Prince Alwaleed bin Talal on The Tucker Carlson Show (Transcript)

But at the end of the day, you know, what happened did happen, and now we need to see how we can put this behind us and open a new chapter in the Middle East.

Clearly, with the Syrian regime neutralized and having a new I want to say pro-western regime, but at least not anti-American regime in Syria with Hamas hopefully demolished completely. And more importantly, Hezbollah being almost neutralized in Lebanon. These are very, very big losses, for the added inducement to have a peaceful solution for the Palestinian cause.

Experience with Donald Trump

TUCKER CARLSON: You know Donald Trump well.

PRINCE ALWALEED: I know him a long time ago, you know, from the time we bought from him the Plaza Hotel, and we also bought from him his Trump Princess yacht that I still have.

TUCKER CARLSON: How did you wind up with Donald Trump’s yacht? Not many people can say that. Not many people have Donald Trump’s yacht, but you do. How did you get it? I mean, how did that happen?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. We bought it, I think, you know, in the late eighties. Trump did take possession of it, and he renovated it. And I think he reached a stage where he, you know, he didn’t really want to have it anymore, so we did buy it from him.

TUCKER CARLSON: What was your experience with Trump? What’s he like?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Oh, I mean, look. With Trump, I think if you’re straight with him, you know, you get a straight answer. You know? We had very good dealing with President Trump, you know, when he was a businessman, whether during the purchase of the Plaza hotel from him or buying his Trump Princess yacht.

TUCKER CARLSON: So you were not anti-Trump?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Oh, no. No. We can’t be anti-Trump. You know? We because we are pro-America. We have to be pro-Trump, especially with the new policies that he’s taking right now. You know, I very much I’m very much conservative, socially speaking. Yes. And all his policies right now in being anti-woke, being anti-left wing, being anti, all those crazy things that’s happening on the left, we are for sure pro-Trump on these matters. And, also, all his policies, economical policies that in looking after the eradication of the US deficit, These are all conservative policies that we support.

Look. I lived in America. I graduated from the West Coast, you know, from university in California, and I finished my master’s in the East Coast in America. So we all love America. We want America to be strong.

Views on American Social Politics

TUCKER CARLSON: What did you think over the last eight years as you watched the woke, the sexual politics, in the United States?

PRINCE ALWALEED: I mean, okay. It went just too far, too much, you know, really. And, it’s about time for America to get a logical person, a pragmatic person like Trump. I know some of his policies are extreme to some people, but his social policies, being anti-woke, being anti-left wing completely, being too liberal, I mean, these are really policies that, you know, that’s illogical. They are, you know look. I’m a religious person. You know, America is still a very conservative country. And one of the main ingredients of the success of Trump in the last election was really his social policies. Many people in America believe that America went too much to the left. So I think, getting back America to center, at least the center, not to necessarily to the right. The center. That in itself is a big achievement for America.

TUCKER CARLSON: So you hear that in countries around the world. We admire the United States. The entire leadership of most of the world went to college in the United States. Yes. How did people in this region and other countries visit feel about seeing men dressed as women at the White House and all that stuff?

PRINCE ALWALEED: It’s crazy. It’s nonsense. It’s nonsense. And this transgender idea right now, I mean, having in the military, all those transgender people, you know, and toilets, you know, having being mixed. And, you know, having, for example, a male who was considered a lady won’t compete into women’s sports. I mean, it’s too much. It’s going too far. It’s just too much. I mean, we reached a stage in America. If you’re not woke, I mean, you are crazy or you are anti-establishment. And I don’t think it’s too much. It’s going too far. So I think what Trump is doing right now is at least moving to center.

Yeah. You know, we are not against LGBTQ, even the plus, whatever the plus means. What is the plus? That’s the scary part.

TUCKER CARLSON: You’re rather not talking about the plus?

PRINCE ALWALEED: I would rather not talk about it. That’s very scary. Yeah. I do. The plus, LGBTQ, you understand. But the plus, that’s you know, we can have another interview for that. Let’s put this aside.

TUCKER CARLSON: I’m comfortable with that. Thank you very much. So that I mean, you must have been confused watching that. It’s a country you went to school in and you know well.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. Yeah. I lived in America. And when I was in America, I know I mean, you have left wing, right wing is fine. Yes. But to go that much to the left and have the woke movement, no. It went too far. Look. America leads the world. I understand there are you know, China wants to be there. India wants to be there. We want the European to be there. At the end of the day, America is leading the world whether you like it or not. No matter how isolationist policy, are adopted in America, America will still lead the world for many years to come. Yes. Politically, economically, financially, in all cases. So we want America to lead the right way. You cannot lead the world with this woke movement. You cannot we will not accept that.

Media Investments and Shifts

TUCKER CARLSON: You’re one of the biggest media investors in the world and have been I worked for a company. I think you were the biggest outside investor, I think, in News Corp, Fox News. And you got investments in many different media companies. Many of those media companies went way to the left. What did you think of that as a shareholder?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, our main investment was with Fox, with Rupert Murdoch. Murdoch was always, you know, mainstream to the right a little bit, obviously. So we did have a lot of other investments, small ones, but they were all long time ago. Yeah. But our main investment in all media, legacy media, was with Murdoch. And we sold out, you know, a year before he merged his entities with Disney. Yeah. Yes. So no. Left the media in America went too much to the left, and most of them. The only remaining soldier, if frankly speaking, who really withstood the heat is Murdoch’s Fox News, New York Post, Wall Street Journal, and Fox. They’re all, you know, center to the right.

TUCKER CARLSON: So you divested from Fox, from News Corp, and then you made a huge investment in X under Elon.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Exactly.

TUCKER CARLSON: Why’d you do that?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. Most of our investments now went to X and X AI. Obviously, they were moved with Musk. Now in the and, you know, I call X, as the new media, frankly speaking, X. That’s what we invested. And with Mr. Musk, I think, you know, he’s a big force to be reckoned with, frankly speaking. And we are second biggest shareholder in X and X AI.

TUCKER CARLSON: So that the sale of X was closely watched by everybody around the world. Yeah. He wound up buying the company at what seemed like twice its actual value, and people made fun of him. Where is it now, would you say?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. On our books, you know, we have two investments. We have Kingdom Holding, which I chair.

Investment in X and Its Value

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yes. And I have my private investments. So we have with Musk around the three billion dollars investments. In our books, it’s valued more than fifty percent more. Clearly, as for X, we never devalued it. We, you know, some entities did devalue it by thirty, forty, fifty percent. We never devalued it. Clearly, now after the election of President Trump and after the strong alliance between Musk and President Trump, we’ve seen the market having revalue upwards, X dramatically, at least to its par value at the $44 billion that they paid for it.

TUCKER CARLSON: What do you think its actual value is?

PRINCE ALWALEED: I believe the actual value is more than doubled, frankly speaking.

TUCKER CARLSON: It’s more than double the $44 billion you paid.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Exactly. And it’s going to and more than that and it’s going to happen right now because video is going to come, and, you know, now pay is going to come into it. You know, they’re going to pay X, is going to happen right now in the first quarter. So many things are going to happen to actually have that as the main hub, and anchor, for many things around it.

TUCKER CARLSON: So but as a political and social force, is there a more powerful media organization?

PRINCE ALWALEED: As of today, I believe X is really number one. We’ve seen how Meta tried to have another company Thread, yeah, but it didn’t take off. Why? Look. I think X really began very forcefully and strongly, and the freedom of speech was there, was open, you know, clearly whenever it was against X, freedom of speech and freedom of expression, without much fact checking, that gave it the forum to be the anchor of the new media in the world. And you see right now, Meta is moving to the X model. As I told you when I just met you off the record a minute ago that Meta now is being exercised. Yeah. It’s being like X right now.

And this helps X reaching its potential of being fully valued at $44 billion and more. So all the advertisers that really so-called fled or left X are coming back right now because the alternative is doing exactly what X used to do.

TUCKER CARLSON: Right. So you think that Elon Musk has had a big effect on Mark Zuckerberg?

PRINCE ALWALEED: There’s no doubt because we have seen now Mark Zuckerberg and Meta is moving to the X model. Not only that, you know, not only operationally, but you have seen just lately that Meta is going to move its so-called administrative headquarters from Delaware to Texas. So, really, X, Musk and X being followed across the board.

TUCKER CARLSON: So you think Zuckerberg is just kind of trailing behind Elon Musk doing what he does?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, you know, I look, Musk is very close to the leader of the whole world, President Trump. And no one wants no businessman, whether it is Mark Zuckerberg or Jeff Bezos or the Google head, want Musk to be the only man who has the ear of President Trump. They all want to have at least small piece of the pie. Yes. And that’s what’s happening, basically.

TUCKER CARLSON: But what’s interesting, clearly. But what’s interesting is that they didn’t want it the first time. All these businessmen, smartest, most powerful in the world, made a bet in 2016 that opposing Trump would pay off for them. Why do you think they did that?

PRINCE ALWALEED: It was a wrong bet. Yeah. Very bluntly speaking. It was a wrong bet. Trump came back in a major upset. He must have scared the hell out of them.

TUCKER CARLSON: When he got elected I mean, I mean, no one expected Trump to come back, frankly speaking. And frankly speaking, the Democrats played a very big, admit they’d make a big mistake.

PRINCE ALWALEED: They custom made you know, I talk as an independent. I’m a Saudi. Here, I’m a royalist. Neither Democrat or Republican. You know, I love America. They clearly custom made those lawsuits against them Yes. To be in an election year. I understand this is very delicate. Not many people in America could speak this language freely, but they custom made it to be in election year. And that’s backfired, frankly speaking and help Trump being elected. Yes. You know? And they’re custom made to be I mean, why waited three years after Trump left, and they all came these lawsuits in the last one year last, one year of the Biden era? That was too much.

TUCKER CARLSON: So you didn’t you didn’t see that as the equal application of the law?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Come on. Give me a break. That’s very clear. I lived in America. I know America very well. There’s too much politics. That’s one of the attributing reasons, of course, Trump to win. The American public rejected these lawsuits and all those so-called indictments or whatever they are.

AI and Its Impact

TUCKER CARLSON: So if you’re Mark Zuckerberg and you spent $400 million to beat Trump in 2020, and all of a sudden, he rises from the grave, how do you feel? Terrified. Right?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, at least, you know, to acknowledge your mistake and to correct it, it’s better than continue with a mistake. Right. And to be honest with you, you know, I’m an investor in Meta also. Yeah. Smaller scale, not like X, but I’m an investor in X, and and he’s right to look at the share price.

TUCKER CARLSON: You’ve invested in X AI. What do you envision the world looks like after in ten years, thanks to AI?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, no doubt that, you know, artificial intelligence is going to play a big role in having a revolution in the whole social industry, in economics, politics, economics, finance, etcetera. So, AI is just beginning. We’re in the first inning right now. Yes. And, there’s no doubt that AI and superintelligence will really impact the lives of everybody.

TUCKER CARLSON: I often hear people say that. I’m not exactly I mean, I know that, like, the entire upper middle class of the United States is going to be unemployed. It sounds like that’s bad. But I don’t I don’t understand what the other effects are of AI.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Look. It’s too early to judge frankly speaking right now, but, I hope that the AI really is used, you know, for the good causes. We hear a lot of doomsday scenarios. You know, I talked to Musk about that. You know? Yes. I had with him three video calls, and I did ask him about this question very explicitly. And, you know, he believes that, you know, eighty to ninety percent will be positive, but still, you know, zero to ten percent could be evil-ish. So we have to be very careful about that. But I’m positive about AI because, you know, most people are really, you know, good, positive, and they utilize AI in any way to help the world society.

Elon Musk’s Impact on X and Potential Impact on US Budget

TUCKER CARLSON: Elon, when he came into X, when you invested, fired what percentage of the staff?

PRINCE ALWALEED: When Musk took over, they had around 8,000 people, and he fired 6,500 people and went down to 1,500. And that’s all documented, obviously. Yes. And that’s one of the items where I’m really upset from the legacy media where Audi said they cursed Musk and X for firing 6,500 people, and they’re worried about their social lives and how disrupted their lives, which is fine. I mean, they eventually, they didn’t have jobs. But no one talked about the economical and financial impact of firing 6,500 people on Twitter. They saved more than $2 billion, and that saved the day because, you know, many advertisers did leave X. And there are two components of profitability, increased revenues or decreased expenses. So, clearly, revenues did go down, but expenses went down dramatically also.

TUCKER CARLSON: So that broke even.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. So, really, that saved the day. Yes. 6,500 people were out, and X was run more efficiently because I’m always in touch with Linda. Yes. You know, the CEO of, and I always talk with Jared, right-hand man of Musk. And I’m in touch with Musk, and I follow this very closely because I’m, you know, a private investor there. So we know what’s going on inside. The company is performing a lot better with 1,500 people.

So if Mr. Musk duplicate that on what he’s doing right now with the US budget, and he can save hundreds of billions of dollars. Forget two, three dollars. Maybe it’s that that’s a bit too extreme. But he can save hundreds of billions of dollars, and you can have America reduce its budget deficit dramatically, let alone, to have it balanced, that’d be huge achievement. Huge achievement for Mr. Musk personally and for US administration, Trump, and the US people.

TUCKER CARLSON: You think he can do it?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Look. He’s a bulldozer. I know him very well. And when I talk to him, the guy is just so straight to the point. You know? No nonsense at all. If there’s anyone to do it frankly speaking, it’s Musk through the Trump administration.

Trump and Musk Partnership

TUCKER CARLSON: So you know Elon Musk and you know Donald Trump. They’re in close alliance now. Elon is not a government official, obviously, but he’s, you have to say, one of the top advisers. Can that partnership last?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Look. They are both big figures, but Trump is president of the United States. Musk is the richest man in the world. He’s one of the most powerful, if not most powerful man in the world. They have to acknowledge that. That’s a fact. Yes. And I think for the sake of United States, we want them to function very well. We want them to succeed very well. You know? Clearly, each one has huge ego for sure, and rightly so. They have to have an ego. Nothing wrong with that at all.

And I really sincerely hope that they can function together. Musk is very pragmatic person, logical person because he has a mission. He wants to cut the cost in the US system in the US budget system, and he wants to really to balance the budget as much as he can. He told me that personally in my last phone call with him. And I believe he’s given the tools, and he’s given the tools, frankly speaking. And I hope they’re all successful, frankly speaking. We all live in the United States. We want America to have strong footings. You cannot be strong if you have all these budget deficits and trade deficits, and that will make you limp eventually.

View on Western Europe

TUCKER CARLSON: Western Europe seems like it’s falling apart. Is that your impression?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Western Europe is aging, is sick. You know? You’ve seen, most of the West Europe specifically, they have wrong policies, bureaucracy, low speed and movement. You know?

European Politics and Conservative Trends

PRINCE ALWALEED: We see Italy, for example, under Meloni. You know? She’s not the star. Yeah. She’s a conservative. I will not say right-wing extremist. No. No. No. She’s very conservative and pragmatic lady. And, look, now, Italy is a star in all Europe right now. But, really, you…

TUCKER CARLSON: Did you ever think you would live long enough to say Italy is now the star of Europe?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. I really hope that Europe wakes up because, you know, West Europe is allied with United States, of course. But, really, look at the policies in England, UK, France, Germany, Spain, They are all really very much backwards. They need to wake up, frankly speaking.

TUCKER CARLSON: Can a country run without energy? It’s almost impossible.

PRINCE ALWALEED: You cannot. I mean Right. So Look at UK. I mean, look. The Labour took part took the reign of power from the conservatives, and look where they are right now. They’re exactly what the conservatives were when they left the government Yes. Few months ago.

TUCKER CARLSON: So the UK is running out of natural gas. Mhmm. And but and that’s true across Western Europe. These countries don’t have enough energy to have first world economies. Yeah. Will that change?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Look. I’m not worried about that, frankly speaking, because, you know, they would all find a way to find gas, you know, whether it’s United States or other parts. You see, that evolved also, did help a lot in supplying the Western Europe with the gas, you know, once they shut down the pipes from Russia.

TUCKER CARLSON: So I think the Biden administration blew them up. Right? We heard about that. You know? Did you hear about that?

PRINCE ALWALEED: I know that. I was bothered. I made the news. Unfortunately.

TUCKER CARLSON: Why would the Germans allow their allies in Washington to blow up their natural gas pipeline and not say anything about it? Right. You said that too.

PRINCE ALWALEED: I you should answer that question. I have some theories. But you’re saying that that all their ideas are leading to their destruction. Yeah. You know? I think, at least, they’re leading to their, it is, look. They have so many problems, in West Europe, and, unfortunately, they are not being acknowledged. And you have seen them a lot of, right-wing parties, like in France, Le Pen, for example, coming very strongly. And she may well win the elections Yeah. A few years from now. So all this causing the right wing to come up very strongly, and then unless they wake up so fast and do some quick remedies to their economical policies and also their political system.

TUCKER CARLSON: It’s just funny to hear you say that. So in Europe, you often hear say it’s a battle between, you know, the native population and the Muslim immigrants. Here you are, a Muslim with prayer beads in your hands saying you want more right-wing parties in Europe.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, you know, I really am asking for it to be more centrist for sure. Look at, for example, Meloni. When she ran, she won’t run on a very right-wing policy. Yes. But when she took over, she just went to center.

TUCKER CARLSON: That’s true.

PRINCE ALWALEED: No. When you reign, when you take power, you are forced to be more pragmatic. Yes. She’s pragmatic, lady. You know? And her policies are very logical and centrist. So, many policies of the left wing really failed in Europe. It did not work. And I really hope that they go back to center and they find really take major decisions to really jump start the process like Trump is doing right in America. America Trump is shaking up the whole US political system, political system, economic system. Even now we have serious status now. I mean, this is still, you know, we and some of the territory, we don’t know where they’re going to be heading. We don’t know if these tariffs are there to stay or that they’re there for negotiating tool to reach some conclusions with Canada and Mexico.

Trump’s Negotiation Style and Trade Policies

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, you’ve negotiated with Trump against Trump. You know, bought the Plaza and his boat. What do you think?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, when he was a businessman, now he’s the leader of the strongest country in the world, United States of America. I think with Trump, he come with him straight and not necessarily succumb to what he’s asking for. But if you’re logical and pragmatic with him, you can issue a conclusion and deals and very fast.

TUCKER CARLSON: How long did it take you to negotiate the purchase of the Plaza?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Less than a week.

TUCKER CARLSON: Less than a week?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yes. And it’s both less than a week. But it’s worth very fast.

TUCKER CARLSON: So you think the tariffs are just an opening round in negotiations?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Possibly. We don’t know yet. Possibly. Possibly. But the 25% tariffs on, you know, on both the northern neighbor and southern neighbor, Canada and Mexico, pretty high. You see now how the auto industry was deficit today. They’re down more than 10, 15%.

TUCKER CARLSON: Sure. In trading, but the industry itself is…

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. Yeah. Sure. No. We it’s still it’s too early to judge since being that. Right. That’s the trading. You know? Because today, they announced the system. Today is Monday. They’re going to announce, it was announced just for now, and the instantaneous reflection on that was negative, obviously, on the auto industry.

TUCKER CARLSON: So, you know, getting into trade war with Canada and China, both of whom are totally dependent on the United States, they couldn’t exist with the US, is different from doing that with China. How does that work?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, look. China I was reading yesterday that China, Xi Jinping, did not really answer, did not reply yet. This thing is time. He’s composed. You know, it’s more long term. Look. China, I look, is has vanished. It’s been 4,000 years old. So, really, one year, one month, four years of of any tenor of any president, really. They they’re not too fast in replying. We have not seen Chinese government officially reply yet. We’ve seen Trudeau. We’ve seen Mexico replying already very aggressively in putting similar tariffs, especially in Canada. So we have not seen the reply from China yet. But China, for sure, is different behemoth completely. It’s different ballgame.

AI and Energy Consumption

TUCKER CARLSON: Do you believe the story about DeepSeek, their AI project that it was developed for under $6 million? And is that is that…

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. I think we Look. Look. Look. We’re investors with Musk, and Musk is a genius of our era. And clearly, you know, he’s very conservative in the way he spent now. We put to them, you know, billions of dollars in having all these big megacenters being built in the United States. So, really, $5.6 million for this DeepSeek. I need to check this a little bit. So and we’re still very early part of this developing story to see if it’s true or not and to see whether there is still any from OpenAI or where the truth is exactly. But but I, you know, I think you have to give it some more time to see where the DeepSeek fit in the overall AI equation, globally.

TUCKER CARLSON: So there’s, I mean, by far, the biggest real estate investments in the US and probably around the world are in data centers Yeah. For AI and other processing. Can those data centers run on windmills and batteries?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, we have seen now many of those big companies now are trying to go other paths. You know, nuclear nuclear. So we are really very much in the early innings about all what’s happening. But, you know, our best friend is being is on Musk on the AI, in on the AI game. We invested with them in the first round and second round. We’re backing them all the way, and we’ve seen very strong alliance between X AI and X. There’s a lot of relationship between them that’s really causing a lot of positive for both companies.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yes? Yes. But, you know, for the past 15 years, the rest of us have been getting lectures about renewable energy, the green agenda, carbon zero. You know, basically, hydrocarbons are bad. Solar windmills are good. And the second it became clear that AI would need a lot more energy than projected, people like Larry Fink said, well, you know, maybe we look to maybe it’s a, you know, it’s a whole bunch of different energy sources. Yeah. Do you think the green agenda is over, thanks to AI?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, for sure, with the Trump election, the green revolution now has diminished a little bit. You know? It’s not as being in the prime time as I if I can use this term now. It’s there, but I think it’s going to be so much, as being number one priority for the Trump administration. If you know that, I know that.

TUCKER CARLSON: Number one priority?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. I know. Maybe number nine or ten. Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: No prob. But other I mean, your peers in business, big investors have been pushing green energy projects all subsidized by various governments. Do you think that will stop? Do you think we’ll stop getting lectures about how windmills are the future?

PRINCE ALWALEED: No. It will not stop, frankly speaking. You know, I know Bill Gates. You know, we are partners with him in many projects, and we have with him a project called the BEV, the breakthrough energy venture that is invested in, you know, hundreds of companies that are in noncarbon energy. And they’re moving, frankly speaking, moving ahead. So I think, you know, they’ll still be there, but it will not be the same momentum and same oomph.

US-Venezuela Relations and Oil

TUCKER CARLSON: Do you think the United States will change its relationship with Venezuela because of Venezuela’s oil reserves?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, we have seen the US embassy yesterday being there. He met Maduro in Venezuela. So, and I think he was very cooperative against the hostages, and he welcomed getting back all the immigrants. So he was very welcoming, and I’m sure Mr. Trump would love this. So we have to we have to, it has to remain to be seen because Venezuela, frankly speaking, they have a lot of oil reserves. You know? More than 280 billion barrels.

TUCKER CARLSON: So I think they have the deepest reserves in the world, proven reserves.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Exactly. Exactly. So I don’t know what’s the ultimate policy for Mr. Trump. Trump is a very sophisticated man, and I think, the fact that his ministry went immediately to Venezuela, whereby, you know, they had you have no relationship between both countries. No. And Venezuela was very welcoming. So the story you have to you have to follow on because it’s a developing story.

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, I mean, we’ve spent the last, I don’t know, ten years trying to overthrow the Venezuelan government.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Unsuccessfully.

TUCKER CARLSON: Quite unsuccessfully. But then in one day, all of a sudden, Venezuela says, yeah. Here are all your hostages Yeah. Yeah. Yes. And flies the American flag in Maduro’s office. Like, what what is this?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. Well, I mean, this is a Trump era Summary. Quick summary.

TUCKER CARLSON: What would happen if the US did some sort of big energy deal with Venezuela?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, I’m I’m look. At the end of the day, Trump is pragmatic. Trump also has good allies in Saudi Arabia, in UAE, in Qatar. We’re always friends. You know? I mean, even if Venezuela is being blessed by United States, it doesn’t mean that they can go and produce two, three million barrels within Right. Within months or weeks. So it’s going to take them time to go back, you know, there. All what they have has been obsolete, frankly speaking. No new commitment has come there. So so even the capacity of Venezuela, not Right. They cannot produce more than 3.8 million barrels. So that’s still okay. You know? It will not really impact the whole industry dramatically. It will impact it for sure, but not necessarily devastate it.

TUCKER CARLSON: But over time and it takes a while to build the infrastructure necessary to efficiently extract it. But, I mean, over the next ten years, you could you could see cheaper oil prices as a result of that. Right?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, for sure. I mean, I mean, that’s why Saudi Arabia is transitioning from being an oil-based country into being a diversified economy. So that’s why we’re investing heavily in tourism. We’re investing heavily into new minerals. We’re investing into other alternatives to oil. We are diversifying our economy in many areas. So, really, when the price of oil do sink to below $70 or $60, we have other alternatives really to withstand the heat, understand the pressure of having less oil, less price of oil.

TUCKER CARLSON: It’s just funny that, you know, it was a year ago, if you talk to any big investor, at least in public, they would say, no. No. No. The future is not more drilling for oil. The future is more windmills and solar panels, but you’re saying, actually, the future sounds like it’s more drilling for oil.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, what I’m saying is a Trump. You know? Drill, baby, drill. You know? I mean, Trump wants the price for oil to go down.

TUCKER CARLSON: Gold.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. Clearly. But, also, Trump also has his eye on the fracking United States because the average cost to produce a barrel of fracking oil is also in the fifties to sixties also. Right.

Oil Prices and US Energy Policy

TUCKER CARLSON: So he doesn’t want that that also to go, to go off. So there’s a balance here to what Mr. Trump can do, obviously.

PRINCE ALWALEED: You can’t put your own domestic extractors out of business.

TUCKER CARLSON: Exactly. You don’t do that.

PRINCE ALWALEED: So you don’t want to balance it now. Clearly, Trump came with a lot of, you know, with a lot of momentum. But at the end of the day, you know, when he has discussions with Saudi Arabia and with other OPEC countries, you know that also Saudi Arabia wants the interest of the consumers to be taken into consideration. Also. Right.

TUCKER CARLSON: There are a lot of competing interests…

PRINCE ALWALEED: Exactly.

TUCKER CARLSON: On the question of price per barrel. What do you think the kind of right number balancing all that is?

PRINCE ALWALEED: It’s very difficult to judge this. Really, it all depends on supply and demand, frankly speaking.

TUCKER CARLSON: Of course. But…

PRINCE ALWALEED: And you see China. China also has a big role in that. And you see economic China right now is moving into 5, 6% growth direction every year. So, you know, there are a lot of factors that contribute into this, this whole, big equation.

TUCKER CARLSON: Do you think… I know that, obviously, Donald Trump wants it in the sixties. Do you think we’ll see it there?

PRINCE ALWALEED: No. For a barrel? I hope not, frankly speaking, because I haven’t heard this in Saudi Arabia. Yes. You know? I don’t want to be sixty, but I think long term, there’s no doubt that the price of oil is heading, not necessarily to the hundred, but at least to where it is now, $70-$80.

TUCKER CARLSON: Okay. You think it’ll stay there?

PRINCE ALWALEED: I think so.

Russian Energy Investments

TUCKER CARLSON: You made a big bet on Russian energy right after the war in Ukraine started, 2022, I think.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yes. With Lukoil, Gazprom, Rosneft. I think those three. Correct. Maybe. We invested in these three companies.

TUCKER CARLSON: How’d you do?

PRINCE ALWALEED: We did we did well, frankly speaking. You know? We did sell part of it. We did with some small profit, and now we still have some stake there.

TUCKER CARLSON: So the war starts in Ukraine, and everyone’s running away from Russia and Russian energy. The world is, you know, reorienting away from hydrocarbons in general, and you swoop in and make a huge bet on traditional Russian energy. Why’d you do that?

PRINCE ALWALEED: This was part of our investment philosophy and policy. You know, we invested in so many companies that year in Western Europe, United States, and these three Russian companies were among them.

TUCKER CARLSON: Right. But other people were not doing that. Why did you do that?

PRINCE ALWALEED: No. We are sometimes contrarian and successfully so.

Investment Opportunities

TUCKER CARLSON: If you were to pick apart from AI and energy, like, another two or three industries that you think are a good bet moving forward…

PRINCE ALWALEED: Technology.

TUCKER CARLSON: What kind?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, look. We are invested very heavily invested in technology. For example, in China, we are in many companies like Baidu, Alibaba…

TUCKER CARLSON: Yep.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Tencent, Didi. You know, Baidu is very heavily onboard also in artificial intelligence. In America, we are also invested in we are Meta, we are X, X AI, in Snapchat. We have many companies also in America. So we have a diversified portfolio in technology. We are also in hospitality, you know, in Four Seasons and Accor and, we have very diversified portfolio.

TUCKER CARLSON: So you’re in Alibaba. Ten years ago, a little over ten years ago, Jack Ma was a very famous person in the United States. He was doing his roadshow with JPMorgan. Everyone loved Jack Ma. Company gets, you know, one of the biggest market caps in the world, and then Jack Ma disappears. Whatever happened to Jack Ma?

PRINCE ALWALEED: You know, I know Jack Ma very well.

TUCKER CARLSON: You do.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. I used to meet him always at the Microsoft meeting with Bill Gates. You know, I think, you know, Jack Ma really… you know, China, look, is a centralized political system. And I think he went a bit too far, you know, with the… I’m being very frank with you. He went a bit too far, in his being outspoken against the regime and against the communist system. So he was just told to just to hold it down a little bit, and I think that’s what happened. He’s now in a cooling down period.

TUCKER CARLSON: He’s in a cooling down. Are his whereabouts known?

PRINCE ALWALEED: No. He’s settling between Japan and China. So he’s a little bit… he’s coming in our public a little bit right now, but he’s not as high profile as before.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah. No. He’s not.

US Military Presence in Asia

TUCKER CARLSON: Can, the United States has a big military footprint in East Asia, mostly in Korea and Japan, but also other countries. Can that continue?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, look, as I told you, America is a big force to be reckoned with. America is an empire. Now we don’t call it empires these days, but America is an empire. You know, you have hegemony on the whole world, And America is a force to be listened to too. So I think these bases are very important to stay there, to counter what’s going on with China also. Yes. So I know America now is being more, somehow a bit isolationist in this approach. But, you know, I think once Trump, you know, gets more, in the second term, he will acknowledge the fact that America needs to have this presence in all these areas to keep the strength of America consolidated.

TUCKER CARLSON: So you say that as a big investor in Chinese companies, you want to see American troops in Asia stay there.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, I mean, this… I mean, in China not necessarily in China, but you don’t… you have a crazy guy in North Korea. You know?

TUCKER CARLSON: He’s really a proxy for China, though. I mean…

PRINCE ALWALEED: You know? But but, you know, still he’s also…

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah. And then, yeah, I know. I mean, he he does take orders from China, somehow from Russia, but, also, he’s a very independent guy, and reckless also.

TUCKER CARLSON: Do you know him?

PRINCE ALWALEED: No. I don’t know him. No.

TUCKER CARLSON: You have no North Korean investments at all?

PRINCE ALWALEED: No.

Diplomacy and International Relations

TUCKER CARLSON: He took a lot of criticism. I mean, what do you… since you’re from the Middle East, I would say your your mother was Lebanese. You’re related to people in power in a bunch of different countries. It’s very common here for people for adversaries to meet and talk. In the West, in the last couple decades, the idea has been, if we disagree with you, we’re not talking to you. What do you think of that?

PRINCE ALWALEED: No. I am frankly speaking, I am I’m very much supporting what Trump does here. To talk to these adversaries, I think it’s a plus. I mean, for some now we hear that Trump is going to open communication with Putin Yes. On Ukraine. I think I’m fully frankly speaking. You know? Unless you engage, how can you reach a conclusion agreement or arrangement? I’m fully frankly. I need this very bold from him to meet, the leader of North Korea. Yes.

TUCKER CARLSON: How would you describe Putin?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, Putin is, you know, is a very smart man, and he calculates very well his moves. You know, he’s a very smart guy, and, clearly, one of the things he said, he feels sorry for the day that the Soviet Union disintegrated into all these fifteen republics. So he has this empire mentality in him. It’s in him. It’s in his mind for sure. He still craves for the Soviet Union Empire and the czarist empire that used to be there before the revolution up in 1917. Yes.

TUCKER CARLSON: Everyone wants an empire.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: Do you think China wants an empire?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Look. China, I think, you know, they have 1.5, 1.3 billion people. I think the first priority really is to control their domestic situation and have growth. Look. China is a big problem. Look. You have a very open, capitalistic, economical system in China, yet the political system is very centralized authoritarian and communist, obviously. Now these two, don’t go well together. So the question now until when these two could happen and continue. China is very concerned about this in turn, obviously, and they want to have this growth happening to really to have these people migrate from being the poor level to being middle class. Yes. So that’s I think that’s the main worry, frankly, is being Russia for the foreseeable future.

TUCKER CARLSON: But couldn’t you say that about a lot of countries? Like, if you had a monarchy that was liberalizing its economy and opening itself to the world, had a state religion, had, you know, a thousand year old culture, wouldn’t you be worried? I mean, how would that work? How could you maintain political control?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Look. I I think alluding to Saudi Arabia and the Gulf region…

TUCKER CARLSON: I don’t know. Which is fine. We’re just we’re just fine. Nothing wrong.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Look. Look. We we, you know, we talk 33 and openly. No. I know. Look. Saudi Arabia has legitimacy. And I, you know, I just said in one interview a few weeks ago, look at the six monarchies in Arab world. Yes. Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Bahrain, UAE, Oman, Kuwait. These six monarchies. Add to them, Morocco. Add to them Jordan. These are eight monarchies. Look how… I’m not saying that how good they’re doing, how stable they are elsewhere, how legitimate they are. Look at Jordan. Look at the neighbor to Jordan around the town. Syria, Iraq, Lebanon, and Israel, and Hamas, all and look how stable it is right now. Clearly, it’s still very difficult situation there. Eight monarchies, compare them with the other fourteen republics. In that world, there are twenty-two, obviously. There’s no comparison between them. So we have legitimacy here when the monarchies headed by Saudi Arabia and other, you know, seven countries.

TUCKER CARLSON: I mean, of course, I disagree with you as an American, but I agree with you as a traveler. But what you’re saying is obviously true. But in our system, legitimacy comes from the consent of the governed. Our leaders are legitimate because we vote for them. No one votes for your crown prince, but it’s also true that your country is thriving and that the other five… the other seven monarchies you mentioned are are doing well relative to the republic. So what… why do you think that’s true?

PRINCE ALWALEED: If you go to the public here and rate Prince Mohammed bin Salman…

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

PRINCE ALWALEED: He would get 70 to 80%, if not 90% approval rating.

TUCKER CARLSON: I think that’s true. To be honest with you, Walt. Yeah. I believe that.

PRINCE ALWALEED: And this says it all, frankly speaking. People would like to get stability, wants continuity, wants to be sure that the economy is doing well. People are fed up from all these wars and all these turmoils, and they see what’s happening to their, the neighborhood. We see what’s happening in south for example, in our Gulf region, Saudi head by Saudi Arabia. We see what’s happening in Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Yemen. We don’t want all that. We don’t want all that. Really, frankly speaking, we are very happy country here. All the Saudis are are very happy with what’s going on. Crown prince is very popular. King Salman is beloved by everybody here. So, frankly speaking, forget the elections. We’re happy. We’re okay.

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, I disagree with you in theory, but agree with you in practice because it’s just what you’re saying is it’s just true. It’s a fact. I don’t want it to be a fact, but it is a fact. So what is that… I mean, is this… I mean, democracy is just a kind of brief interlude in all human history. It’s a pretty new thing. Right. I mean, do you think it has a future?

PRINCE ALWALEED: What do you mean? By democracy, I mean, in our region?

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, if you’re say… I don’t know. I mean, you’re saying that all the republics in your region are struggling, all the monarchies are thriving, and that is roughly speaking true… there are other factors.

PRINCE ALWALEED: We have seen what happened to the so-called Bush democracy in Iraq. We have seen what happened there that how could this whole thing collapse completely. You know? Iraq is a republic. Correct? And we’ve had the elections there, and we see the results. We don’t want that confusion, chaos. Look. We have monarchies. We’re happy with them. People are happy. That’s what counts for us, to be honest with you. With respect to Americans, with respect to Tucker Carlson, my friend. You know? We’re happy with our systems, and we will continue with it.

Cryptocurrency

TUCKER CARLSON: What do you… what is crypto exactly?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, crypto, you know, is a new system, you know, of a currency system that, you know, I don’t buy, frankly speaking. I don’t know. I we’re not investing crypto at all, and, I don’t think it’s for us at all. But it’s there. It’s facts right now.

TUCKER CARLSON: It’s a huge part of the…

PRINCE ALWALEED: I understand.

TUCKER CARLSON: The fastest growing sector of the American economy.

PRINCE ALWALEED: I understand. But still, you know, I’m not a believer in that at all.

Cryptocurrency and Investment

TUCKER CARLSON: Why?

PRINCE ALWALEED: I will not invest there in crypto. You know? I just… it’s not regulated well. It is… you know? Many US big businessmen do agree with me on that subject. You know, I don’t understand it very well, and it is new form of currency that is really very, very confusing for me, complicated, and I don’t understand. Is it a currency, or is it… I mean form of payment.

TUCKER CARLSON: It was… that’s what it’s supposed to be, but from what I can tell, it’s like an… it’s something that you invest in.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. I mean kind of imaginary goal. We have so many other investments to… the world is full of investments and better investments to invest in. And we never invested in crypto, and we never invested in crypto.

TUCKER CARLSON: You’re never going to invest in crypto. Then why are the… I mean, the banks… big banks in the United States. I mean… All your friends. They’re all… they’re all in crypto.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Some… they are forced to. I mean, I even JPMorgan that never believed in that. Now they’re forced to. I mean, sometimes they have facts that you have to go with. But, you know, not necessarily with full conviction, but they are forced to go with it, unfortunately.

TUCKER CARLSON: Why are they forced?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, look. Many other banks are doing it, so they are forced for the clients. So many, many clients believe in crypto. Many of the clients in the world believe in crypto, and so they have to reflect the needs and the wishes of their own clients. So there you go. They’re reluctantly…

TUCKER CARLSON: I mean, if… if you have enough assets invested in crypto, at some point, it becomes kind of dangerous, doesn’t it?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Sure. Definitely. You know? I, you know, I believe it could be a time bomb waiting to explode. I could be wrong, but, that’s my own belief, and that’s the belief of the head of Jamie Dimon.

TUCKER CARLSON: You think he still thinks that?

PRINCE ALWALEED: He thinks that. And, actually, when he was in Davos, they asked him a question. He refused to comment on it completely. I saw the interview. He declined to comment on it because he is… he’s fed up from saying it’s bad, bad, bad, bad. Obviously, he’s just giving up and not comment.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yep. I’m… exactly. That’s what’s happening. Are any other countries in this region embracing crypto?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Yeah. There are some countries. You know? Yeah. Some but… but not heavily. Not heavily.

TUCKER CARLSON: What about gold?

PRINCE ALWALEED: No. Gold. Gold is, you know, it’s… many countries have gold as one of their investments for sure. Yes.

TUCKER CARLSON: Are you… are you an investor in gold?

PRINCE ALWALEED: No. No. But but we do have some small portfolio of gold, but… but nothing major. Nothing major. No. Nothing major.

TUCKER CARLSON: Do you expect it to go much higher?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, you know, I mean, it goes up and down, like, based on supply and demand. You know? But to us, really, it’s not the priority. You know? Well, they were not very heavily invested in the world.

Saudi Arabia’s Social Reforms

TUCKER CARLSON: For your country, for Saudi Arabia, you’ve opened it up very dramatically, both physically opened it up. You’re issuing visas to everybody, which you were not doing ever. But you’ve opened it up socially, women in the workforce, getting rid of guardianship, women driving most famously. What are the reforms, the liberalizations that you wouldn’t do here? Where will you draw the line?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Look. Saudi Arabia opened a lot, since 2015 when King Salman took over, and Prince Mohammed bin Salman got in charge of the local situation, and we opened up a lot. And I’m very happy with this complete liberalization of the economy, liberalization socially, whereby women became incorporated in the society, equal opportunity, women can drive now. Basically, it’s a normalization of the women incorporation into the society. Yes.

So MBS just made a woman equal to men, frankly speaking. Yes. It was a big achievement for us because for many years before that, we were deprived from that. And I called for that many years ago, and thanks to God it happened. So, really, there’s no limit to where we can go, but, obviously, you know, no one wants to go beyond the limit. You know? It’s just like America. You know? If you do… you do everything within the law, when the legal system is acceptable. Yeah. That’s what’s happening here. You know, our country became normal. We normalize the situation with all our countries in the world.

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, normal in the west is, you know… well, alcohol, for one thing, legalized marijuana, transgender teachers, transgender admirals. I mean, are there points where you say we… we don’t want that?

PRINCE ALWALEED: No. Look. Frankly speaking, I’m very conservative. You know, I live in America. You know, I’m anti-alcohol, and I’m very happy that my country has no alcohol, frankly speaking. And I… I don’t mind that at all. I’m very liberal man socially, yet I’m very conservative, when it comes to, for example, using drugs or alcohol, I’m very much against that. So… so these are off limits for us for sure, and we will not accept that in Saudi Arabia.

TUCKER CARLSON: You can have tourism without alcohol?

PRINCE ALWALEED: It’s happening already.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah. That’s true.

PRINCE ALWALEED: It’s happening already, to be honest with you. And, if it’s happening already, so it’s been tested already right now. So, frankly speaking, your answer is yes. It’s possible, and it’s happening.

TUCKER CARLSON: And do you think they’ll stick with it? The government will stick?

PRINCE ALWALEED: Well, you know, I think this is for Saudi government to decide. Of course. You know, I’m not government official. So far, so good. But it’s for the government to decide what are the next steps on that front position.

TUCKER CARLSON: In our country, we had prohibition of alcohol for, what, fourteen years. Yes. And it is described to everybody. I mean universally believed to be a massive failure. I don’t know if that’s actually true, but that’s how history has recorded it. But that’s… I mean, you think it’s a success here. Why do you…

PRINCE ALWALEED: Look. Look. Look. Saudi Arabia is an Islamic country, and religion is very, an integral part of our society. Yes. And, not having alcohol here is… is not really something that is… people are miss a lot. You know? I mean, clearly, when you have a westerner come here, for sure, you would like to have some alcohol. I mean, there’s… there’s no need to… to deny that, obviously. But, I think, to have an experience in Saudi Arabia without alcohol is something to be tried. But then today, it’s the government, Saudi government decide if this policy to continue or not to continue, and it’s going to continue in certain areas. You know? You’ve been to Red Sea, I think. Yes. In certain areas, if you would like to have this, to be a permit or not. It’s not for me, but I’m more interested with both scenarios.

TUCKER CARLSON: It’s just interesting because it’s one of the last pretty sober societies in the world. Do you… I mean, you’ve lived in a number of places. Mhmm. What… what are the differences?

PRINCE ALWALEED: It’s good to be sober.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah. It is good to be sober.

PRINCE ALWALEED: It’s nice to be sober.

TUCKER CARLSON: Good.

PRINCE ALWALEED: I’ll quote you for that. “Be good to be sober.” Love it. You’re… you’re something else, Tucker.

TUCKER CARLSON: Prince Leed, thank you very much for taking all this time.

PRINCE ALWALEED: Pleasure. Thank you.

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