Transcript of Hunter Biden Interview on Tucker Carlson Show

And for me, I realized that the only way out was through— owning the things that were true and speaking truth to the things that were false. And I did that with Andrew, and I thought it would just be a one-off.

But then a guy named— well, you’re close with him, and I consider him a friend by text. I don’t want to sully his reputation. It’s Sean Ryan. And I sat down with Sean Ryan. Amazing man. Amazing man.

Connecting Across the Divide

HUNTER BIDEN: And Sean is kind of MAGA adjacent— he was between 2020 and 2024. And he had said some pretty rough things about my dad, not so much about me, but about my dad, that I vehemently disagreed with and to this day vehemently disagree with. But I thought that Sean was a great listener, and I really appreciated his willingness to not allow what he had been instructed to believe to infect the way in which he listened.

And I sat down with him and we did close to 6 hours. And these experiences in this long format can be very intimate.

TUCKER CARLSON: Oh, big time.

HUNTER BIDEN: And that was my experience with Sean. And we connected on the thing that I have been able to connect with almost everyone— universally— which is addiction. And recovery. And for me, thank God, it’s recovery.

I’ve been substance-free and sober for over 7 years now. And I don’t think people knew that. I think people conflated my past addiction with my father’s presidency and just assumed that I was still using because, I mean, the New York Post— I think they printed 1.5 articles about me a day for close to 4 years. And none of it good. And all of it with pictures.

TUCKER CARLSON: Not positive.

HUNTER BIDEN: No, not much of it was positive.

TUCKER CARLSON: No, not at all.

HUNTER BIDEN: Anyway, long story— the long story a lot longer is—

TUCKER CARLSON: I’m having that experience with the New York Post at the moment.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah, by the way, welcome to my world.

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, I’m not naked, but—

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah, hopefully naked pictures don’t come out. I could call some of our friends though.

TUCKER CARLSON: No one wants to see those.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. Well, I didn’t think so either, but apparently they do.

The Road to Candace Owens

HUNTER BIDEN: So anyway, long story short— long story longer. I did this with Sean, and Sean called— and this is public now, I can say it— Sean had dinner with Candace. They live in the same neighborhood down there in Nashville. And he said, “I really, really like her.” And she told my wife that one of the interviews she most wanted to do was with me, with Hunter Biden. I’m not referring to myself in the third person right now. I haven’t gotten to that point yet.

And I thought about it. And like you— and we’ve talked about this a little bit— Candace has said some really, really awful things, not just about me, but also about my dad, the whole “Biden crime family” thing— really, really pointed things.

And I believe that if I could sit down with her, not to convince her of anything, but to show that I was just as human as she was and that I own my failings— and I’ve been incredibly transparent about them— I thought that if we could find that commonality, we could have an actual conversation. And that’s what occurred.

And I don’t agree with Candace still on a lot of stuff. And I almost feel like, why do I have to make that caveat? Because I never used to have to make that caveat.

The Vitriol in Modern Politics

HUNTER BIDEN: Going all the way back to the beginning of our conversation— how did it change? I truly believe that the level of vitriol, meanness, and cruelty in our politics has always been there, but never like this. Never in a way in which it is practiced with impunity. And that to me— I mean, it’s interesting that you say your experience is that that kind of division started in 2008, but nothing like this, Tucker.

TUCKER CARLSON: Not even on partisan lines. I mean, the divisions are so intense. I always thought of divisions as racial or religious— you’re Protestant marrying a Catholic, or a Black person marrying a white person. I feel like the divisions now are ideological and political.

And this morning I texted Erika Kirk and Candace Owens, both within like an hour of each other— not related to each other— just because I really like them both and I’m not embarrassed of that. And that’s my right, by the way. I get to like people whether or not I’m fully aligned with their program. That’s my view. I’ve taken so much abuse for that. It’s insane. Like, “How could you be friends with 2 people who disagree with each other?” Well, I don’t know. I am.

HUNTER BIDEN: What world do we live in?

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, that’s kind of how I feel. Yeah, that’s strongly how I feel. First of all, I decide who I like. You don’t get to decide who I like.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: Don’t you feel that?

Social Media, Division, and the Oligarch Class

HUNTER BIDEN: I do. And I think that what it is, is it’s a reflection of this, is that who are you getting that from? You’re getting that from other people with niche audiences with big microphones in front of them. You’re getting that from the comments section that I know you don’t read. No. But other people in your organization read from you know, on X, you’re getting that.

I think we have literally been torn apart on purpose because— not because it was the— I don’t think that the people that created the social media platforms that rule our lives to this day thought, “This is what we’re going to do, we’re going to create something just to tear people apart.” What I think that they did was they created a monster in which they realize that it is fueled by division and vitriol and conflict and making you question yourself.

I mean, let me give you an example. Remember the whistleblower for Facebook when I think Facebook was still Facebook, it happened like in 2022. She was a senior executive at Facebook and she came up to the Hill. And this is a nonpartisan thing. And she came up to the Hill and she had all of that documentation of internal studies within Facebook that showed that there had been something like— and I forget the numbers, so don’t hold me to it— but an exponential increase in the number of teenage suicides among girls between the ages of 13 and 17 years old. Exponential. That began with the inception of Instagram.

And then not only an exponential increase in actual suicides among teenage girls, but an even greater increase. Like, if suicides went up triple, girls reporting self-harm went up by like 300% over the course of the inception of Instagram until you know, 2022 when this woman walks in with all the documents. And Instagram knew that and knew that it was literally directly related to their algorithm sending these messages to girls that they are not worth, that they need more, that they— whether it’s about their bodies or body shaming, and continuing to send it over to them knowing the negative impact that it’s having. But it’s because it made them money. It’s because you become addicted to that response and that Instagram would get with that bag of heroin in your pocket known as an iPhone.

And you know what they did? Nothing. They buried the report. They literally did nothing. I mean, nothing. So my question, and then what happened? This woman whistleblower comes forward, she brings all of the evidence that Facebook, Meta knows about this. And she said, “Now what do we do about it?” And you know what Congress did? Senate, House? No. You know what they did? Nothing. We have done absolutely nothing.

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, it’s just suicides of our people. I mean, not a big deal.

HUNTER BIDEN: But that’s what I’m trying to say.

TUCKER CARLSON: It’s bonkers.

HUNTER BIDEN: I couldn’t agree more. And as it relates to our politics, it’s the same thing. We are being fed the equivalent of a suicide pact by organizations and companies that are run by, by the way, literally a handful of very, very, very, not just generationally, but wealthy people to the degree that we haven’t seen since the robber barons at the turn of the 1900s and late 1800s. Those people, I’m not saying are evil, but what they have created is a tool. And a tool can be either— a hammer can build a home or it can tear down your house. And they build a tool and they make more money by tearing people down. They make more money by dividing people. They make more money. And so they just let the algorithm roll. And it’s tearing us apart.

And I’m not saying that’s the only problem. Not myopic enough to say that all of the issues that we have. But going back to Donald Trump, because for me, the one existential threat that I think that we face as a country is Donald Trump. I am not this believer that Trump is merely the symptom of a disease. I believe that Trump is central to why this disease has gone from a local epidemic to a pandemic in the United States of America.

Trump, War, and the Failure of Opposition

TUCKER CARLSON: It’s not a defense of Trump to ask then why on the big failures of the Trump administration, the real ones, the ones that history will record, like this war, there’s been no pushback from the other side at all. Yeah. So that tells you— I mean, you could say lots of things about Trump are bad, but getting us into a war we can’t win in which Americans are dying in Iran, that will only diminish America’s power and bankrupt us. I mean, that’s the only exit really.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: And make Iran stronger. And like, no, Chuck Schumer is like, “Yeah, it’s bad.” But of course he endorses— like, the whole leadership structure endorses that. So like, you can’t really say like they like Trump now.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah, I don’t know if they like Trump.

TUCKER CARLSON: Maybe it’s like he’s obnoxious or whatever, but he’s doing what they want.

HUNTER BIDEN: I think it’s a little bit of a— well, by the way, I don’t disagree that there is an enormous failure of what I call the elite oligarch Epstein class of Washington, D.C.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yes.

HUNTER BIDEN: That you and I both know very well. And that are as interested in protecting their corporate overlords as they are in protecting anything. And I mean, just take like the issue of stock trading.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

Congressional Stock Trading and the Biden Legacy

HUNTER BIDEN: My dad in 1972 took a vow that he would never own a stock or a bond. And he kept that vow since 1972 in over 50 years of public life. And he retired from the presidency as having probably the lowest net worth of anyone that had ever entered the presidency. And meanwhile, he got tagged with this idea that he is the Biden crime family and all of that crap. But my point being is this, is that how is it that we have not been able to pass a law?

TUCKER CARLSON: I couldn’t agree more.

HUNTER BIDEN: And I know you agree, but how is it possible? And it’s not just Republicans.

TUCKER CARLSON: Pass a law that prohibits members of Congress from trading. Yes, of course. Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: I mean, it’s the most common sense thing in the world and it should be in the administration too.

TUCKER CARLSON: I totally agree.

HUNTER BIDEN: It should be anybody with access to the most valuable insider information of all. And meanwhile, not only are we not passing the law, Donald Trump is selling $100,000 early access to his Truth Social tweets, which is just front-running for insider trading. Literally in the open.

And that’s what I mean, the quantitative, qualitative difference of Donald Trump as compared to anything I’ve ever experienced in politics before is the sense that the rule of law only applies as a weapon rather than as the prophylactic for the Constitution to be able to operate in a way in which the founders envisioned it.

Presidential Wealth and the Oligarch Problem

TUCKER CARLSON: There’s almost no arguing with your point. That’s true. Yeah, I would just say I think it’s been that way for a long time, and it’s just open now. It’s open. It’s just obvious if you’re selling Truth Social access.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah, man, but it’s like, come on. I saw this guy. There’s this incredible guy on TikTok, and he’s a professor, but he goes, it’s a Red Cup Garage. He’s like a— and he— have you ever seen this? Well, you don’t have any of this. He explains things by using red Solo cups.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: And he has this thing. Everybody go look at it. It’s all of the money that every president, and of the 45 that came before Donald Trump, made in the presidency. And it’s 4 blue Solo cups. And then all of the money that Donald Trump has openly said that he made in his financial report in the first 500 days of the presidency. And it is over $3 billion and it takes the entire wall.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah. And I mean, you can’t argue that. I mean, presidents shouldn’t make any money in office. Like, what is this?

HUNTER BIDEN: No. And by the way, this whole idea of a blind trust. And so that’s what I mean by the qualitative and the quantitative difference in the idea that there are still a group of people out there that voted for Donald Trump because they thought that they were going to be able to change things.

We talked about this a little bit before we came on, but my hero, and I know that you are too, as it relates to public life, people that is one of them with all of his faults, was Teddy Roosevelt. I agree. And Teddy Roosevelt—

TUCKER CARLSON: I signed a picture of him over there to my great-grandfather.

HUNTER BIDEN: I got something for you, by the way. But Teddy Roosevelt, by all accounts, came very close to abusing the power of the executive.

TUCKER CARLSON: Oh, you think? Yeah, you think. He certainly did.

HUNTER BIDEN: But he did it because he realized that in order for this experiment to be able to continue, you could not have an unfettered oligarch class that drained all of the wealth of a country and put it into their pockets while the other 99— Now, by the way, and people don’t understand this, I’m not talking 1%, I’m talking the 0.01%.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yes.

HUNTER BIDEN: There are only a little over 9,000 families in this country who are billionaires out of 350 million people. You know what the— this is shocking to me. You know what puts you in the top 1% of income earners in this country?

TUCKER CARLSON: No.

HUNTER BIDEN: Annual, $750,000.

TUCKER CARLSON: That’s the top 1%?

HUNTER BIDEN: 1%. So the people that I’m talking— I’m not talking about taxing or redistributing wealth among the top 1%. I’m not talking about it even in the top 0.5%, which would be like $10 million. I’m talking about the 0.01%, literally about a little under 10,000 individuals in this country that control and that have almost 40% of the entire wealth of a nation who decide—

TUCKER CARLSON: 9,000 families have 40% of the entire wealth?

HUNTER BIDEN: Somebody do the numbers for me. I probably screwed that up completely, but an inordinate amount of the entire considered wealth of this country.

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, you can’t have democracy under those circumstances.

On Trump, Leadership, and Accountability

HUNTER BIDEN: No, you can’t. And Teddy Roosevelt knew that. And what he did is he went out and he used the power of the executive to be able to go out and bust the trust and redistribute that wealth. He called it the Square Deal. And then he used the power of the executive to do things that every single one of us still benefits from today, which is, for instance, the National Park System.

Yes. The entire National Park System was the brainchild of one person as it related to one island, which was Audubon. And he came to Teddy Roosevelt and he said, hey, look, we’re losing this magnificent place, this island in the Gulf off the coast of Florida, because it’s a bird habitat that has, I don’t know, like half the species of wild birds.

And he comes to Teddy Roosevelt, and Teddy Roosevelt just goes out and he says, okay. And he turned it into the first national park, I think. And then he went out and he did that across the country. I mean, can you imagine doing that today? No. No.

But can you even imagine the people in — not the people — Donald Trump having a thought about using the power of the executive to benefit anyone but himself first? No. No. And that’s the thing.

TUCKER CARLSON: But I also look back on the last 25 years, 20 years anyway, and I can’t really think of many big executive initiatives that benefited the majority.

HUNTER BIDEN: No, neither do I. And that may be a question about the unitary executive, but no one has ever done it in a way in which they’re — where literally I believe that everything that he has done contains not just an underlying current of how does it benefit him personally, it is the first thought of everything that he does.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah, I think that’s true.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah.

Tucker’s Complicated History with Trump

TUCKER CARLSON: The problem I have with focusing on Trump, and I’m trying not to be defensive because obviously I campaigned for Trump and with Trump and spoke at the Republican National Convention and defended Trump for a decade on Fox News. So I’m definitely implicated in it, obviously. But it’s not just defensiveness. I think 2 things. One, focusing on Trump as the source of all evil in the world drives you crazy. Like, I saw that happen to my —

HUNTER BIDEN: I don’t believe that. I don’t believe that he’s the source of all evil.

TUCKER CARLSON: Right. But people who feel that way, literally, I had one of my closest friends went off the deep end. Yeah. Just like Trump. And all of a sudden Trump’s under the bed and it’s like, whoa, whoa, whoa. It’s monomania.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: But I also think it’s like he was under my bed. That is funny.

HUNTER BIDEN: You win. Along with some of his friends. That is so good.

TUCKER CARLSON: But second, it’s like exculpatory to the rest of us. It’s like, I don’t know, I watched a lot of crappy stuff happen in DC over the 35 years I lived there, and I didn’t even recognize it as crappy at the time. And we’re all kind of implicated in this. We’ve had a lot of bad leaders actually, or mediocre leaders.

I don’t know. We’ve had a flamboyantly corrupt leader like this and we haven’t ever. That’s true. We’ve had a lot of low-grade kind of like, “what’s in it for me” leadership? And we tolerated it and we celebrated things that were not impressive at all and pretended they were impressive and, “ooh, so brave” and all this. It was all crap actually. We’re kind of — this is the end of like a long cycle of mediocrity. That’s all I’m saying.

Owning Up to Mistakes

HUNTER BIDEN: Okay, so I’ve owned up. Okay. For instance, I’m absolutely certain that my engagement in Washington, D.C., when I took on Burisma when my dad was vice president as a client at the end of the year, it was a stupid thing to do. Yeah. Because I wasn’t fully aware of what a swamp it was and the narrative that would be able to be spun. It was a horrible idea. Now, I had my reasons, okay? But they’re not good enough. I own that.

I own the idea that I do believe that there is this revolving door in Washington, DC that needs to be shut, in which people come in and out of administrations. We know them all.

TUCKER CARLSON: They’re trading on access.

HUNTER BIDEN: And they’re not bad people that are trading on access. I did not trade on access. You can look through 22 years of my — but I know this. I know that I received incredible privileges that no one else in the world, including to the point of my pardon. No, literally, there’s no one else in the world that was in my position that their father happened to have the authority and the power to do it. And I realize how privileged I am.

But I think that there needs to be a reckoning with, if I’m willing to do that, I think that you — and I saw the — I like Thomas Massie. I like where Marjorie Taylor Greene is going. I like that there are people that have kind of woken up to the — but a lot of the reason that we’re here is because of Fox News. A lot of it has to do —

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, we’re in a war right now because of that. We’re losing because of Fox News. I couldn’t agree more.

HUNTER BIDEN: And so I just think that — I don’t think that every problem this country faces is because of Donald Trump. I don’t think that he is the source of all evil. I don’t even remotely believe that. I do believe this though. We are at an inflection point in this country, whether it’s because of the technology as it relates to AI and as it relates to our debt and the fact that Donald Trump is responsible for what, 20% of the entire debt of the entire nation over the course of the, you know, since its inception?

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah, it’s bonkers.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah, bonkers.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: And we are in desperate, desperate need of leadership.

TUCKER CARLSON: I agree.

HUNTER BIDEN: And so I want to reach across to everybody and say, look, let’s figure out the things that we can agree on instead of pointing constantly. And one of the things that I think that we can agree on is that we have the exact wrong leadership at the exact wrong time.

Tucker’s Path Back to Trump Support

TUCKER CARLSON: So I think you’re kind of making my point, which is that finger-pointing is unhelpful except when we point fingers at ourselves. That is very helpful. Very helpful. Very important to say. That’s kind of what I was inarticulately trying to express to you, which is like, it gets the rest of us off the hook to point to one guy and be like, “it’s all his fault.” It’s like, actually, it’s all of our fault, including mine.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: And I, you know, famously advocated for the Iraq War and thought that was the last stupid thing I was ever going to do. It turns out it wasn’t. I advocated for all kinds of things that I now regret advocating for, particularly the things that you said about me. Deep regret. No, I do, actually. I mean, I regret in the sense that as someone who has dealt with addiction, not quite in as exciting a way as you did, but I’ve been there for sure. Extend grace to people who are out of their minds. You would think I would do that. I should have done that more. So I do regret that.

But no, what I’m saying is you look back and I really thought that I could influence Trump into not going into this war.

HUNTER BIDEN: I think that that’s a really interesting point.

TUCKER CARLSON: No, I mean, that’s the core of it right there.

HUNTER BIDEN: Because you said the things that you said about Trump, after 2020, which are famously out there.

TUCKER CARLSON: Oh, when I got pissed in a text with a producer and then Fox was using that text and all that. The New York Times.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. Wonderful organization you work for.

TUCKER CARLSON: Really ridiculous.

HUNTER BIDEN: And talk about how you came around in 2024, not as it relates to, like, a knee-jerk reaction to being opposed to Democrats. But why?

TUCKER CARLSON: Oh, no, it was a very specific trajectory. This is such an impossible rich guy thing to say, but it’s just a fact. I was in Europe with my kids on the Med, August of 2023, I think, and Mar-a-Lago got raided. And that was ridiculous. On a documents charge? Really? And I’m from the city, so I know a lot about the documents stuff. And it was like, transparently absurd. They’re literally sending armed FBI agents into his bathroom. Like, no.

And so to me, what that said was Trump is actually being persecuted by the uniparty. Therefore, he is its sincere opponent. And my overriding feeling, since I wrote a whole book on this 10 years ago, is that the problem in Washington is that on the big questions of the economy and foreign policy, both parties agree. It’s the agreement that is the threat, not the disagreement.

So I thought that, and I thought, well, Trump is clear. They’re trying to put him in jail on these nonsense charges. And they were nonsense. “Well, they’re nuclear secrets.” That’s not true. And I was like, so he clearly is their opponent. So I thought, and this is my sin, I can have an effect.

And my goal, literally from that moment up until February 28th, was I don’t want to go to war with Iran because I really saw that as the end of a lot of stuff, of the postwar order, which is kind of ridiculous, but compared to what? I’m kind of against the postwar order. On the other hand, I’m not sure what follows will be better.

So I was really focused on this Iran thing, and I knew that both parties were for it. Schumer’s totally for it. Lindsey Graham’s totally for it. They’re all colluding against America to start this regime change war with Iran. And I was like, I’m going to single-mindedly focus on it. That’s all I’m going to do with my life — and I knew a lot of people in the Middle East, and I thought, oh, man, I can do this.

And I realized on February 28th, first of all, I had zero power, okay? But it was mostly vanity. I was like, “I have a mission, I can do this.” And it was — it was — I overstated my own influence, like, dramatically in a very embarrassing way, and my own importance. And like, I thought I could do things that, like, I had no control over any of this stuff. And I was humiliated correctly. I was humiliated in front of my wife. I was like, “you’re doing a good thing.” And so yeah, I was mad at Trump, but I was also really mad at myself. And so that’s the story. And I’ve — I actually am really grateful I went through that.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: Because it puts your own power in context. You think like you’ve got all this, you know, whatever, SWAT, and you have zero. Yeah.

What Comes Next

HUNTER BIDEN: So what next?

TUCKER CARLSON: I have no idea, but I —

HUNTER BIDEN: No, I mean, really, what for me? Yeah, not just for you, but what next for all of us? Like, I’ve been out talking to people and completely different audiences, you know, across the board. And the most significant reason of why I’ve decided to go out and talk is that what I realize is that my experience is not only not unique, it’s almost universal. Now, to the degree that my experience, my addiction overwhelmed me, is sometimes often exaggerated by virtue of how much attention has been paid to it. You know, there’s 2 years of my life —

TUCKER CARLSON: So people noticed?

The Laptop Story

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah, some people noticed. Oh yeah, exactly. God, it was awful. I mean, notice to the degree that my wife and I were living in the hills in LA, and we had this little place, and I— it was just early in my recovery, and Trump from the Oval Office invited in these right-wing influencers, these MAGA influencers online. And this is back in 2019. And he started the “Where’s Hunter” thing.

And the next day, the New York Post printed an aerial photograph of the house that I live in, where you could stand on the street below to be able to look through the floor-to-ceiling windows. And a group of men, with bullhorns and MAGA hats showed up at the door, banging on the door with my then pregnant wife who was home alone, who literally fled the house. They chased her in a car and literally ran her off the road.

And that was my experience for like a 2-year period of time until my dad was elected. And then we got Secret Service and we’d left that house because we, in the middle of the night. And the next house we went to, they found us in this— a documentary filmmaker ended up being like a— he wrote a whole scripted film. He parked a billboard truck.

TUCKER CARLSON: Where?

HUNTER BIDEN: In LA? Yeah, in LA, in Venice. I was right on South Venice Boulevard. He parked one of those digital billboard trucks in front of my house that ran all of the nude pictures of me smoking crack. Actually, for a week straight. And then sat on the canal with bullhorns in a canoe and just shouted at my house over and over again for a week. Then we had to leave that house.

TUCKER CARLSON: Did you know him?

HUNTER BIDEN: No, no. God, no. Some crazy guy. I mean, he was not crazy. He then went on to make a whole movie about me. But anyway, my point—

TUCKER CARLSON: Did you see it?

HUNTER BIDEN: No, I didn’t. I did not see it. Do not go see that movie.

TUCKER CARLSON: I didn’t know it existed.

The Gift of Transparency

HUNTER BIDEN: But then, yeah, my point is that I have the total exposure that I’ve had has given me this incredible gift. And number one is that, by the— that transparency is that I don’t have any more secrets. And the secrets that I felt ashamed of, like just the word crack— it’s so heavy. It shocks people, all of the associations that people make out of, particularly of our generation. Yes.

And to be able to speak about it openly— what I’ve found is this deep connection with people. There’s no wall between me and them anymore. And because they know all of my flaws, the ones that you would never want to show anyone, and they know I’m willing to talk about them. And in that, they’re able to come up to me and say— I mean, everywhere I go, when I got off the plane in the airport, someone came up to me. Told me about their experience in recovery. Thanks for what I’m doing. They got their brother just got arrested, is in jail. You know, you gotta do something about the fentanyl deaths here. It’s everybody.

And it’s been an incredibly beautiful, beautiful experience. And I say to everybody is that I’ll talk about the politics, but it’s really the bait to be able to talk about the thing that connects us. And so all the way back, sitting down with Candace, is that the thing that Candace and I were able to connect on in a very human way was her own experience, not personally, but with her family and addiction and the people that she loved. And I don’t know anyone that hasn’t been impacted by it.

TUCKER CARLSON: That’s for sure.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. And well, I guess what my point is, is that by starting there, for me, I feel like our connection as it relates to it— I’ve known you’ve been sober for well over 20 years now.

TUCKER CARLSON: 24 years this month.

HUNTER BIDEN: 24 years this month. And so your capacity to be able to understand it at that level and also at a family level— oh yeah, it makes it a lot easier to see the Hunter that you thought that you knew. And I think— and by the way, I’m not putting words into your mouth.

TUCKER CARLSON: No, I think that’s 100% true.

HUNTER BIDEN: But the thing for me is that with you, I— the transformation— not transformation because it’s not a transformation. Anybody that knows you realizes it’s not a transformation. Is out on your own now and not understandably, like anybody that has a job, being beholden to corporate structure.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: Fox News is that I feel as if that combined with the incredible ultimate betrayal. And what I mean by betrayal of the promise, the singular promise that was important to you as it related to Trump.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yes.

HUNTER BIDEN: That we would not get into the potential of ending up in a war, a World War III or another incredibly devastating, protracted war in that region that would expand clearly. With the entire global oil supply in jeopardy.

TUCKER CARLSON: It’s so crazy. I cannot even believe it happened.

HUNTER BIDEN: Is that it has given an opening for us to be able to have a conversation that is more constructive about a way forward. That’s my feeling.

TUCKER CARLSON: I strongly agree with that.

The Laptop: Setting the Record Straight

And always— I mean, I’ve certainly talked about you and all the drama that you went through a lot. I have really only one question, one thing that has bothered me for years now. Yeah, 8 years or whatever, 6 years, whatever it’s been. And so I just want to ask you directly about it.

So the laptop comes out or doesn’t come out. I hear that it’s in circulation. I get calls from people in that kind of shadowy way that you’re familiar with.

HUNTER BIDEN: Way before, right?

TUCKER CARLSON: I can’t remember. Anyway, so much drama has happened. But if you’re in the news business or politics, people call you, there’s this thing, you hear everything all the time, and how much is true, you don’t know. I heard about the laptop. And then I heard, you know, you don’t know if it’s real. And then I heard somebody calls me, goes, “You’re on the laptop.” And because you had written a letter of recommendation for college for my son.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: Who didn’t end up going to the school or even getting in, but whatever. It didn’t help, it turns out.

HUNTER BIDEN: Thanks.

TUCKER CARLSON: But anyway, I knew that it was real because who would know that we knew each other?

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: Right. No one could fake that. And that our wives were friends and all this stuff. But it’s Washington. You know everybody there. So then I hear this story about how— then the official story comes out about how the laptop was left. You left a couple of laptops in a laptop repair store in Greenville, Delaware, which is a town I’m very familiar with. And the guy was blind. Then I interviewed the guy who seemed to totally believe the story, John McIsaac. I mean, he seemed to be telling the truth. But the story did not make sense.

Meanwhile, we get approached by Israelis connected to Benjamin Netanyahu. Like, I know that.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: Who are shopping this stuff to me at Fox News.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: And I’m like, I don’t think that that part of the story— the laptop is real. I thought that from day one. But the way that it entered the bloodstream of the American media was not real. So I just want to ask you point blank, did you drop off laptops?

HUNTER BIDEN: No. And this is the thing that I’ve said over and over again. I have literally zero recollection or memory of ever dropping off a laptop at John Paul McIsaac’s. No, the answer is no. And John Paul McIsaac—

TUCKER CARLSON: Wild.

HUNTER BIDEN: So John Paul McIsaac, who’s legally blind, yes, who on the day when the laptop became public sat outside of his shop and gave an interview and flat out says that he doesn’t remember seeing me. He couldn’t identify me. And also that his security cameras that he has don’t have any footage from that time.

And so regardless though, regardless of anything, just this: the laptop, according to Lev Parnas under oath in his testimony before the House Oversight Committee, was being sought by Rudy Giuliani in Ukraine all the way back in 2018. And so Rudy Giuliani is working with a guy named Andriy Derkach, who was an MP in Ukraine and a known Russian GRU agent. So Rudy goes over there and basically takes his dossier and receives information that Hunter Biden’s hard drive, not laptop, is for sale, and the person that they can go to is this other Ukrainian-Russian oligarch who is living in Austria. That’s what Lev Parnas and Igor Fruman were doing getting on the plane before they were arrested.

TUCKER CARLSON: So how did—

HUNTER BIDEN: Before John Paul McIsaac was ever a twinkle in anybody’s eye.

TUCKER CARLSON: I believe that the story— that was always the weak part of the story. Like, yeah. He drops off laptops.

HUNTER BIDEN: Even John Paul McIsaac, okay, from— there is no such thing as a laptop. The laptop that he turned— eventually turns over a year later, 18 months later, to the FBI. The thing that is distributed and disseminated that John Paul McIsaac claims that he got off of a device was a hard drive. And that hard drive had a limited amount of information. A limited amount of gigabytes. I don’t know the difference between a gigabyte and whatever.

And that goes into the hands— he somehow can’t find anybody. You can’t throw a stone in Trolley Square without hitting someone that knows me personally. And he knows that. He’s lived there his whole life. Instead, what he finds through this guy Applebaum is Rudy Giuliani’s lawyer, Bob Costello. He turns over this hard drive. The hard drive becomes the platform from which all of the other stolen information— from which, by the way, every single forensic expert has made it clear— is that there’s no possible way all of the information that was eventually labeled as my laptop came from one laptop. It’s way too large.

TUCKER CARLSON: Came off the cloud.

HUNTER BIDEN: Exactly. They hacked my cloud. I read about this in this book. So on Substack, I’m laying all of this out, and there’s a whole— the NDI, the whole thing about there’s these different silos. There’s the Netanyahu side, the Israeli side. There is a Russian-Ukrainian side of it. And then there are the US actors that include Steve Bannon, Rudy Giuliani, Miles Guo, and a whole bunch of— Lev Parnas and Igor Fruman and all of these guys.

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, once the material starts circulating, the data from the cloud, you know, all kinds of people get involved and they’re shopping it for different reasons. And I agree.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yes. And so it— but my point is, who stole it? Well, from the cloud.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: Well, I don’t know. You have as good a guess as mine in terms of actually who had— who was the original hacker of that information, who has the capacity to be able to do it. And so, you know, I have my—

TUCKER CARLSON: You don’t have evidence.

The Laptop and Its Contents

HUNTER BIDEN: I don’t have a digital forensic evidence that it was hacked by this person or this entity or this organization, that it was Mossad or that it was the GRU or that it was some kid in his basement that figured it out. But here’s the point overall. Here’s the thing is I get caught in these conversations about all of this, but the reality is this: Of what was distributed that was authentic, it’s all mine. All those emails.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah, yeah, I got it.

HUNTER BIDEN: And you know what? Not a single one of them proves any criminality of my father whatsoever, of any way in which I ever sent an email saying, “Hey Dad, I need you to get this done on behalf of a client of mine.” Now I think that’s dispositive, and I challenge anybody because it’s all out there. The entire digital footprint. And I’m not just talking about my emails. I’m talking about 20 years of emails. I’m talking about 20 years of text messages. I’m talking about erased voicemails, deleted voicemails, deleted photographs.

TUCKER CARLSON: They don’t actually delete, is what you’re saying.

HUNTER BIDEN: They clearly don’t. Voicemails from my dad to me. But that’s not the only voicemail that was out there. But not a single one of them in which I say, “Hey, when my dad is in office or in power as vice president or president, I need you to do this for me,” or even contacting one of his staffers.

So either I’m incredibly, incredibly, incredibly good at inactive addiction as a crack addict, or it doesn’t exist. It truly, literally doesn’t exist. The entire narrative of the Biden crime family — I mean, I literally, unlike anybody else, say to everybody, “Okay, show me your phone because I showed you mine and you didn’t find a goddamn thing. Not one thing.”

Every investigative body in the United States of America has investigated me for over 10 years at that point. And not one single thing of criminal activity other than use of drugs and all of the things that are associated with addiction is proved by the laptop.

Finding Out About the Laptop

TUCKER CARLSON: When did you find out that the contents of your digital life were in circulation?

HUNTER BIDEN: That day that the New York Post released it.

TUCKER CARLSON: You had no idea?

HUNTER BIDEN: No idea. None.

TUCKER CARLSON: What were you doing that day? How’d you find out?

HUNTER BIDEN: It was like 2 weeks before the election, right? October.

TUCKER CARLSON: So up until that day, you had no clue because the FBI had the material?

HUNTER BIDEN: None. No, no clue. Zero. Zero.

TUCKER CARLSON: I’m sorry, I stepped on your answers. What were you doing that day when you found out?

HUNTER BIDEN: I was with Melissa, and Beau was about 6 months old. A friend of ours — we were in LA — said, “Hey, come out to Palm Springs. I got an Airbnb on a golf course there and it’s really cool. You guys have never been out there.”

And it’s like, we’re in the home stretch now. I had survived — because even before the laptop, remember, they were beating the sh out of me. That’s when Donald Trump was doing the “Where’s Hunter” thing. I didn’t have any security like I don’t have today, but I didn’t have then. It was just me and Melissa and a baby. And anytime we went outside the house, people would follow us everywhere. And not just to follow us, but to harass us. Because Donald Trump was going to his rallies and his big line was — and they were selling shirts — “Where’s Hunter?” So everybody felt it was incumbent upon them if they supported Trump and MAGA to find Hunter.

So we drive out to Palm Springs, and we get there and we unpack, put my bag into my room. There’s a little plunge pool out at the back of this little house. And I get a call — it’s a friend of mine who was also my lawyer at the time — and he said, “Some guy — the New York Post — saying somebody has your laptop.”

And it took me years to piece it all together. One of the things that I’ve done over the course of the last 7 years, other than paint — which became literally the thing that saved my life. I’ve always painted, but it was literally the thing that saved my life. It just allowed me to focus and occupy my hands in a productive way in which I felt that I was creating, and also allowed me to get out of myself and not be consumed by the shame of my addiction and all the failings that I perceived in myself at that moment in time, which, in early addiction — and not just through your own experience, but through the experience of watching others — is a really tenuous time.

I’ve done a lot of writing, and it took me a long time to figure this out. What happened? How did this — who was involved? And there’s all of these names, and there’s a list of 20 Russian names and all of this stuff. So I decided on Substack what I could do is basically do the first draft of that and get the audience potentially to participate and give me more information. So I’m doing that on Substack now.

The thing about it is this: it was a complete and utter surprise to me. I was a little over a year into my recovery. I kind of made it through what I thought was the worst of it. And then we were just literally thrown in the middle of it.

The Nude Photos and the Suppression Narrative

And the worst thing that happened was, because there were nude pictures — and this is the only reason that Twitter took them down and Facebook took them down — they violated their own internal rules as it relates to revenge porn. You’re not allowed to publish nude photographs of anyone without their consent, no matter what, for whatever reason.

So that’s why, on the front page of the New York Post and the story associated on the digital with all of the links, were a ton of nude photos of me, with the women in them just barely blurred out — all consensual, legal, all those things, which of course they don’t make that point.

And that’s why they took it down. But then that became the story — the suppression and this idea that 40 former intelligence officers said it had all the hallmarks of a Russian disinformation campaign. No one in that 40, regardless of what you think of them — not much, yeah, I know you don’t — but no one in that 40 ever said that the laptop wasn’t real. But that’s what everybody on the right decided to say.

TUCKER CARLSON: First of all, the intel people are the most dishonest people in our society.

HUNTER BIDEN: By the way, I’m not going to argue on behalf of anybody. All I know is — let’s just stick to me.

TUCKER CARLSON: No, but I’m just saying, the point of that statement was to suggest that the contents were not real.

HUNTER BIDEN: Well, you may think that, but it definitely did not say that. And all I know is this: it became completely out of my control. So therefore, now I was not arguing about what was on it.

Rudy Giuliani’s Claims

Remember what Rudy Giuliani did? He went to literally the courthouse steps in New Castle County with Bernie Kerik, and he held a laptop — which there’s no existing laptop. He had taken a hard drive or a thumb drive and pretended like there was a laptop. The one thing he said was, “This contains images of minor children,” which — bullsh. An absolute, complete, and utter effing lie. And that’s what he did.

Because you know what it didn’t have on it? It had no evidence. And they had it for over a year at this point. It had no evidence of anything other than I was a drug user — not only a drug user, but a crack addict.

And the problem was, I had gone about 9 months before and done an interview with The New Yorker and admitted everything as it relates to my addiction. It was probably one of the smartest decisions I made — not in conjunction with anybody, but literally me and Melissa sitting there. And I said, “I’m going to tell this guy everything. I have to get it off my chest. I can’t have this hanging out there as my dad moves through a presidential campaign. And let the chips fall where they may.”

And it totally scooped them. So what they had to do is create another narrative around it that is evidence of corruption. So when anybody says “Hunter Biden,” what’s your first thought? Laptop.

The Israeli Connection

TUCKER CARLSON: Can I just say one thing though? This is what I experienced during that time. The allegation that there was abuse of minors on the laptop — that came from the Israelis. I’m just telling you that. They came to me with that, so I know that. And one of the things that enraged me about the statement from those sleazy intel guys is that they blamed the Russians for it. Now, maybe the Russians had a hand in it, but it was the Israelis who were pushing that. Fact. Literally to me.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. And you’ve gone through it, but I just want to be clear — not a single thing in any of it is in any way true about that.

TUCKER CARLSON: Well, that’s such a serious crime that I think it’s just common sense that if there was evidence of that —

HUNTER BIDEN: You think that is common sense? But I’ll tell you what, about 40 million people on X don’t think that.

TUCKER CARLSON: If there was evidence of abuse of minors in there —

HUNTER BIDEN: You know how many people call me a pedophile? To this day. Anyway, I’ll spare you, but I agree with you. That’s exactly right.

TUCKER CARLSON: But they were pushing that so hard, and all the intel guys are like, “Oh, it’s Russia.” It’s like, you lie. You lie. Because they called me. I sent one of my producers out to go meet with one guy connected to Netanyahu. They were behind that. And I felt that everybody in DC knew that. But there was so much pressure never to criticize Israel in any way that they were just like, “It’s the Russians, it’s the Russians, they’re the ones penetrating our political system.” It’s like, you lie. Everyone knows what’s actually happening.

That was my perspective and it drove me insane. And by the way, I didn’t say that on Fox News. I’ll admit it. I didn’t. I was part of the problem also, but I knew it.

HUNTER BIDEN: But that’s the thing, Tucker. I agree. So we’re here now.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: And that’s one of the reasons why, just on a purely selfish basis for me — I don’t know how you could possibly have thought that of me. And by not saying it, I thought that you thought that of me. It’s like I am —

TUCKER CARLSON: It is about that — the child molestation thing or whatever.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. All the stuff that they were saying, or any of it.

TUCKER CARLSON: People addicted to drugs, especially cocaine, I know for a fact get pretty dark. That’s just a fact. They do, they definitely do.

HUNTER BIDEN: And it—

TUCKER CARLSON: Oh yeah, and the cocaine thing, by the way, it’s all there. You can watch it all. I guess I don’t need to tell you that.

HUNTER BIDEN: You can see them.

TUCKER CARLSON: You’re not the only person I’ve seen this.

HUNTER BIDEN: Exactly. But there’s a big difference. Yeah, there’s a big difference between that and the reality of what’s out there, which is the worst thing that you could possibly say about any—

TUCKER CARLSON: And that’s my point.

HUNTER BIDEN: My point is that I thought I was over it. I was in Palm Springs. I was there for about 3 hours. It was the first time that Melissa and I had gone away because remember, we’re still in that kind of COVID period. And so we’re out there and I get this call and it’s just like your whole world kind of— like a void opens up and you just think that you’re about to get sucked into it. Because what’s the worst thing that you could ever say about someone, in my opinion, is that— and that’s what Rudy Giuliani was saying.

Staying Sober Through the Storm

TUCKER CARLSON: Were you ever close to going back on drugs during this period?

HUNTER BIDEN: No, no. And because I knew this — I don’t want to give people the impression that it’s not available to them — but it was a miracle. The miracle of my life at that moment, despite all of these consequences, like just landing like nuclear bombs in my life, is that I was in a better place and continue to be in a better place than I’ve ever been in my life.

As I would think, I’ve been stripped to the bone. There’s nothing— there was no facade. Like, you have to— the entirety of my ego was destroyed. Like, all of those things that you protect out of fear— well, you don’t realize that they’re out of fear. But almost all of them are out of fear. It’s like what you’re talking about, the vanity.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: Of believing that you could change the course of this administration, of history, of being there, and that you could overlook all of the things that you know of him in order to save the world. Like, that’s a beautiful thing to hear someone admit, to be that introspective, to be able to do that.

In the same way, I was so emasculated that I had to make a decision to live or die. And in the living, I had to live in that emasculation, that completely stripping of ego. And it wasn’t instant, and it wasn’t like I woke up the next morning and didn’t think the sun would ever come up, which I kind of felt.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: But then Bowie woke up, and it was a little 9-month-old or 6-month-old at the time. And I look at this amazingly magnificent woman that has saved me, that is lying there, and I thought, you know what, I have to choose to live. Like, I want this life. I want this love. I don’t want to be afraid. I’m going to choose to live. And then it just became a matter of moment by moment having to make that choice at the beginning.

Meeting Melissa: A Love Story

TUCKER CARLSON: Your wife and getting sober.

HUNTER BIDEN: I know, it’s the craziest story. And I wrote about it, and like I said, if any of my children came to me and told me this story, I would probably have them committed. But it was truly love at first sight.

A long story that I’ve written about, but I was in active addiction and staying at a hotel. The Petit Ermitage in West Hollywood at the time. It was a neat hotel. Yeah. And I was at the pool — on the roof, on the roof. And these 2 people sat down next to me where I was alone. I was reading a book, and they struck up a conversation as the pool kind of filled up during the day.

At one point they turned to each other — no, I never met them before — and said, “You have to meet our friend Melissa.” And I said, “Sure, sure.” And I had no intention of meeting anyone. I’d gone to LA basically to choose the coward’s way out — suicide — which was, I knew that the drugs and drinking would eventually take me. And I had broken all contact with anyone that cared for me or loved me. They called every day and I just didn’t answer.

And I’m sitting there and it was an incredibly, incredibly dark moment in my life — the darkest. And for some reason I did this thing. I said, “Yeah, just give me your number, I’ll call.” Because they insisted, they insisted, they insisted that I call this woman. And I said, “I can remember any number. If you tell me a number, I can remember it.” And of course, I can’t remember a number. But it was my way of getting out of the situation.

And I had left my book there. So like 2 hours later, I came back to pick up my book on the chaise lounge that I left it at. And the woman said, “What’s the number?” And she said, “I knew you were lying.” And she had a pen in her hand and she wrote it on my hand.

And that night I was taking a shower — I couldn’t, the difference between 9 o’clock at night and 2:30 in the morning, I mean, I literally was staying up 10 days at a time. I mean, it was awful. And I’m about to wash this off my hand. I thought, I think I should probably really call this woman. So I texted that number and I said, “Hey, your friends gave me your number, would you like to get a drink?” And at 2:30 in the morning, the response I got back was, I’m paraphrasing, but it was like, “Who the f* is this and it’s 2:30 in the morning? No.”

And for some reason, in the morning, I felt like that was really rude to do to a woman. Like, it’s not just funny, like you made a mistake — that was really rude. And I don’t know where it came from in me, the feeling that I needed to apologize and say, “I would like to buy lunch. I didn’t realize the time.” And she had no idea who I was. None. Except her friends had met this guy at a pool. And so she says that they said, “You really need to go meet him.” And she said she’d be over for lunch.

And then it was 1 o’clock, and then it was 2 o’clock, and then she’d be there in half an hour. And then it was 4 o’clock, and then it was 6. And finally— you know anything about this one?

TUCKER CARLSON: Did you—

HUNTER BIDEN: Nothing. Literally nothing.

TUCKER CARLSON: Just her first name?

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. And that’s it. Nothing. Not a picture, not anything. And I walk up — now I’m over at the Sunset Marquis, which is up the hill, because every hotel I would stay at, I wouldn’t do anything wrong. It was just like the cast of characters that would be in and out of my room. They decided that in the morning, “Mr. Biden, we don’t have availability.”

Hotel looks empty to me. Yeah, well, and so I had moved over to this other hotel. This is when I still had a little bit of money to be able to pay hotel bills, and I wasn’t in the Super 8. But I walk up and there’s this outdoor seating area, and I see this woman, and she was wearing a denim shirt just like this. And I walk up to the table and I know this sounds melodramatic and like I’m making it up, but I looked in her eyes and I saw eyes that saw me. And I said, “I know that this sounds crazy, but I’m in love with you.”

TUCKER CARLSON: That’s the first thing you said to a woman you’d never met before?

HUNTER BIDEN: The first thing. And again, I know it sounds crazy.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: And the craziest part is, the miracle of it is, that she didn’t run. She saw through me. I mean, she saw it not through me, she saw me. And within 3 hours, I had told her everything that I had not told the people that tried to love me back into existence for the previous 2 years.

She literally was— I said, “I’m addicted to crack cocaine. I’m killing myself.” She said, “That ends today.” And it didn’t end that day. The crack ended within a week, and then the alcohol ended within about 20 days of tapering. In June, I count June 1st as my sobriety date. And from that moment I said that to her, we were married 10 days later.

TUCKER CARLSON: That’s one of the craziest stories I’ve ever heard in my life.

Redemption, Family, and Faith

HUNTER BIDEN: And it remains a miracle. My daughters — there’s nothing that I love more in the world than them. And I always say the greatest sin of my addiction was my absence from my children.

As my dad always taught me, being available is everything. And during a time in their life when they loved their Uncle Beau — they loved their Uncle Beau as much as I loved them. He was like a second father to them. And after Beau died, they then lost me for a period of time. And there’s enormous trauma in that.

And my point about talking about the girls is that my father, my family, my sister, my uncle, my aunt, my Aunt Valerie, my mom — they all tried to save me. I have the most incredible family in the world, but it took a stranger to see the love left in me.

And I don’t know why, but to me — and I love to think of it this way — it was a miracle, that there was something divine about it. And I’m a firm believer in that faith that sometimes the things that we cannot explain are God acting in our life in a way in which it tried to get to us in every other way possible. And then finally they have to smack you over the head with a hammer.

TUCKER CARLSON: I believe that so strongly. That is true.

HUNTER BIDEN: That’s a fact. And for me, that is the truth about all of this — that I think I’ve been given a gift, and the gift of my addiction brought me to that point where it could totally break me. Not for me to go out and aggrandize myself in a way in which I tell a different story than what actually happened, but to tell the actual story.

That’s why I hate talking about the laptop or this or defending myself. But the story that I get to tell is that there is such a thing as redemption. And that’s not the outward redemption. This is the inward — that you can find the person that is worthy of love in yourself.

All of the mistakes that I made in my life — and I don’t mean the narrative that has been out there, but the mistakes that I’ve made in my life in terms of relationships — have all been based in fear. Fear of not being enough. Fear of not living up to some expectation. Fear of being found out. Fear of being embarrassed. Everything from something as trivial as fear of asking the girl to dance.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

Finding Common Ground and Moving Forward

HUNTER BIDEN: You know, and I drank over that and I used over that. Or fear of having to come to terms with the trauma of losing my mother and my sister, or facing it in any way, or fear of being found out that I’m not really as good as I think that I am, that I am that person that people want to view as the privileged failed son that’s never done anything with his life.

And all of that fear has evaporated. I’m not without fear, I still am, but in a very different way. And there’s no way that I could have gotten here without having gone through that. And that’s the promise of at least not picking up a drink or a drug today. Is that maybe I can get there.

I was saying to somebody, I was talking before, I don’t think that there’s anything that has more guidance in my life than the Serenity Prayer. Is being able to really truly understand the things that you can change as compared to the things that you have no control over. And that’s not about feeling powerless. But for instance, what it made me think of is what you just said.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah, I know. I agree completely.

HUNTER BIDEN: And you, you have to—

TUCKER CARLSON: —vanity to think that you can change certain— like you’re in charge of the world now, you’re God. I mean, no, you’re not.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. And there’s that incredible— and I don’t know if it’s apocryphal or if it’s true— that quote from Mother Teresa in which she says, “If you want to change the world, go home and love your family.”

TUCKER CARLSON: Exactly.

HUNTER BIDEN: And in loving my family, what I also realize is my family is much larger than my immediate blood. And beyond just my first circle of friends, my family is a group of people that are still sick and suffering, that are literally a step out that door, that feel that there is no hope and no way out for them and that they are caught in a cycle of degradation and demoralization and violence because of the drug or the alcohol, which is the worst, in my opinion, worst drug that there is.

But it starts in the immediate, and then hopefully it radiates out if it’s done with sincerity and authenticity. And you’re not living a double life, for whatever reason. You’re not working on behalf of a corporate shill. I’m not pursuing a goal of which— I mean, I was a consultant in Washington, D.C., and— it was all bullshit. It was all bullshit. What was I adding to the conversation? What was I adding to the discourse? What purpose was any of that at the time?

I’m not doing that anymore, and that’s why I’m an artist, and that’s why I write. And that’s why I’m speaking out. And that’s why I work with an organization called Peak Path Health, which is a great rehab in LA, but I’m helping set up a foundation for them for aftercare. I work with an organization called Basta Universal, which does homeless prevention and tenants’ rights advocacy in LA. And that’s not to say, “Oh, I’m such a good guy.” I mean, because I get paid and I enjoy the work. And I think that they’re really good people.

And I write a Substack because I hope to get paid. I hope people go read it so that I can make a living. I really believe in cryptocurrency. I really believe in those things. I want to do something in that space. And not because of any other thing than I believe in it, but you know what? I also want to make some money.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: And that’s my life now. I get to say that and say, but this is me. I’m not running for anything. You gave me a platform, I’m going to use it. And not only am I going to use it to benefit myself and my family, but hopefully benefit people along the way.

And I would ask the same of you, which I think right now— and not like, who am I to ask— is that I think that we have such an opportunity to find common ground, to do this a different way. You are, if not the most— in my estimation, the most talented communicator of your generation. And whatever anybody has to say about you, there is no doubt that you are an incredibly effective communicator, as is Candace, by the way.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yes.

HUNTER BIDEN: And I think that you have an opportunity to— and this isn’t like, you know, train all ammunition on the administration. I’m saying the opportunity to find that common purpose.

TUCKER CARLSON: You wonder if it’s possible without the vanity of it.

HUNTER BIDEN: And I mean it.

TUCKER CARLSON: No, no, I strongly agree. I mean, we’re here for a reason. And once you’re past— once you get out of debt, it’s like, what’s the point of accumulating money? I really feel that’s right.

HUNTER BIDEN: And that’s exactly the way I feel. Just get me out of the debt. And that’s the other thing people don’t— like, oh, you’re not— I mean, millions of dollars that I owe law firms and others. And yeah, anyway, so yeah, you know about that. Yeah.

Politics, Personal Change, and the Limits of the System

TUCKER CARLSON: But I wonder if— nothing you have said— you grew up in a very famous political family. I know you grew up in Delaware, but your world revolved around Washington. You went to school there, you lived there.

HUNTER BIDEN: Went to college there.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah, yeah, I went to college there. You know the political system really well. You’ve said nothing about it, basically. You haven’t suggested a political solution to any of this. I don’t think that’s an accident because I think there probably isn’t an immediate— I mean, you can make things better in the margins, but the problems that people face are mostly not political problems. Right. So I think that we overstate the importance of voting for this or that guy.

I mean, to me, that’s the lesson of Trump. I campaigned for the guy. There are things about him I still like. I don’t think he’s— he’s complicated like everybody is complicated. But it didn’t work. It didn’t work. It didn’t matter that you voted for him. You got the same thing that you were going to get if you voted for Kamala Harris. That’s my perspective on it.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah.

TUCKER CARLSON: And so what does that tell you? It tells you that you’re putting your faith in the wrong thing, which is in a political system, whereas there’s got to be a real solution that begins with changing people’s hearts. That’s what I think.

HUNTER BIDEN: Exactly, exactly. Because it comes from us. We’re trying to find the problem out there.

TUCKER CARLSON: Exactly.

HUNTER BIDEN: And it’s here.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah, we’re the problem. Yes, right. No, I’ve discovered that about myself.

HUNTER BIDEN: And so all the people out there that have such a problem with me sitting down with you or sitting down with Candace and like— and like, I didn’t— I’m not hard enough on you. You got to apologize for this and you got to do this. It’s like, you know what, f* them. Here’s my point. It starts with us.

I’m not going to ever change, Chuck. I can get into the whole debate about the Democratic Party and whether you’re going to label something Democratic Socialist this or that. You know what I think? I like people who believe in what they have a conviction about.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: And they’re honest about it. I totally agree. I don’t agree with everything that Zohran Mamdani does, but you know what? He has conviction, he has competence, and he balanced the budget. Crime is at a record low in New York right now. And regardless of what you think about him, from a political perspective, I don’t care if it’s Zohran Mamdani or Thomas Massie. And I don’t agree with 90% of the stuff that— well, I think I don’t, but I don’t think that matters in this moment in time. I don’t think any of those labels matter in time.

I want someone with the courage of their conviction, principles— but it all starts here. All starts here. And everybody else can nitpick around the labels that we apply to each other and all of the vitriol. And there has to be— I think there needs to be accountability for the people that are literally robbing us effing blind. And I think there will be accountability for that.

The AI Threat and the Future of Humanity

But my point is, in this moment, can we not all see that we are about to reach a point in the evolution of humanity that will be a larger step than in the entirety of the existence of this Earth. And so what does all of it matter if you have people that drive me crazy like Elon Musk and every other person that has a hand in what’s happening with AI right now, telling us that easily within the next 5 years, if they haven’t already done it, we’re going to reach AGI. And if we reach AGI, then we’re not more than a maximum of another 5 years, more likely 2 or 3, away from superintelligence.

And once that happens, we literally have taken a step in the evolution of humanity and of humankind. The largest singular step that will ever be taken. The exponential way in which things will advance from there is completely outside of our control. And the only thing that we can hope for is that we have leaders that have humanity’s best interest in mind. And I don’t know— why shouldn’t I say I don’t know? I do know. I think we have the exact wrong leadership at the moment.

TUCKER CARLSON: I totally agree. I vehemently— Do you know anybody in your life who you talk to who’s very excited about AI? Because I don’t. I don’t really know anyone who’s really for this. Where’s the constituency for this? It seems like the population doesn’t want it at all.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah, I don’t know why anyone would want it in the way that it’s being offered to us. Look, the thing I say is this. It’s not theirs. What they’re building is off the back of the output of all of humanity.

TUCKER CARLSON: I agree.

HUNTER BIDEN: It’s ours. It belongs to me. It belongs to me just as much as it belongs to a San Bushman in the Kalahari. It belongs to us. From the moment that there was a cave painting that was put into a digital database, and in context to the poetry of Shakespeare, to the book that you wrote, to my last podcast tape transcript— that is what AI is. It’s all of ours. Every scientific discovery, every single public dollar, all of it, we own it.

We somehow are going to make 5 or 6 individuals in this country trillionaires by allowing them to literally rob us of that and make it theirs and let them decide? Like, do you trust Sam Altman to decide the fate of humanity? Or any of them for that matter?

TUCKER CARLSON: I’ve done thousands of interviews over 35 years and never had the feeling of wanting to run out of a room more strongly than I had when I talked to Sam Altman.

HUNTER BIDEN: So he’s—

TUCKER CARLSON: —out of 350 million Americans, he’s probably 350 millionth of who I trust to control the future of humanity.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yet here we are, right? Yeah. Yet here we are. And you know what we’re doing? I’m supposed to hate Tucker Carlson, because he’s an anti-Semite and he’s this— I know you’re not, you’re not an anti-Semite. I’m 100% sure you’re not. Yeah, no, that’s my point. My point being is that if it’s anti-Semitic to point out that Bibi Netanyahu is evil incarnate, then you know what, I don’t know what to say to people anymore. I mean, all you have to do is just open your eyes. Just literally open your eyes, open your heart for one minute.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: And realize, you know, I—

TUCKER CARLSON: —it’s such an obvious lie. It’s like, who’s even intimidated by that anymore?

HUNTER BIDEN: My point is, how is it possible that they’re dividing us on things like that?

TUCKER CARLSON: I agree.

The Grip of Addiction: Alcohol, Social Media, and Suffering

HUNTER BIDEN: And I can tell you how it’s possible. It’s the distraction that is being created by a handful of individuals and the people that work for them to keep us divided through our algorithm. And as much as you’re not addicted to your phone because you’re not on social media and things like that, the vast, vast, vast majority of us are, myself included, is everyone has a pocket full of heroin and they access it. Literally 1,000 times a day.

TUCKER CARLSON: So you’re saying you got off crack and more impressively alcohol?

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. No, I’m not. I’m not that bad. All I’m saying is— But you’re not off your phone. No, no, I am. I’m very— I’m not nearly— I’m very wary of it. I’m very wary of anything like that. But what I’m trying to say to people is that I’m no better than anybody else. I look at my phone just as much as anybody else. I don’t feel that it is necessarily a problem. But what I do find is, for instance, is that you gravitate towards the negative things people say about you.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yes.

HUNTER BIDEN: Way more than you ever gravitated to the, to the beautiful things that people say about me.

TUCKER CARLSON: That is so true.

HUNTER BIDEN: So I’m on X, and the amazing thing was, is that I go on X and I start talking about addiction, but I also start talking about the absurdity of the moment that we live in and some of the players that are, that outsized characters in this morality tale we’re living through. And there’s these beautiful messages from people about their own struggle and their own addiction. And my sister, I showed my sister what you wrote about X, Y, or Z. And she said it gave her the strength to make it through one more day.

And these beautiful things where people would say, “Hey, I’m a 3-time Trump voter, but I just want to say, keep on keeping on, brother. I love you for your recovery. It gives me hope.” And there’s thousands of those messages.

But you know what happens is that the one that catches your eye, the one that says, “You’re, shut up, you crackhead pedophile, you know, you’re a criminal and you stole from—” like, it’s like— And it was a great lesson for me in the experience that everyone is having, not just on X, but across the board, in which we’re all being— and it’s purposeful.

The thing that I never fully believed until I read all the— this whistleblower is how intentional it is. And as long as we’re looking at each other, as long as we’re trying to find all of the things that are wrong with our life in the other, and by the way, whether it’s the other that’s the immigrant or whether it’s the other that’s our neighbor, is we’re not looking at ourselves and we’re not focused on the things that really matter. And one of the things that really matters is we better wake up, wake up to the way in which we’re being led by the nose and have to believe that we all hate each other.

Faith, Judgment, and the Wisdom of Suffering

TUCKER CARLSON: And it’s making us worse. I mean, there’s this, one of my favorite scenes in the Gospel of Luke is the parable that Jesus, the story that Jesus tells about the 2 men who go to pray at the temple. And one’s the Pharisee and one’s the tax collector. And the Pharisee looks over and says, “God, thank you for not making me that guy because he is a pig. He’s a sinner unlike, you know, a righteous, good person like me.”

And the tax collector who knows he’s a sinner because he’s a thief and he knows he’s a thief and everyone knows he’s a thief, doesn’t even look up. He can’t even look at God and he just says, “Have mercy on me.” And Jesus says, who is justified before God? It’s not the man who turns to the guy next to him and says, “I’m better than you.” It’s the man who knows that he’s not better than anybody. That’s the man who’s justified before God.

And I just feel like all of life is that story. When you stop looking at other people and being like, “You suck,” and look inside and realize that I suck. That’s where wisdom and peace come from.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. There’s a scene in the Gnostic Gospels, and I forget which is the Acts of— I forget, Acts of Philip or something. Anyway, have you ever read the Gnostic Gospels? And really, you got to. They’re a whole trove of Gospels. I mean, a lot of people would say that it’s heresy, but it’s the— and Emperor, you know, when Constantine unified the church under and declared Catholicism, Christianity, the state religion of Rome, they basically effectively chose 4 Gospels. And banned all the other ones.

And they found in, I forget the, in Nag Hammadi, these 2,000-year-old texts, which were the other Gospels written by Mary Magdalene and written by Philip and written by, and anyway, there’s part of one is this, is it says Jesus is speaking to the disciples and this is before, and he says, “Learn to suffer as I do.” And that is everything. That all wisdom comes through suffering.

TUCKER CARLSON: That is true.

HUNTER BIDEN: And in that suffering, you’re able to love. In that suffering, you’re able to see your— see the other. It’s the exact— exactly what you were saying in Luke. Is that, is being able to, not being the person casting judgment. Rather, and by the way, it doesn’t mean that you are without discretion. It simply means is that as much as I’m not going to— what is the— the idea of my empathy overwhelms my critical thinking.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yes.

HUNTER BIDEN: Is not that. I’m not talking about that. I’m talking about, however, is, if I can feel this strongly about what they’re doing to kids in detention centers in the United States of America, I can also feel just as strongly about, or have as much empathy for, someone who feels like they have been completely left out and without any options that are, you know, are living in Bethel, Maine, that feels that this country has completely let them down. And is looking for a hope, something, an object for their anger.

And I want to bring them into the fold. I want to be able to talk to them, those people that I think voted out of anger and that are still looking for someone to be their retribution.

Getting Off Alcohol: The Hardest Drug of All

TUCKER CARLSON: For people who are dependent on alcohol, which is a lot of people, I think you’re absolutely right to say it’s the scariest of all drugs because it’s the most insidious. It’s just ubiquitous everywhere. How do you get off it exactly? You said you got off crack in 3 days or something like that. Pretty cool.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah, well, that’s the thing, is it— how do you get off alcohol? Yeah, alcohol is the, and I mean this in this sense, and I have people push back on me, but alcohol is the most destructive drug that there is. Not just by virtue of the fact that it is as ubiquitous as it is, it physiologically impacts your body. It impacts every organ, every major organ, and in particular, every major pleasure center of your brain.

It’s the only drug other than benzodiazepines that you can die from withdrawal from. So everybody always does the Hollywood version of how horrible it is to come off of opiates, or cocaine. And the reality is it’s really painful and it’s uncomfortable and you think you may— are going to die, but, particularly as it relates to cocaine, it’s out of your system in 72 hours. There is no more physiological need for it. And you won’t die from withdrawing from it.

Alcohol, you’ll die. You’ll go into seizures. And it stays in your body, not just for 3 days, it stays in your body for at least 30, if not more. And you’ve created these neurotransmitters in your brain that it’s, your brain is still crying, 30, 60, 90 days later. Still crying for you to drink. And the worst part is all you got to do is walk out your door, and usually it’s not more than, particularly if you live in an urban environment, a quarter of a mile from wherever you—

TUCKER CARLSON: No one looks at you funny when you have a cocktail.

HUNTER BIDEN: No, exactly. And it’s encouraged. So, for me, it was hard, hard work. This time I didn’t— I’ve been to a number of rehabs, and in 2019, after I met Melissa and she said this ends, is that I started— I tapered. She had me taper.

TUCKER CARLSON: How did she know to do that?

HUNTER BIDEN: Got her to do it. Completely intuitive. And it was really, really incredible. And she tapered me. And then at one point it got really bad, and I had the true delirium tremens. And she called a doctor to come over.

TUCKER CARLSON: What’s that like?

HUNTER BIDEN: Literally the feeling that you, if you don’t remove yourself from your own body, that you’re going to die because you are. I mean, there’s the real potential of you dying from seizures. And it’s the most excruciating feeling that I’ve ever had of any kind of pain. And I’d gone through it before, but I had done it in a clinical environment in which they just usually use benzodiazepines to wean you that way. And so I had weaned enough, but not enough to stop that. And so I had to go through it.

TUCKER CARLSON: Where were you?

HUNTER BIDEN: Melissa had rented a house, this little house for us in the, you know, up in the hills. Hard to get to from anywhere. I couldn’t walk. She took my keys, she took my wallet, she took my phone, she erased every number from it that didn’t have the name Biden in it. She had to do the hardest thing for anyone that loves someone is for a period of time, she had to be my jailer and my nurse and literally nurse me back to life.

And it was incredibly intense at the beginning, 24/7 that you have to be there because you literally could, particularly with alcohol— not particularly, singularly with alcohol. You could die.

TUCKER CARLSON: How long did it take you to feel better?

HUNTER BIDEN: In that instance, 10 days before I could ever really eat anything and taste it.

TUCKER CARLSON: Actually?

Sobriety, Recovery, and Life After Conviction

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. And then you start to have this kind of everything is kind of grayscale, you know, for even after you get a little bit of a boost around 30 days, and then you try to ride that as long as possible.

But what happens in your brain is that somebody explained it to me this way, is that you have these little messengers that alcohol sends to your pleasure centers of your brain. And so the messengers, imagine them as little birds. In a normal person, the bird flies up to the birdhouse, and that’s your dopamine or whatever it is. And in a normal circumstance, like you have a happy experience and it sends 2 birds to live in the birdhouse. And the maximum that you’re supposed to ever have is like 10. It’s like the happiest.

What alcohol does is it sends 20 birds at a time. And so it creates 20 birdhouses. And then the next time you use it, you have to get to 30 birdhouses. And then it builds 40 birdhouses. Then there’s 1,000 birdhouses. And when you take the alcohol away, and you have a normal, happy experience, like a cup of coffee in the morning, it only sends 2 birds. And your brain says, there are 998 other birdhouses that you have to fill for me to feel normal. And you don’t have it. And there’s nothing in a normal experience that can possibly produce that except the drug.

And so your brain, the thing that you think that everyone, of course, has to believe is providing you with rational, logical information, is saying, “If you don’t get this, you’re going to die.” And in the case of alcohol, it means it. If you don’t get this, you’re going to die. And by the way, not only are you going to die, you’re going to feel like this for the rest of your life. So fix me.

And so your brain’s telling you, and so the first time that you face a trauma or an obstacle, or something good happens, your brain says, “I know how to make it better. I know how to fix it. I know how to make you not feel this way. I know how to make you not have this anxiety. I know how to make you not have this fear. We’ve done it before. Do it.”

And that is what alcohol at least did as it relates to me. But also, I’m positive the science of it is, anyway, to me, the most dangerous thing.

TUCKER CARLSON: I’ve lived it, and that’s an amazing description and an accurate one, I think. How do you stay sober for 7 years?

Staying Sober: Changing Everything

HUNTER BIDEN: Almost everything that I do is no longer with the idea that I am living on a knife’s edge. In the early days though, you really do have to protect yourself, not put yourself in positions of — people always say to me like, “Well, can I still go to the bar with my friends?” Well, no. Getting clean and sober is really easy. All you have to do is change everything.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yeah.

HUNTER BIDEN: And what I really mean by that is, don’t go back and put yourself in the same exact circumstances that you were in, where your same group of friends, if they are heavy drinkers, or your family — like, if you can’t go to Thanksgiving without everybody getting drunk, maybe don’t go to Thanksgiving this year if you’re trying to get sober.

But staying — I promise you, everybody, it gets not only easier, but there’s this thing in the program that I practice in which they call the promises, in which you will know and experience an ease by which life happens as you are able to live life on life’s terms. Like everything, it doesn’t fix everything. Look at me. 6 felony charges and 2 trials later, it didn’t solve anything. It didn’t solve all the consequences that I had to face.

But you know what? Can you imagine what my life would be like? I’d be dead. I’m 100% long dead if I had decided the only way to be able to fix this is to anesthetize myself. I mean, I would be long dead. And that’s what they were hoping. And I truly, truly do believe that.

I believe that they knew that the singular, what they perceived as my father’s Achilles heel, was his family. That regardless of what anybody says about Joe Biden, there was nothing more important to him than his family. And that he had just lost Beau. And I truly believe that they wanted me to relapse, which was equivalent to death. I’m almost positive they did.

The Toll of Political Life on Families

TUCKER CARLSON: What does that tell you about — I mean, why would — one thing I noticed just living in Georgetown as a kid and knowing a million people from political families is the families were all dealing with tragedies on a bigger scale than normal people. Like, there’s something about that environment that is really hard on families. And you see it in the most famous political families. They’re all — a lot of casualties.

HUNTER BIDEN: I don’t know. See, that’s one of the things that, well, number one is I really truly didn’t grow up in DC.

TUCKER CARLSON: Right?

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. And we really were in Delaware, which was different. But to your point, what I found is this — I lived it publicly. But, Tucker, what I found is that I was in a situation — I forget where I was — and a stranger, somebody driving me, told me a story about their life and their addiction, and that their brother was in jail and their father just got arrested, and addicts. And I think everybody has those stories. Everybody.

TUCKER CARLSON: That’s for sure.

HUNTER BIDEN: Except mine played out on the front page of the New York Post in a way that I literally don’t think it had for anybody, any political family ever. I mean, even the Kennedys, to the degree in which they — and I really mean that. Like, I mean, the total evisceration of anything, or even the notion that I deserved any privacy.

I mean, I really, like, I look at some people and I say, “Just put yourself in my shoes for one minute. On what level do you think that that was right?” I look at somebody like Miranda Devine, and just on what level — if that was Ivanka, and I’m not talking about like — just take her existing 20-year digital footprint, everything that she’s ever done. I guarantee you everybody has a nude. Everybody has a picture that they don’t want to see. Everybody has a text message out of context. Everybody has a voicemail they wish that they hadn’t left. Everybody has an email in which it doesn’t have the entirety of the email chain.

Like, you know how many conspiracy theories were born out of the fact that I wrote Buckley a recommendation to a school which you reminded me he didn’t get into? Like, out of context, you are able to do something, and how is that in any way fair? However, that’s what happened.

And what did your wife think? I mean, I was just thinking about, like, she’s like — talk about —

TUCKER CARLSON: She didn’t sign up for this.

His Wife Melissa: A Warrior

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah, like, talk about — yeah, she is so tough. She is a warrior. Amazing. She is absolutely amazing. I mean, look, there’s no way that I could even prepare for it, and this had been my life. None of it could I prepare for. The fact she didn’t run says everything that you need to know about her. Because the truth is that Bowie’s the ultimate upside. But she is one amazing person.

TUCKER CARLSON: What’s your plan? You’re on a path. It seems like you kind of moved into it sideways, maybe not with a plan, I don’t know, but you’re clearly moving in some direction. Where is that headed?

Plans for the Future: Recovery, Art, and Financial Reality

HUNTER BIDEN: I don’t know. And that’s one of the things — I know the things that I care about. I care about reaching people that are still sick and suffering. I really do. Because, by the way, not because I’m a hero, not because I’m some saint — you know why? Because it’s the most rewarding thing that I’ve ever done in my life. It gives me sustenance. It makes me feel good about myself. And I mean it. It makes it easier for me to make it through the day. And so it’s purely selfish.

And that’s one of the things about sobriety that I tell everybody — the ultimate goal is to get to the end. And particularly as it relates to the program that I practice, as you get to the end of the steps, the whole thing is so that you can be of service to somebody else. And not because you are sainted at the end and all of a sudden you’re Saint Francis walking among the forest. It’s because it’s the thing that saves you.

The only way to truly get out of yourself is to do for somebody else, and for me, the easiest is to find other people that have had the same similar experience. And it’s not like you have to look far. It’s around every single corner. There’s somebody. And that was the beautiful discovery that I had.

So there’s that. I want to reach a million people in recovery. I’ve created this thing at hunterbiden.com/recovery, in which, anonymously, for nothing other than to create a storyboard, a story core, people get to share their experience, strength, and hope. Because what helped save me was realizing I wasn’t alone.

And I want to write about it, and I’m going to put it on Substack, and part of it’s free and part of it’s subscription. And I want to continue to practice my art. And ultimately, at the end of the day, like anybody else, I want to have the financial security to be able to not constantly feel as if I have to make choices that I don’t want to have to make, like anybody else in their life.

TUCKER CARLSON: How close are you to financial security?

HUNTER BIDEN: I’m a million miles away. I’m several million miles away. Yeah, I am. My lawyers — Winston & Strawn — want their money. Yeah, it’s all legal bills. Tens of thousands of dollars? Oh no, millions of dollars. Millions. I don’t know exactly what it is. I think it’s between $4 and $6 million that Winston & Strawn says I owe them for my couple of convictions. Yeah, it’s a lot of money.

TUCKER CARLSON: How do you — how does that affect you?

Faith, Finances, and Finding a Way Forward

HUNTER BIDEN: I don’t know. I would hope that they— oh, how does it affect me? It affects me in this way, is that I have to find a sensible solution and a way through. I really am, I’ve wanted to avoid bankruptcy, because the road back from that is just so long, and I’m 56 years old. But I don’t allow it to consume me. You know what I mean? I really don’t. And I can’t.

It is, I don’t want it to be the principal motivating factor for everything I do because the truth of the matter is the mountain’s so, it’s such a long climb that I don’t see the solution to it right now. But one will present itself. And I think cooler heads will prevail, and I’ll be able to— I just have faith. I don’t know, man. I just have faith. Not blind faith. Just work hard.

I mean, sh*t, I’m really working my ass off. I mean, everybody says, oh, go get a job. I have 2 jobs. I have 2 jobs, and then on top of that, I have all of this that I’m trying to do, and then I’m, you know, a whole thing that I’ve been trying to build as it relates in that. I’m working my butt off and doing that.

You know, they took away my law license, which means that that avenue that I spent 25 years working towards to graduate from Yale Law School is not open to me right now. And so I have to, in many ways, reinvent myself, but not out of whole cloth. And spending the past 7 years, I’m really, really dedicated to my art. I’m really dedicated to the work of writing.

You know, you’re a brilliant writer and you know this better than anybody. It is a practice as much as an art. It’s a discipline as much as— absolutely right. And so I’ve been practicing that discipline since I wrote my first book. And so I have a lot to say and there’s ways to be able to do that now. And ways to be able to do that that I think it’s really important for me to be authentic about everything. There are also ways in which I can do it in which I hopefully can put food on the table.

On Faith and God

TUCKER CARLSON: Last question is about faith. How has this affected how you feel about God and changed your relationship?

HUNTER BIDEN: I don’t know whether I would say that it’s changed, but it is deep in my belief in whether you want to call it, I do, as God, is the absolute certainty of this. There is literally, in both the theological but also metaphysical sense, no distance between me and you or anyone. We are all literally connected. And that connection, that universal connection to everything, is what I refer to as God.

It’s us realizing that all of our fear is delusion, is being separated. It’s all the idea. And so my faith is in the fact that I know that there is not a sentient being that is not literally me. And I don’t know if that makes sense to you, but I truly believe that there has been a real thing in my life that has saved me time and time and time again, and that has taught me hard lessons, and that I believe I cannot explain by other than what I choose to call God.

TUCKER CARLSON: No question about that. And we do get glimpses of the connection between people, all people. I think that’s what we refer to as a transcendent moment, when we rise above all the things we’re concerned with and sort of look down just for a split second. But this happens to people throughout life, and you’re like, oh, wait a second. Yeah, you know, people are really connected to each other in a real way.

HUNTER BIDEN: Yeah. Yeah. And when you start to get honest with yourself, like really, really get honest with yourself, and I’m not talking about everybody has to go through what I went through to be able to get honest with themselves. I wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy.

But I think that there are spiritual practices that I did not either have the courage or the patience to endure. It’s not like I was moving to Rishikesh to sit in a cave and meditate for 7 years. Instead, what I got is a trial by fire. And like I said, the complete eradication of an ego, not by courage or conviction on my part, but by necessary choice to survive. I had to choose to either stay in bed or get out and live. And if I was going to live, I had to let go of that.

TUCKER CARLSON: Yes.

HUNTER BIDEN: And I did. And for now, today, it’s a beautiful, beautiful thing. It’s a beautiful thing. It doesn’t solve everything. It doesn’t solve my debt. It doesn’t solve my— you know, I still got to put on my pants like everybody else. And I still have to deal with a relationship that, like anybody else, and a family that I love, drives me crazy. I love everybody else. But I don’t have to live a lie.

TUCKER CARLSON: Hunter Biden, thank you very much.

HUNTER BIDEN: Thanks.

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