those brownies any time of day. Pop those up.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:41:53 – 00:41:56): I hope it pops. Oh wait, our nails are too long.

BUNNIE XO: (00:41:56 – 00:41:58): Sequoia actually showed me how to do this. Yes, there we go.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:41:59 – 00:42:02): Yeah. And don’t you love these, the rhinestones?

BUNNIE XO: (00:42:02 – 00:42:02): So beautiful.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:42:02 – 00:42:34): I always make my joke of, “I never leave a rhinestone unturned.” And it’s got my little name there. But that’s the color that would fit you. That’s the Jolene Red. You know, we thought, well, we have to have a Jolene color, and then we got our beautiful gold glosses and all the things that go with them. And we have different colors of the lipsticks. We have the gold dust in the gloss and a rose petal, which is a real, real pink. So we have different things that we have for that.

BUNNIE XO: (00:42:35 – 00:42:44): So moving on from the lipsticks, because we always need a lipstick-stained wine glass — you are selling wine now too?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:42:45 – 00:42:46): Lipstick stained wine glass.

BUNNIE XO: (00:42:46 – 00:42:48): We need the lipstick stained wine glass.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:42:48 – 00:43:12): We have our Chardonnay. Accolade Wines and I went in business together, and this one’s really, really nice. And eventually, just like with the makeup, we’re starting out with certain ones, but then eventually we’ll have all the things. But right now we have our Chardonnay, and you can get that in easy stores like Kroger’s and stores like that.

BUNNIE XO: (00:43:12 – 00:43:12): Yes.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:43:13 – 00:43:15): And in the wine and beer stores.

BUNNIE XO: (00:43:15 – 00:43:20): So we were also smelling backstage, we opened up your—

DOLLY PARTON: (00:43:20 – 00:43:23): That’s the good one. Yeah, that was my original.

BUNNIE XO: (00:43:23 – 00:43:24): Yes.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:43:24 – 00:43:37): And now this is — they’re doing this as a special thing. This one’s just kind of almost like a collector’s item, and I can’t wait for everybody to try this.

BUNNIE XO: (00:43:37 – 00:43:56): This is the one we tried in the dressing room, and it smells so good. I love everything that you’ve done and everything that you’ve branded your name on. You have cookbooks, you have children’s books. There’s so many people that messaged me when they found out on my Patreon that we were going to be doing this podcast together, and they wanted me to thank you for the Imagination Library books that you have.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:43:56 – 00:44:32): The Imagination Library. I’m proud of that as anything I’ve ever done, where we give books to children from the time they’re born till they start school. We’ve given over, I think, 250 million books out since we started.

But that’s all good. But I’m very proud of all the things we got in the little Billy the Kid books. It’s based on stories that I’ve — children’s songs that I’ve written. Well, the Christmas one is based on a song I wrote, but the others are children’s things that they need to know about. And I mean, if you’ve got a good book and you got makeup and you got perfume and you got wine, what else do you need?

BUNNIE XO: (00:44:32 – 00:44:34): I need some of your Jolene’s.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:44:34 – 00:44:35): Well, you do.

BUNNIE XO: (00:44:36 – 00:44:40): I need some of the Jolene’s. They’re coming out soon, so I need them.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:44:40 – 00:44:42): They’re called Jolene’s.

BUNNIE XO: (00:44:42 – 00:44:42): I love it.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:44:43 – 00:44:47): Yeah. And you probably got a pretty butt, so they’ll probably look good on you.

BUNNIE XO: (00:44:47 – 00:44:51): Well, I got — I got hips and I got hips, so we need to slap some hips in there.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:44:51 – 00:44:53): I think they’ll look good on everybody. I got to get me some of those too.

BUNNIE XO: (00:44:53 – 00:44:55): I love it so much.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:44:55 – 00:45:00): Jolene, boy, for a hussy that’s trying to steal my man, she’s gone. She’s done pretty good by me, ain’t she?

BUNNIE XO: (00:45:00 – 00:45:02): I think Jolene might be your alter ego.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:45:04 – 00:45:05): She might be.

Closing

BUNNIE XO: (00:45:05 – 00:45:12): Miss Dolly, thank you so much for giving me your time. And I appreciate you. And thank you so much for just letting me be in your world for a little bit today.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:45:12 – 00:45:15): Thank you for being in mine. And we’re not dumb blondes.

BUNNIE XO: (00:45:16 – 00:45:17): No, no, we are not.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:45:17 – 00:45:24): But anyway, I love the title of your show, and you have a huge following, and I was honored that you wanted me to be on the show.

BUNNIE XO: (00:45:24 – 00:45:25): Thank you. I appreciate you so much.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:45:25 – 00:45:27): Now I want to be more like you.

BUNNIE XO: (00:45:27 – 00:45:36): No, you are so sweet. I think I’m just going to continue to just walk in your footsteps and do whatever I can to be more Dolly-like. I always think, what would Dolly do?

DOLLY PARTON: (00:45:36 – 00:45:39): So, well, Lord, I’ll do anything.

BUNNIE XO: (00:45:39 – 00:45:43): Me too. That’s what got me here. So thank you, Miss Dolly.

DOLLY PARTON: (00:45:44 – 00:45:44): Thank you.

BUNNIE XO: (00:45:45 – 00:45:49): Thank you guys for tuning in to another episode of Dumb Blonde. I will see you guys next week. Bye.

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