Call Her Daddy: w/ Kesha – Serve C*nt & Prevail (Transcript)

You have been literally dragged through the mud in every direction. And then you’re like, at some point I think I gotta just decide I’m not going to have it. But it’s so horrible that it takes us to the end of the earth essentially to be like, “Now I can stand outside in the sun and fing naked and be like, hallelujah, I fing love my life.”

KESHA: And I don’t care if somebody can see.

ALEX COOPER: Who gives a s*?

KESHA: Who gives a s*? That’s something I wish somebody told me. Nobody cares. Nobody cares. They might care for a headline, but nobody actually cares.

ALEX COOPER: We all think everyone is so consumed with what we’re doing. They’re not.

KESHA: They don’t care. I mean, I have been through so many things and I was walking around like, “Oh my God, everyone knows that you can probably Google a picture of my butthole.” Probably. So many of the things in my life are on the internet that should not be on the internet. Don’t know how it got there, don’t like that it’s there, but you could probably do it. So I’m walking around with so much embarrassment. Then I kind of realized, nobody cares. Nobody, nobody cares.

Growing Up with a Single Mom

ALEX COOPER: You had an interesting upbringing in the sense that your mom chose to have you on her own. There was no man romantically involved in her life. When you got older, how did she talk to you about this?

KESHA: Well, I’ve met some of the people that may be my birth father.

ALEX COOPER: Okay.

KESHA: But she really wanted a Pisces. So here I am, triple Pisces. And so I have met some of the people that might be my birth father. And she was like, “Who do you look more like?” And I was like, “Mom, no, stop, stop it.” But so, yeah, that’s how.

ALEX COOPER: And can you explain your mother wanting a Pisces?

KESHA: Well, the Pisces, supposedly it’s the last in the cycle of the astrological signs. So we’re the last. I’ve been told I’m in my last lifetime multiple times. We’re very emotional. We’re very in touch with all things spiritual. We’re like one foot in the ether vibes.

ALEX COOPER: So you believe in past lives?

KESHA: Oh yeah. I have a song called Past Lives.

ALEX COOPER: What do you think you were doing back then?

KESHA: I think I was burned at the stake. I definitely was a man, and I have — this is a delusion that’s helped me in a lot of ways, but I like to think that I am the reincarnation of Athena.

ALEX COOPER: As you should.

KESHA: Whatever works.

ALEX COOPER: You’re like, you can also just decide what your past lives were.

KESHA: Whatever you think is the cuntiest thing, go for it.

ALEX COOPER: That is who you f*ing were in your past life, bitch. Okay. So you weren’t necessarily raised by any male figures in your life. What did your mom teach you by being this single mother role about independence?

KESHA: I mean, it taught me so much. I’m so grateful I saw a woman that just did it all. She wrote iconic songs. She wrote songs for Dolly Parton and Johnny Cash and she’s so cool. And she raised 3 kids all on her own. And she also was really instrumental in the power of looking at your life positively and deciding who you want to be and what you’re going to do. She really always was like, “Don’t say, ‘Oh, maybe I’ll be a pop star.'” She said, “I’m going to be a pop star.” It’s a little delusional, but it also worked to really believe in yourself.

ALEX COOPER: Was she at all hesitant about you getting into this crazy industry?

KESHA: I think she always warned me that it was hard.

ALEX COOPER: Yeah.

KESHA: But I literally was yodeling by the age of 3 in the backyard. She’d be like, “You’re so loud, go yodel in the backyard.” And so I’d be wandering around the backyard yodeling. She’s like, “What is she going to do?” I knew what I was supposed to do. I came out of the womb yodeling.

ALEX COOPER: Do you still yodel?

KESHA: I mean, on TikTok, the “oh, oh, oh” is my weird spooky Monster Mash voice version of a yodel, kind of.

ALEX COOPER: So you brought it into your adult life and into your music, just in a little bit of a different way than when you were 3?

KESHA: Listen, whatever that is, I did that.

The TikTok Music Video Contest

ALEX COOPER: We’re not mad about it. Okay. You blew up when you released the song “TikTok” back in 2009. I need you to know, I don’t know what it was — it was some type of thing that you could submit a music video to and then you could try to win. I made one.

KESHA: Are we going to watch it?

Walking Down Memory Lane

ALEX COOPER: No, no, no, no, no. I’m like, roll the clip. But I made my dad take my best friend Kristen and I to New York City and we made a full TikTok music video. I actually think it was kind of good. Spoiler, I think we have to see it. I didn’t win. I’ll pull it up for you after. Yeah, I’m going to send it to you because it’s not embarrassing because I know the type of person you are. You’d be like, “Slay queen, yes, like, get it, bitch, brace face, love it.” But I was a huge— like, I was in it, like, I was there, I was loving it. And I just remember that era so clearly.

So I want to go through a couple walk down memory lanes with you. There’s some pictures next to your chair. Reach down and pull them up. Okay, I want you to just tell me what you feel looking at these pictures? And what do you remember?

KESHA: Ah, I’m like so happy about it. I’m really happy about this. I like— yes, you know what, f yeah. Like, I was having fun and I did not give one single f what anybody thought.

ALEX COOPER: That was Jingle Ball 2009.

KESHA: Yeah.

ALEX COOPER: I also think your makeup and just the hair and everything. The outfits were so iconic. How did you come up with the glitter and the mascara?

KESHA: Oh my gosh. Okay. To be honest with you, I grew up seeing my mom be this single parent and loving punk music and rock and roll, like Bowie and Iggy Pop and the Stones. And Alice Cooper. So this is inspired by Alice Cooper and Bowie. And I just always remember thinking, like, if a boy can do it, why can’t I do it?

And one of the first albums I listened to a lot was Licensed to Ill, Beastie Boys. That was produced by Rick Rubin, who I later got to work with. And I just remember really being attracted to people that were like, okay, being like a silly fing crazy goose. And I was like, I want to be a silly crazy goose. I don’t want to be like— like, I would go to school and everyone would straighten their hair, and I’d be like, I don’t want to— I want to do it purple. And I don’t know if that maybe psychologically is because there was no man in the house, but I just wanted to be a silly fing crazy goose.

ALEX COOPER: Do your thing.

KESHA: Yeah.

ALEX COOPER: Did you keep any of that style still? Like, is anything in your closet that resembles that era?

KESHA: I mean, there’s like—

ALEX COOPER: I walked in here with heels and I was like, nah, throw my f*ing Converse. I’m done with this shit. Okay, next one.

Jingle Balls, Grammys, and Baby Biebs

KESHA: Oh my God, that was my first Grammys. And Justin Bieber— we came out basically in the same 12-month cycle. And I remember we would always be at the same Jingle Balls. I was in a radio show in Europe somewhere and we would always see each other and he was just like the heartthrob of all heartthrobs. Yeah. But I did remember being so insecure walking in this dress and heels. I felt like I looked like a baby giraffe that was just born. Like, not in a cute way. No, like in a way where I was going to topple over on the Grammy stage.

ALEX COOPER: You look amazing.

KESHA: Thank you. I actually do look amazing. I just remember being so terrified. Like, a lot of when you’re launched into pop stardom, it’s so fun, but at least for me it was terrifying. I don’t know if other girls have this experience.

ALEX COOPER: What were you scared about?

KESHA: I was just like, it was just so intense. Like, it was so intense. I came from very, very humble beginnings and very young in life, and then Nashville, and then launched into this, and it was just like, it was intense. It was like, you’re being seen in such an intense way that it was just kind of intense.

ALEX COOPER: Yeah, it’s like going from that to then 2010, you’re standing, you’re presenting an award at the Grammys with the biggest star in the world, and you’re like, hello.

KESHA: And I’m walking in heels, which, spoiler alert, I don’t f* with heels, okay? I do it if I’m on a red carpet so my leg looks nice from the side. That’s the only time I do it. I’m usually barefoot and naked. Okay. And so then you have to walk out on stage in these giant heels.

ALEX COOPER: And those stages are hard to walk on.

KESHA: And everyone’s like, “We’re going to give your shoes a 7 out of 10.” I’m like, why? And I can’t walk. And it’s just stressful.

ALEX COOPER: Oh my God. No, you and baby Biebs there. It’s really cute. Okay, next.

KESHA: I’m so proud of him, by the way. I saw his— I wasn’t at Coachella, but I’m so proud of what he just did.

ALEX COOPER: Me too. I have to say, it was incredible.

KESHA: Yeah, I haven’t seen him in forever, but very proud.

ALEX COOPER: Incredible.

KESHA: Amazing work.

ALEX COOPER: Amazing.

The Biggest Tour of Her Life

KESHA: This is the show that I just put on last year. It was my first tour as a free woman. It’s the biggest tour I’ve ever done, period. And I’m independent, period.

ALEX COOPER: Congratulations.

KESHA: Thank you. And it was like, damn, that felt so f*ing good.

ALEX COOPER: Not that you’re even turning around to be like looking at your past being like, “F you all, look what I’m able to do.” But there must have been some feeling of just like, oh my God, I’m so happy that I’ve proven to myself and to the world like I’m still here, I still fing got it.

KESHA: Well, it was like after almost 10 years in litigation. And you just— it’s, you know, I was like, maybe that’s what it was. Maybe like this part of my life, like, that was awesome. And like, but maybe that’s part of the past. And like, I’m so grateful if I got to live that. Like, who gets to say that? And then to go on this tour, it’s going to make me emotional for real. No, stop. Absolutely not.

ALEX COOPER: You’re good.

KESHA: Our makeup. No, it’s okay. You can cry. But the makeup, you know, to be able to go on stage and see tens of thousands of people that quite frankly have seen some major ups and major downs and still want to show up. And, you know, just as a person to feel still worthy and lovable. And it really did something for me this tour.

I feel like I probably got way more emotionally out of this tour than anybody else. Like, I can walk through the world. I walk through the world in a different way because of all the people that showed up for me. And I hope that I also was in service of them. That was my intention. But I think accidentally everybody that showed up for this tour did this incredible act of healing for me.

Nine Years in Litigation

ALEX COOPER: Well, even— and I know we don’t need to get into the details today, but even when you say 9 years, 9 years of your life, almost a decade of your life, you are locked into a legal battle where you are fighting for the right for your voice. And then to get out of that and to look out into a crowd and see people there who are just waiting to see you again. Like, how do you feel when you look back at that time of your life to then know the tour eventually came and you did get free?

KESHA: Well, it was so interesting. And I mean, just to give a little bit of context, I signed the record deal I was in when I was 18 years old. I got found when I was 17, and I signed the record deal at 18 years old. And this record deal signed away the rights to my voice and likeness in perpetuity in the universe.

Okay, so things happened. It didn’t feel appropriate for me to remain in the situation I was in. So I did spend 9 years in litigation fighting for the rights to myself back. And it’s just like spiritually and conceptually such a weird— it’s like such a weird concept that somebody else can own something that’s coming from inside of my body. Like, that’s so weird. And I just never could understand it really, spiritually speaking. And then to really be fighting for the rights to my own voice and my own face and my own— my me to myself. Like, what are we talking about? And for it to go on and on and on. And it was like, 9 years is a long time. And there was a lot of support.

ALEX COOPER: Yeah.

KESHA: And I’m like, that support carried me through. Like, one tweet could carry me through for months. Like, one stranger on Twitter— and I should not be on Twitter, but I was, and I saw them— and that would carry me for a really long time. Like, little things would take me through because 9 years is a long time. Like, it’s a long time. A fourth of my life. It’s actually more than a fourth of my life.

ALEX COOPER: How did you keep yourself going through that time? Because I also am thinking about it. I’m like, anyone listening to this— even when you put it that way, you’re right. It’s like, it’s from in— it’s you. So I’m sure there were so many moments where you had to think like, what if this is so unjust? And like, what if I didn’t win? Like, what if I— does that mean I lose myself? Like, how did you grapple with those emotions as a human?

KESHA: It was honestly very hard. Like, I’m not going to sugarcoat it. I feel like I had to just hide because it was so hard. And I feel like I’m so synonymous with joy, and I love that. I love bringing people joy. But when I could not show up as that for others, because you can only give away what you have for yourself. And I would try, like, in this litigation, I would go out on tour and I would sing the hit songs. And I tried, but it was really difficult. It was just a really difficult, complicated, really confusing for me, even. The emotions were so complicated.

ALEX COOPER: What do you think your dominant emotion was at that time?

KESHA: I was so lonely. I was so lonely in how anxious I was and how much fear I had, because we’re told to speak up and stand up for ourselves and say something. And I had, and I felt like, why am I getting punished? Like, my medical records are on the internet. My therapy notes are on the internet. Every text message I’ve ever sent, it’s on the internet. Every email I’ve ever sent, it’s on the internet.

I went to treatment for an eating disorder. Those notes that I went in to try to help save my own life— those are on the internet. And I did that because I have nothing to hide. And I now can sit here and talk to you and realize that that’s actually very freeing in a way. So it’s like, kind of feels like sitting naked in my backyard where you’re just like, it’s freedom now. But at the time it was really just so bad. Hell. It felt like f*ing hell.

The Cost of Being an Angry Woman

ALEX COOPER: I also think this is so relatable for women, and something you just said is like, you’re at a place in your life where you are radiating joy and you’re choosing to live in joy, but the way that women can be painted as so angry when we try to stand up for ourselves— I’ve written down a quote you said: “I grew up thinking women can be all the things, but the one thing I really cannot be is an angry woman.” Like, what did you think would happen if you allowed yourself publicly to show your anger towards this unfair situation?

Reclaiming Herself: Body, Anger, and Healing

KESHA: There was a period right before I got treatment for my eating disorder where Timber was the number one song in the world, and I was in my bedazzled bodysuits with my dancers and my wig. And behind the scenes, I was not having fun. I was starving myself. And I had this moment where I looked in the mirror — and I told you I grew up on punk music, like Iggy Pop. I have an Iggy Pop tattoo — and I looked in the mirror and I’m like, “What are we doing? What are we doing? What are we doing?” And I canceled the rest of that tour and I started a band called Yeast Infection, and I only played dive bars.

ALEX COOPER: Kesha, I love you.

KESHA: I’m pretty sure everyone was like, “And she’s lost her goddamn mind.” And I’m sitting there thinking, Papa Iggy Pop would be so proud of me. I’m burning it down. F* the man! And then shortly thereafter, I got help and treatment and started trying to sort through the emotions.

To be honest with you, anger is so interesting as a woman, isn’t it? Nobody wants to see that. Because we’re hysterical and we’re crazy and it’s ugly. And I kind of am down to challenge that, because I actually think it keeps us from being our most boundaried and most powerful selves — keeping us from anger. Because I can only speak for myself, but my anger indicates, and I feel it somatically in my body, I get anger and it means I need to make a boundary and someone is crossing a boundary.

ALEX COOPER: Every woman’s like, “You just described that better than I could have myself.” Why are we not allowed to express that dominant emotion right there? There’s clearly something underneath it. You’re so right. We’re screaming for help.

KESHA: Yes.

ALEX COOPER: Because I’m pretty sure anger is not a dominant emotion. It is a reaction to one of the other emotions. We’re hurt, we’re in pain, we’re sad — whatever it is that someone usually made us feel. And so I’m f*ing pissed off. And people are like, “No, no, no, no, no.” Anger is just the top layer.

KESHA: That’s ugly.

ALEX COOPER: And no one wants to ask what happened. No one says, “Well, wait, what happened? Why are you so angry?” They’re like, “Girl, that is a bad look on you.” And it’s like, do you want to ask why I’m pissed the f off? Never. Just be quiet. Sit down. Shut the f up.

KESHA: Well, I think I’m down — so if I’m going to back it up, this is why I love songwriting. Because that is a safe place to go absolutely buck wild. I always think, where is a safe place to be really f*ing angry? Let me tell you where — when you’re screaming a song into a microphone and all your friends are like, “Oh my God, girl, that sounds great,” and they’re cheering for you. Oh my God, this is why I write music.

ALEX COOPER: It’s a little less intense when it’s music. It’s like, “Oh, this is a bop, girl.” And you’re like, little did you know, I’m actually f*ing serious when I’m dead screaming.

KESHA: Screaming. But that’s the power of music, girl.

Cult Leader 101 and Queer Church

ALEX COOPER: Okay, next one. Because maybe I don’t know what the f* this relates to, but here we are. “Cult Leader 101.” You posted this back in January. Kesha, what’s happening here?

KESHA: Well, okay — what is happening? So I’m a Pisces, and statistically Pisces are great cult leaders.

ALEX COOPER: Okay.

KESHA: We were going to Brazil and I haven’t been to Brazil in forever. And I was thinking about how the word “culture” — it’s like “cult.” Church. And then I was with my dancers and they were like, “You’re kind of our cult leader.” And I’m like, “Well, what’s the cult?”

My goal is to kind of create queer church. When I was designing my show, I wanted it to feel like a pop church for all people — but specifically, having gone to church after church after church in my life, wanting to go to divinity school, and being part of the queer community and caring very deeply about the queer community. I wanted — one of my main goals — the last act of my show on this tour is called Queer Church. Because throughout my whole career, I wouldn’t be shit if it weren’t for the queer community. And as a pop star, I owe everything to the queer community. And I want to always make a safe space for all people.

Misconceptions and Moving On

ALEX COOPER: What do you think is the biggest misconception about you?

KESHA: Oh, shit. Oh, shit. I don’t even — truly, it depends on what article you read, what era. I don’t even know. That’s the craziest part about having everything in your life on the internet.

ALEX COOPER: Truly, it’s almost like it depends on who you ask.

KESHA: Depends on — I have no idea. I literally don’t know. And part of me is like, do I care? Because I’m so f*ing solid.

ALEX COOPER: It’s so good. Like, I don’t give a f*.

KESHA: No, it’s so good. After this litigation, I was truly so full of fear. It was in my bone marrow. And I spent so much time and energy focusing on trying to regulate myself and regulate my nervous system and heal. And I am so f*ing good with myself now. And that is like a miracle. So I don’t know. People might think — oh, I don’t even know.

ALEX COOPER: You’re like, “I don’t care.”

KESHA: I don’t — I mean, I’m kind of curious, but then it’s kind of like going on Twitter. Do I want to know?

ALEX COOPER: Like, what are these bitches f*ing saying?

Reclaiming Pleasure and Sexuality

ALEX COOPER: I want to talk about something that I thought was very interesting. You said to Monica Lewinsky that during that time you weren’t able to have an orgasm because of the stress that you were under. What has it been like reclaiming your sexuality?

KESHA: Oh my God, it’s a miracle. It’s a miracle. Should I say this? I probably should. I don’t care. I’m free. I am now mostly celibate, you know, except for when you’re in Italy.

ALEX COOPER: What did you just say about Italy?

KESHA: I’m celibate except for when I’m in Italy.

ALEX COOPER: Okay. Oh, I like that. It’s like by country.

KESHA: Listen, whatever.

ALEX COOPER: Anyways, you like the Italians.

KESHA: Okay, but so now I actually masturbate to gratitude meditations.

ALEX COOPER: You’re lying to me.

KESHA: I certainly am not.

ALEX COOPER: Kesha. They’re like, “Breathe in and be grateful.” Ah.

KESHA: Don’t knock it till you try it.

ALEX COOPER: Honestly, everyone, let me just say — those downloads on the gratitude ones are going to go way up.

KESHA: Remember when I said I started every day with a gratitude meditation? It’s been amazing. Literally, when I got my freedom, I was like, I think — you know, I’m pissed about a lot of stuff, but one of the things is pleasure. I keep coming back to pleasure. It is okay as a woman to feel pleasure in this world. When you go through things, pleasure is not the number one neural pathway that your brain always goes to when you have survived things. And I had to reprogram that, and I do it every f*ing day, and I’m not even embarrassed about it.

ALEX COOPER: You shouldn’t be. You absolutely shouldn’t be. And I think especially as women — I relate to this — when we are stressed or we’re going through something traumatic, the actual last thing that we can think about is sex and pleasure, because our bodies are so frozen. We literally can’t feel our bodies. To lose that part of yourself and to shut down, and then to be able to now be like, “I connect this shit with gratitude, motherf*er.”

KESHA: Totally.

ALEX COOPER: Wow.

KESHA: And this is why I am celibate — because I’m calling in a f*ing king. It’s time for my king.

ALEX COOPER: You’re manifesting.

KESHA: My pussy is manifesting with gratitude that my king is coming. Because your body has to align with your reality before it shows up in your life.

ALEX COOPER: So are there kings in Italy? What’s going on over there?

KESHA: There are some f*ing kings in Italy.

Body Image, Impossible Standards, and Self-Love

ALEX COOPER: Kind of love it. I know you also mentioned going through this experience of not feeling right in your body — being on the world stage, having people comment, just the exploitation to the nth degree of people feeling like they are entitled to a woman’s body. It’s so disturbing. And I also think the impossible standards that we’re held to — be hot but don’t be slutty, be hot but don’t be fake — there’s so much. How have you managed to get rid of those expectations? Because you are so confident now, and we need your wisdom on how you’ve just learned to be comfortable with who you are.

KESHA: It’s been such a journey, right? From the beginning of my career. And it’s been very public — people have commented on my body. I internalize those comments. I make that the word of God. I try to adjust my body to somebody else’s idea of what they want me to be. I went through a horrible filler phase. God, that sucked. Because I was like, “Oh, that’s what I should do.” And then I’m like, “I actually don’t like the way that looks.” But it’s just this constant dance with society on what it means to be a woman and what is acceptable.

And also, we’re not supposed to age. Trust me, I don’t want to, right? But I don’t know what else to do. So I try to have — because my body image can get very perfectionism-y. That’s what came up when I was in the eating disorder, which has been a while ago now. So it’s interesting to talk about it, because I just really wanted to be loved.

And in my healing process, since I got my freedom, I realized wanting to be famous and wanting to be loved — all of that actually had to come from myself. And it couldn’t be fake self-love. It could not be performative words from a stage. I had to sit with myself and really treat myself with kindness and grace and gratitude. And I sat with my leg — I tore my ACL on stage, and I f*ing finished that show, and I played another one. I’m so grateful.

ALEX COOPER: But I remember, Kesha — wasn’t it that after you did that, the headlines were that you were drunk on stage?

KESHA: Things like that make your blood boil, because I don’t drink before I go on stage, girl. I barely drink. That’s probably a huge misconception. But I don’t want to have to defend myself, right?

The Party Girl Persona

ALEX COOPER: Talk to me a little bit about that persona that you built. I know everyone builds a form when you have this public image. I feel like there was this very wild child, party girl that you were bringing forth to the world and people loved it. But how intentional was that?

Joy, Resistance, and the Party Girl Persona

KESHA: I think that that is absolutely a part of where I was at. I was in my early 20s and I think people love a headline. We love the drama, the salacious, we love it. So it was a version of a thing I did sometimes, just like everybody at that age. And it was fun, and it’s funny to talk about. It’s also probably more interesting to write a song about a night, a wild night, than like, getting a car wash, right? Like, I don’t know. Now I’m going to challenge myself.

ALEX COOPER: Yeah, but right, go right after this.

KESHA: At the time, it was also I write many, many, many songs for a record. Like, I’m talking like 100+. So let’s just say I wanted to showcase other sides of my personality with single choices. But like, the party thing was working, right? And so it became almost like a caricature of itself, which is not to say it was never disingenuous. I was having a great time and having fun and romping around the world. But I think the balance of that is also who I am, which didn’t maybe get as much of a spotlight at the time because one thing was really working.

ALEX COOPER: And how much do you think that that public persona influenced the way people treated you?

KESHA: Well, I think that there has been a level of can write off a talent because there’s autotune or it’s a silly song or it’s a pop song or like, there’s so many ways to try to discount kind of like what I’ve done. But the cool thing is, is that I’m always like, “All right, y’all go write one. Go ahead, write one. See how easy it is?”

Like, part of— I actually truly think this, we were talking about this earlier, but joy is such an act of resistance. A lot of times in my career, my joy has been written off as something that is not maybe that impressive because it’s kind of silly, it’s kind of fing goofy, it’s kind of just crazy. But I think to vibrate in the frequency of like silly goose sht is actually magical.

ALEX COOPER: It is, because you don’t give a f*. And that though can piss people off.

KESHA: Totally, babe.

ALEX COOPER: I could have gone to Barnard, okay? I’m really f*ing smart, and I also can be really fun and silly, and both things can exist. But you then refute— you’re taking away my intellect because I’m having fun and I have an image and I’m leaning in and I’m doing all these fun things because that’s what everyone wants.

KESHA: We have to be able to put them in a box because we need to be able to fit them into a structure where we can make sense of it. And guess what, bitches? No. How about no?

ALEX COOPER: That’s just not how life works with humans.

KESHA: I’m not going to do it. I’m not going to do it.

ALEX COOPER: I’m not going to.

KESHA: I’m just not going to. And trust me, they’re mad at me.

ALEX COOPER: Livid. They’re—

KESHA: mad, but I’m not.

ALEX COOPER: You’re happy?

KESHA: Like, no, I’m like killing it. I just sold out MSG. I’m chilling. So like, they tried so hard to make me so sad. No.

The Power of Joy

ALEX COOPER: Can we also talk about this joy? Because you’re right, we were talking about it for the interview and the way you talk about it, it’s so refreshing because I just don’t feel like as women, and especially if you’re trying to forge a path for yourself and be successful, when you’re smiling and you’re enjoying your success, no one wants to see that.

KESHA: No.

ALEX COOPER: And it’s like really disorienting to people, and I just don’t know why.

KESHA: I don’t either. I think that— what do I think? I don’t know. I think that when you are— I think we’re all mirrors for each other. And to some, you could be a massive inspiration, and to some, you can be a reflection of what they are not achieving in their life.

I know I just feel like I have been projected upon a lot. And kind of going back to the body stuff, it’s like I tried to shapeshift to make everybody happy. And then at some point, when you do that for literally almost 20 years, you start to be like, “I’m going to Italy, I’m eating the pasta, see you guys later, eat sh*t and die.”

ALEX COOPER: Eat sht and die, everyone. Eat sht and die. Well, it’s just like, what a—

KESHA: what? I can’t.

Dating Life: Kings, Red Flags, and Italy

ALEX COOPER: Can we talk about these kings in Italy? Yeah, let’s talk about your dating life.

KESHA: Oh God, okay. LOL, let’s go.

ALEX COOPER: Okay, so you’re celibate except for when you’re in Italy?

KESHA: Well, I mean, like, mostly.

ALEX COOPER: Yeah, yeah, unless there’s like—

KESHA: celibate was like the goal. Yeah, progress, not perfection. Got it.

ALEX COOPER: Are you single?

KESHA: Yes.

ALEX COOPER: Okay.

KESHA: Very single.

ALEX COOPER: Okay. I’m going to kind of— well, first of all, you have a song called “Red Flag.”

KESHA: Yeah.

ALEX COOPER: Where you just like straight up admit to loving a red flag in a partner.

KESHA: This is why I’ve been mostly celibate. Okay. And I’m going to remain very single on purpose.

ALEX COOPER: Yep.

KESHA: Because we have worked on this trait of mine.

ALEX COOPER: What were some toxic traits we’re not into anymore, but maybe in the past we were a little like, huh?

KESHA: So I think are hot? Yeah, just like truly the funnier the story, the hotter. I have just dated people I have no business dating. Just no— there are some stories I really want to tell, but I don’t want to call anybody out. But like one eye, which I think is hot. Yeah, he was cool. Okay, but like the line got drawn because he just smelled kind of like a Subway sandwich that had been sitting in the back of your car for a couple of days. And like, honestly, you better work. But it was just not a match. It was like a vibe because I’m actually secretly a hippie. But like, there’s a line. Yeah, for me, you know.

ALEX COOPER: Okay, wait, then I’m going to give you some dating disasters. You tell me if any of this relates to you.

KESHA: Okay, go ahead.

ALEX COOPER: Give me the story. What is the pettiest reason you’ve ever gotten dumped?

KESHA: I’ve only gotten dumped actually one time, and it’s because the guy was dating— I kind of thought he was probably a starfucker, and I was like, I’m just going to test this theory. And so I went to the Eras, like after the tour there’s a little party, and I was just like, I’m going to pop in, take my girlfriend, I’m not going to take the boyfriend, just see how this goes. We were together for a year and a half. That dude came over the next day, dropped the keys off. And that was that. I was like, “Have you no shame? Like, couldn’t you wait like 11 days or something?”

ALEX COOPER: Him being like so angry with you.

KESHA: Oh, you’re like tantrum. I mean, over— if you’re going to do it over anybody, Taylor Swift.

ALEX COOPER: Honestly, fair, fair, fair, fair, fair, fair. Honestly, I would have a f*ing tantrum too. Yeah, yeah, fair, fair, fair. But get it together. Okay, what’s a time you completely misread the vibes and you’re like, wait, no, this is not how I felt.

KESHA: Oh, with a guy? Yeah. Misread the vibes. Well, let’s just say I had these two athletes, two of them at the same time, and they were like, “Let’s hang out.” And I was like, I can’t, because I realized— I forget, there’s a word for this. But if I don’t like someone’s brain, I can’t deal with their penis.

ALEX COOPER: Penis. That’s it.

KESHA: I’m going to say bisexual, but I just like— I really like, I was excited because I got my orgasm back, you know? And I was like, I’m going to kind of have a hoe phase. Like, what’s that like? And I can’t.

ALEX COOPER: No, no, no.

KESHA: So that’s, yeah, the athletes. It’s—

ALEX COOPER: it sounds like a good idea, and then you get there and you’re like, hmm.

KESHA: I was— it was like a really cute flirtation, but I just like, I misread my own vibe in thinking that I could have a hoe phase. I think I just want a king. I just want like one. I just want to masturbate and meditate.

ALEX COOPER: Dude. Okay, what is the time you found out you were potentially the other woman?

KESHA: Oh, well, okay. I met this guy and I was really into his brain, and then we had a little kiki, had a little makeout. It’s cute.

ALEX COOPER: Love.

KESHA: But then I found out he was polyamorous. Okay, so it’s not really the other woman, but it is like an open situation. And so anytime I’m met with like— I felt very judgmental, you know, I was like, oh, I’m judging the situation. I’m judging my part of being in the situation. And then I had a conversation and like, it’s a full-blown life choice. They’ve been doing it for a very long time. His partner has a full-blown other partner. And so I was like, I’m going to give this a try for a moment, and it turns out it just was not for me.

ALEX COOPER: You just want a king to yourself.

KESHA: I think the most like, devotion. Oh my God, do you know that someone built a pyramid for somebody? Didn’t they?

ALEX COOPER: I think so.

KESHA: Okay, so we’re going to go with it.

ALEX COOPER: We’re going to f*ing go with it. Fact check.

KESHA: Fact check.

ALEX COOPER: In your mind, that’s what you want.

KESHA: But like, what would you want someone to build you? Like, I want a f*ing cathedral full of cats and starbursts. I don’t know, I just like want— and like a river running through it. Oh, and like a weeping willow next to the dolphins.

ALEX COOPER: Obviously, obviously, obviously, that’s what every woman wants. You’re like, “Clip this, send this to him in Italy. Get started.”

KESHA: Yes. With a manicurist inside of my pyramid.

ALEX COOPER: I love—

KESHA: where are the men like this?

ALEX COOPER: So a pyramid. I like this.

KESHA: I like this for you. What do you want built?

ALEX COOPER: You know, I’ve never thought about it, but I don’t think anything I could say would top what you just said. So I’ll take what she’s having. Honestly, come visit. I’ll take the cats and the starbursts and the weeping willow. What is the worst meet the parents interaction you’ve ever had?

Dating Disasters: Indiana, Athletes, and Red Flags

KESHA: Oh, wow. I had one in Indiana. I’m not going to say his name. Okay. He knows who he is. He took me to Indiana and I had only gone on like 2 dates and it just ended up being like, I love Indiana, but like this particular meeting the parents after just a couple of dates was like wildly awkward. And then everyone thinks because I’m coming home, then we’re getting married.

ALEX COOPER: And you had 2 dates.

KESHA: Yeah, but that was my bad. See, crazy horny. I get horny for crazy. Like, if someone’s like, “I know, let’s do this.” Like, really? It’s a bad idea. And I’m like, that sounds funny. I do it for fun. I do it for like the book.

ALEX COOPER: Wait, let’s go to Indiana and meet your parents.

KESHA: And I’m like, “Oh my God, I’m this bitch. This is the beginning of the most epic love story ever told. And then it’s going to end with him building me a pyramid.” And it never— in Indiana, though, f*ing does. This is just why I’m mostly celibate.

ALEX COOPER: Okay. Yeah, no, I think definitely don’t go meet the parents after 2 dates, right?

KESHA: That was my bad. It was a good story.

ALEX COOPER: What is the biggest lie you ever caught someone in?

KESHA: Hmm. Okay. There was a guy I dated for like a long time. Okay. And I don’t know, if you ask my dancers, he may not have a home.

ALEX COOPER: Was he living with you?

KESHA: I don’t want to answer this question.

ALEX COOPER: You’re like, Alex, shut up. That’s not, it’s not your business. That’s not important.

KESHA: Okay.

ALEX COOPER: He may or may not have been living with me and we never went to his place, but he always has an excuse why we never really busy.

KESHA: I was designing my tour and then I was like, literally hand designing everything. And it was like, I’ll go see your place when I have time. And then one thing led to another, and then the—

ALEX COOPER: You never saw the place because I don’t know if it exists. I don’t know. Yeah, yep.

KESHA: No, I know the red flag thing.

ALEX COOPER: It’s okay.

KESHA: I know, this is why I am— You’re so self-aware right now.

ALEX COOPER: You’re like, I know. At least you recognize it, you know? Like, you’ll always be on guard now if they never, like, by the third time, like, want to come to mine.

KESHA: It has to be that I have to, like, I need— I’m just going to— what do we do? Literally, as women, like, what do we do?

ALEX COOPER: Just try to— you prevail.

KESHA: Okay, like, I think you just serve ct and prevail and just close the pussy up and call in kings. That’s what I’m trying— that’s like my— we’re working on it, but sometimes they don’t have homes, and then you should definitely not let them move in with you unless you do a background check first.

ALEX COOPER: You have the background checks, Kesha.

KESHA: I know, let’s get on that. I know.

The Most Rogue First Date

ALEX COOPER: What is the most rogue first date you’ve ever been on?

KESHA: Hmm.

ALEX COOPER: Your face. Hmm.

KESHA: Well, for my birthday, someone sent me a yacht. Not like as a present, but like for me and my whole crew. But they weren’t even there. Oh, so it was kind of a first date. And it was my favorite one because he wasn’t there.

ALEX COOPER: You’re like, send me shit and don’t come around. You’re like, that’s actually the kind of relationship I want. Give me all the good things, but I don’t want to ever see you. Okay, don’t annoy me. You’re so f*ing annoying. But send the yacht, babe, and build the pyramid, and I’ll be in the pyramid all alone. Okay, what is the weirdest place you’ve ever hooked up with someone?

KESHA: Hmm, weirdest. Let me take a little walk down memory lane for a minute. Weirdest place I’ve ever hooked up with somebody. It’s like Planes, Trains and Automobiles vibes. Like on a bus, in a bus bathroom, in a bunk on a bus. You’re on tour. I’m always on tour, which is kind of the thing. At a sexy bathroom at the restaurant.

ALEX COOPER: Love that.

KESHA: I love nature sex. It’s the best.

ALEX COOPER: In like the woods?

KESHA: Yeah, it’s the best. Really?

ALEX COOPER: With like sticks?

KESHA: Oh, and the leaves, honey.

ALEX COOPER: And the bark, sweetie.

KESHA: Yeah, and the worms. Get in there, wherever, baby.

ALEX COOPER: And that mud, honey. You’re like, what just went in my vagina? Oh, that wasn’t his dick.

KESHA: No, actually, maybe my favorite sex has been like body paint. Like paint in the woods. In the grass. But there’s paint and there’s a canvas and there’s sexiness happening.

ALEX COOPER: I can picture it. I like it for you.

KESHA: Thank you.

Staying Friends with Exes

ALEX COOPER: Are you the type of person that stays friends with their ex?

KESHA: I do. If you’re like a real shit, I’m going to write a song about you, and it is what it is. If you’re not, if it’s just like not a match, totally.

ALEX COOPER: Yep.

KESHA: I kind of realize now that I’m free and I’m independent and I’m sovereign, and it’s this whole energy of like, if you don’t f* with me then love that. But the guys that were using me to get in the paparazzi pictures or lied to me about having a home, that is a deal breaker. It’s a deal breaker.

ALEX COOPER: We gotta cut it off.

KESHA: Standards.

ALEX COOPER: Have you ever been cheated on?

KESHA: I think they know that I’m a little crazy.

ALEX COOPER: You’re like, they ended it before because they knew— they knew you. No, you don’t want to do that.

KESHA: Like, I collect human teeth.

Collecting Human Teeth

ALEX COOPER: Let’s talk about that. What’s going on?

KESHA: Well, so I’ve been collecting them for a while now.

ALEX COOPER: Okay.

KESHA: And I make art out of them. My cats had to get their little teeth taken out because they were— I don’t know— their little kitty wisdom teeth. I collect those too. I’m like the tooth fairy.

ALEX COOPER: And didn’t fans like used to send you their teeth?

KESHA: Yeah. No, they still do.

ALEX COOPER: And did you ask for that?

KESHA: Yes.

ALEX COOPER: What? How did that come about?

KESHA: I tweeted it.

ALEX COOPER: You said what?

KESHA: “Can you send me your teeth?”

ALEX COOPER: Just like, “Send me your teeth. Good morning. Hit me up.”

KESHA: Love you.

ALEX COOPER: And what did you want to do with the teeth?

KESHA: Well, I make art, I make jewelry. I’ve made a crown, like a headdress. I made a belt.

ALEX COOPER: Wait, the thing you’re carrying isn’t a tooth, right?

KESHA: Oh no, that’s my placenta.

ALEX COOPER: Oh wait. What? Where’s that? Where did it go?

KESHA: Uh-oh, I lost my placenta on your—

ALEX COOPER: Oh my God, where is your placenta? You were holding it. Maybe it went down into the crevices. We’ll get it after.

KESHA: What’s in here?

ALEX COOPER: You were holding your placenta earlier.

KESHA: Yeah, I brought it in. So your placenta supposedly gives you second sight, helps open your third eye. This is according to my mother. So she stuck it in the oven. She put it in a box, and she found it when I was like 21 years old in the basement. Wait, you had to like fight for my placenta? My mom— they tried to take my placenta away from her at the hospital, and she like f*ing threw a conniption fit, and she fought for it. She fought for that. So now I carry it around. She put it in the oven, wrapped it up in a box, stuck it in the basement. We found it. Throw it in the blender, pop it in a necklace, work.

ALEX COOPER: Art. That’s it. Oh, give us a little show to the camera.

KESHA: Okay.

ALEX COOPER: That’s your placenta and it’s in there?

KESHA: Uh-huh.

ALEX COOPER: And do you travel with that everywhere?

KESHA: Yeah.

ALEX COOPER: What does it bring you?

KESHA: I just feel like— I love a good ritual, right? Like I’m a cult leader.

ALEX COOPER: Mm-hmm.

KESHA: We all saw in the photo. And I just love a ritual that reminds me of this esoteric world I prefer to live in. Like down here on Earth, boring. But when I go up into like with my spirit guides and the whole realm of angels, that’s where I prefer to be. It’s kind of fun. It’s like the teeth, it just reminds me when I have a little piece of the people I love, what they’re going to throw. Where do they put teeth anyways? What do you throw them in? The toilet?

ALEX COOPER: Yeah.

KESHA: Where do you— like, when you take your kids’ teeth— tooth fairies out there— yeah, where do you put them?

ALEX COOPER: You send them to Kesha.

KESHA: You send them to me. Because, like, where else are you going to put them? In the trash?

ALEX COOPER: Have you ever gotten anyone that you’re like, oh, I gotta throw this one out, it’s a little—

KESHA: Oh, I’ve gotten crazy ones, and I live for it. I’m currently trying to design a coffee table, and the center I want to just be a bowl of all the teeth. So if people want to send it to me. This is actually like art I make out of it. I live for it.

ALEX COOPER: You’re literally the tooth fairy.

Breaking Off the Engagement

ALEX COOPER: I know you once broke off an engagement. What led you to that decision? Because that must have been tough.

KESHA: It was really hard. It was during litigation. It was COVID. The legal bills were coming in hot and aggressively at a time where I could not tour. And I’m engaged to someone who is a beautiful person, but quite frankly, I just didn’t see us growing together.

And I think to be honest with you, there have been many people that I’ve dated that have felt one way or another about what I do for a living. And it’s like, my fans are the love of my life. Like, they really are. It’s my longest relationship I’ve ever had. And we’ve grown up together and they’ve shown up for me. They stood outside the f*ing courthouse. My fans and my music, it’s my life’s work.

And I’ve had— not him so much, but a little bit— and other relationships that almost neg because maybe they feel a type of way about what I do. I just realized, especially in my freedom and independent era and sovereignty, that I only want a partner— again, going back to really wanting a partnership that can visionary our life together. And I want them to be like, “Baby, be fing bigger.” Yeah, be even more. I want you to eat your healthy omega-3 fatty acids to feed your fing gorgeous brain. Like, that’s the partner I want. Like, “Take your magnesium, you sexy b*h.”

ALEX COOPER: He just wants you to keep f*ing climbing and taking over instead of being like a little wiener in the corner being like, you’re outshining me, or you’re getting too big. And you’re like— you just can’t have someone holding you back. But I think a lot of women feel like, maybe I am too much. And I also think what’s so admirable about that decision, regardless of the person, I think a lot of people can relate. Like, when you get engaged, I think there’s such a—

KESHA: It’s such—

Ending the Engagement and Trusting Your Gut

ALEX COOPER: It feels like it’s such a beautiful time in your life, but there are a lot of people who recognize like, oh my God, almost making it more finalized made me realize maybe this isn’t what I want. And there’s so much fear, I think, of ending it, whether like you already posted on Instagram that you’re engaged, so like this is going to be so embarrassing if we call it off, or people publicly know about it, or the families or whatever. Like, how did you deal with the emotional weight of knowing you wanted to end something, but also knowing optically, like, there’s so much also that comes with that type of fallout?

KESHA: I think that, since— speak for myself— since I was a little girl, I have seen many movies, read many books. There are many stories about how one of my life’s greatest missions is to find my soulmate, my missing piece, the person that will complete me and really give my whole life meaning. And I realized, going from being not free and not sovereign to sovereign and free, that I’d really like to challenge that and feel whole and complete on my own.

Ending something with someone is always difficult, especially if you love them, especially if you’ve integrated your life with their family. But I think kind of going back to the samurai piece, like, your gut is going to tell you if you are with the right partner. And my gut became unavoidable. And I had to weigh the option of honoring myself or doing something that is— it’s horrible to break up with someone you love. It’s so difficult. And I have so much love for him and his family. They’re beautiful, beautiful people. I just didn’t feel like we were growing in the same direction. And I’m wildly ambitious, and he was more comfortable. He was more satisfied, which I’m not saying that one is better than the other. I actually sometimes wish I could just be more satisfied and chill.

ALEX COOPER: It just didn’t match.

KESHA: It just didn’t. It wasn’t a match, at the end. And it was really difficult. But we’re still friends, and I have so much love for him. He’s a really good person.

ALEX COOPER: I love that. And I think also just women listening, that’s such a good testament, too, to when you deny what you’re feeling in your gut, it’s never going to go away. You can put Band-Aids on it, you can ignore it, but you’re only just prolonging the pain more and more. And so although sometimes making a really, really hard decision in that moment can feel excruciating and uncomfortable, you’re then already in the process of moving forward with what you know in your gut you’re supposed to do.

And the more that you avoid it, you’re just going to continue to live a life where you’re not being authentic and honest to yourself, and that will eat you alive inside. And it’s kind of not fair to the partner you’re with. They deserve to be with someone also that is wholeheartedly in it with them. And so sometimes it really is the selfless thing to do, as much as it feels selfish in the moment.

KESHA: Totally.

ALEX COOPER: They deserve to be with someone also that is wholeheartedly in it with them. And so sometimes it really is the selfless thing to do, as much as it feels selfish in the moment.

KESHA: Well, it’s interesting, this idea of selfish versus selfless. And I think self-care really does include honoring yourself and your highest good. Because we each have that over ourselves. So to try to people-please to remain in relationship with someone, it is actually quite unfair to both of you. And you have one life. Like, you were born into this life with your one life. And I hope that everyone out there finds exactly what they want in this life. Like, you deserve that.

And if you go down a road, you can begin again every fing second of every day. It is never too late. Like, I am 39 years old and I just went on the biggest tour of my life almost 20 years after my biggest song came out. And to get there, my fing God, was that a road. It was a difficult road. But I had to honor my truth. I had to honor myself. I had to go through what I went through to get there. I had to break up with someone I love, I still love, and I’m so grateful for. I had to have all my f*ing medical records on the internet. I had to have the ugly filler phase. Like, I had to have all these things that were so intolerably painful at the time. And I can sit here and talk to you and be so grateful I went through them. Because I feel so free, and I just want that for everyone.

ALEX COOPER: Everyone.

KESHA: I want everyone to really feel in their authenticity and connected to their highest version of themselves.

New Music: Origami and the Freedom Tour

ALEX COOPER: I’m so happy for you. Like, everything you’ve went through— that’s why I think so many people love you. Not that you should have had to go through it, but you sitting here, I mean, you have new music out, your new single “Origami.” I want to talk about it because— what was the inspiration behind this song?

KESHA: Yeah, I have a new song coming out called “Origami,” and I am having a fun time immortalizing this reclaiming of my sexuality. The past year and a half, 2 years, I’m reclaiming myself, and part of that is my sexuality. And this is a song that’s about, “bend me, twist me, how you want me, baby, make me origami.”

ALEX COOPER: In Italy, just in Italy. Is there an album that would be coming with this as well?

KESHA: I’m trying to figure it out because my God, there are a lot of songs.

ALEX COOPER: You said you always do like 100.

KESHA: Lots of songs are happening at all times.

ALEX COOPER: You’re writing.

KESHA: I’m writing all the time. I mean, my God. So TBD exactly what form it’s going to be in, but there is a new song that’s like so cunty and it’s really fun and it’s just celebrating being in your body and quite frankly having so much fun again in my body at 39 years old, having gone through hell. And I’m having the best time. And I feel like I got to sing songs about it.

ALEX COOPER: Absolutely.

KESHA: Yeah.

ALEX COOPER: You are going on the Freedom Tour this summer.

KESHA: Yes.

ALEX COOPER: What can fans expect from that?

KESHA: Well, I had all this— my story, my trauma was trapped in my body. And I did a psychedelic-assisted therapy. That was really helpful for me and my anxiety. And I kind of was like, how can I tell the story? How can I ever get this all out of my body? And my body was like, “Bitch, you have— you’re playing the Forum. What are you talking about?” It’s like, “No, but I can’t say the whole parts of the story. Like, I can’t talk about it.” And my body was like, “Put it in the show.”

So I tell basically my life story through my life’s work. And that’s why it’s the Freedom Tour. Because I go through the story in the only way that I can, through my life’s work. And the goal is to create love for myself, love with my community, and to really walk through this world in freedom and sovereignty. And it’s like gay church.

ALEX COOPER: Let’s go. Right, let’s go.

KESHA: It was the first time I’ve ever headlined MSG.

ALEX COOPER: Congratulations!

KESHA: Thank you.

ALEX COOPER: What did that feel like?

KESHA: Well, first of all, it was sold out.

ALEX COOPER: Girl, I can’t. How did you feel just chilling in your dressing room before hearing everyone screaming?

KESHA: Cassie Ventura sends me this massive bouquet of these beautiful pink roses before I go out on stage.

ALEX COOPER: Sweet angel.

KESHA: I have chills all over my body talking about it.

ALEX COOPER: Now.

KESHA: And my whole family is there, and it is sold out. And I just can’t tell you— because Cassie was in the room when I recorded the song “TikTok.”

ALEX COOPER: Oh, so she’s been there since day one?

KESHA: Yeah.

ALEX COOPER: Wow.

KESHA: Yeah.

A Night at MSG: A Turning Point

ALEX COOPER: Oh wow. And then everything you guys have both individually been through with horrific, unimaginable situations, to then now be on the other side of it and both be able to be together. I don’t want to speak for you, but I’m seeing you smile and nod and all of it. It’s like, whoa, how emotional was that?

KESHA: Oh, like, so— and she just had a baby and she seems to be doing so well, and I’m so happy for her. It feels so good to witness that.

ALEX COOPER: And I’m sure she feels the same about you.

KESHA: I know, it’s just such a moment. And it was one of the most special nights of my life because there’s this hard curfew at MSG. And if you go over 1 minute, it’s a very bad— it’s a big, big trouble. And the crowd literally started cheering and didn’t stop for, I think it was like 10 or 11 minutes, to the point where everyone’s freaking out and my in-ears being like, “You have to start the next song. You’re going to get—”

ALEX COOPER: Getting tackled off the stage.

KESHA: “You’re fired from New York City forever.” And I just was like, no, this is— I have waited for this kind of— I felt— I was like, I’m not stopping them. There’s no f*ing way. I sat alone in my house and truly questioned the point of living any longer for almost a decade, and I’m going to stop them cheering? Charge it to the card, baby.

ALEX COOPER: It’s worth it. Oh, I can’t even imagine. Did you feel it in your body in that moment?

KESHA: I literally felt like my heart— people say heart chakra, whatever it was— I felt my literal heart. It felt like someone was tearing the fascial tissue apart. And I literally felt my heart open in a way that I don’t think I’ve ever felt anything like in my entire life.

And that’s what I was saying to you earlier. The fans, I hope, had an amazing time this summer, but I don’t think they’re ever going to really be able to understand what that did for me. That night alone was a turning point in my life. It was one of the greatest nights of my entire life.

The Gift of Healing Through Music

ALEX COOPER: I can’t even imagine. What’s so beautiful about the industry, because I know there’s so much pain obviously that it’s brought you. But for you to be able to do the thing that you love so much and that you’re so passionate about, you’re so talented, and do it and get so much fulfillment and healing out of it, but then also to simultaneously be giving such happiness also to your fans. Like, you’re being able to do both at the same time.

What a beautiful gift that you’re giving everyone, and yourself included, because you should put yourself first right now at this time in your life. But the fact that putting yourself first means you want to get on that stage and that’s your healing process— I can only imagine what your fans feel in the crowd. Like, they must feel that from you.

KESHA: Well, I mean, God, they were there at the beginning and we were having fun, and then a bunch of shit happened and it was sad and hard. And now I’m like, now let’s celebrate. Like, that we also have each other in this life. It might be an unusual form of community, but that’s my community. I’ve been doing this for a long time.

ALEX COOPER: And half of the time, again, unfortunately you shouldn’t have to go through it, but when you go through harder shit, it brings you even closer to the people that you love because you can be like— it even— it’s that much sweeter that we get to stand here and say, “I’m free,” and we get to enjoy it that much more because we felt it almost be taken away.

KESHA: Yeah.

ALEX COOPER: And wow.

KESHA: And I do think that’s the art of— I’m writing a book. And it’s called “The Alchemy of Pop.” It’s not going to be ready for a while.

ALEX COOPER: Well, we’ll be waiting.

KESHA: But it’s going to be great, but it’s going to take me a while.

ALEX COOPER: Yeah.

A Message to the Fans

KESHA: But it’s all about alchemizing your experiences in this life. Anything that happens to you, I have found that I can take it and I try to alchemize it into something that can help someone else somehow. And to your point, that’s what I’ve tried to do with my experiences in life. I try to put them into a song. It helps me. And then I really hope it helps other people.

ALEX COOPER: Last two questions. I feel like I could talk to you for 9 hours. How would you describe this current era of your life that you are now in and continuing to enter into?

KESHA: I think I’m just so— for the first time in a long time, I feel so safe in my body and in the world. And I know that’s maybe a crazy thing to say, because the world is crazy. But it’s the first time that I’ve ever felt this. And so I would like to create safe places for people, whatever that means.

I’m just really open to the universe. I would love the universe to show me, I’m like, what is the best way to do that for other people? Because it was like, yeah, to feel safe is everything. And I would love to help other people feel safe. So I’m open to what that means. But I’m in a place where I feel very grateful to be alive. And to have lived through what I lived through and to feel safe. And now I would like to help pay that forward. Wow. Yeah.

A Love Letter to the Fans

ALEX COOPER: For fans who have been with you since day one, what message would you want to leave them with today?

KESHA: Mm. I literally, truly, though, you’re actually the love of my life. Like, I think about all these silly goose men come and go. My animals. I’m so grateful. And I’m sorry your mother has had lots of phases. You’re like, girl, thank you for loving me through all of them. And I just— I’m so, I’m so lucky. I’m so grateful. I’m so grateful. And I’m just very— I’m just so fing grateful. And I want to just continue to create safe spaces for you to come and be authentically as fing weird as you want to be. So hopefully I’ll see you on summer tour and be weird, be so weird.

Closing Thoughts

ALEX COOPER: I feel like I can speak for everyone when we say we love you so much and we are so happy that you are at a place where you do feel safe in your life because you deserve it more than anything. And I am so happy for you and your career, all that you’ve accomplished. We could have sat here for hours and talked about every single song you’ve ever released, every single tour you’ve been on, every single thing you’ve accomplished. Like, there’s too much. And it’s so crazy, it’s still going and it’s still coming. And I’m just so happy for you. You’re such a beautiful, interesting, intelligent person. And I’m so happy I got to sit down with you.

I never know what to expect. This is why I love my job. I get to sit down and I think I know from researching, but you’re even more incredible than I could have ever imagined. And thank you for your time because I know you haven’t done a long-form interview in a really long time.

KESHA: Yeah. I don’t think I’ve done it since I got out of litigation. So thank you for making me feel safe.

ALEX COOPER: It was my absolute, absolute honor. Thank you.

KESHA: Well, creating a safe space allows us to be silly geese. And here we are. And that is the goal, honey.

ALEX COOPER: Kesha, thank you for coming on Call Her Daddy.

KESHA: Thanks for having me.

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